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fairline
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of the wing
Sep 2002
time: 05:16
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quote:
Fantastic idea. But which Red Front do you have in mind, Captain Nemo's RF 1.4 or RF 1.5, Colwyn's modification of the original?
Unfortunately, both scens have major loopholes and some serious shortcomings.
In RF 1.4, "Too many units" is a major problem. The event that creates 2 Partisans if a Red Army unit is killed allows a player, who takes maximum advantage of it, to finish world conquest in late 1942. Changing the T-34/76 slot in RULES to JS-2 at the beginning of Summer 1944 is a tremendous benefit to a player who has built a large number of cheap T-34's.
In RF 1.5, "Too many units" and the Partisan loophole have been fixed. The T-34/76 slot problem remains in the version I just downloaded from Spanish Civ Site.
The other problem with 1.5 is that the author strongly advocates that the Russians found new cities in Siberia, has positioned Labor Brigades to do so and suggests that this is necessary to win the scenario. I have tested this idea and found it 100% incorrect, expanding existing cities is much more efficient than hacking away at the Siberian bush. I had little trouble capturing Berlin in January '44. |
Agricola: I want if possible to stick with Nemo's original. I don't want to second-guess the man's thoughts on designing a scenario, and as has been seen with the host of very poor rip-offs of Exile's Imperialism 1870, I think a classic is best left untouched. Having said that, we're about to replace the graphics so who am I to say the text files shouldn't be changed on the basis of expert playtest comments from yourself.
What are people's thoughts here? I'm wary of messing with the scenario unless we get the unlikely approval of the Captain himself?
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Harry Tuttle
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of the Hoople Heads
Mar 2003
time: 00:16
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Well, given the improvements from Civ2 MGE to ToT I think it would be best to add a few things to the original. I think some of the events might need a look over, if only to see if something can be further realized.
If anything, I think that it is best to add, not really edit, Nemo's work. If an MGE event can be made more efficient by replacing it with a smaller ToT event, thereby freeing up event space while not changing playability, then I say do it.
Other respects, such as bugs, can be addressed, but I wouldn't go and change objectives. In other words, don't change the content of the story, just the book it's printed on.
The player in me wants to add and add to the game, but then again if we change it to drastically then it won't really be Nemo's Red Front anymore, now will it?
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Catfish
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Wollongong, Australia
Aug 2000
time: 14:16
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quote:
Originally posted by fairline
I do plan to create new 15-bit unit graphics and I'd like to use Catfish's superb ToT terrain for the summer terrain files, with his permission. |
No problem.
quote:
Originally posted by fairline
What are people's thoughts here? I'm wary of messing with the scenario unless we get the unlikely approval of the Captain himself? |
I think it should be OK without the permission of the original author providing it's a straight conversion with only technical modifications - to fix what is basically a flawed conversion process. Maybe you could include other changes in a Red Front modpack.
quote:
Originally posted by fairline
Before I have a go at converting RF1.4 with the Scotto converter, has anyone already done this? |
I converted RF nearly 2 years ago. The problem is that I've tampered with it since and didn't document the changes. Anyway, after reading the post in the other thread last night, I decided to reconvert it. The multiple files made it a large job and it took me a few hours.
The changes I've made are basically conversion fixes. However when faced with having to map the original sounds to units spread over 9 rules files, I thought, bugger that for a joke and ended up using the sounds and settings from my first conversion. As a result I believe there will be some difference in the sounds. If someone wants to rectify this then go for it.
Red Front 1.4 for Test of Time (1.27 Mb)
Sound Files (2.62 Mb) -> later (it took me 6 attempts to upload the main files to Apolyton; these can wait) Edit: Hey, worked first time.
Edit: Updated the main download. I noticed that I'd overlooked the fact that some of the Civilopedia entries for city improvements and wonders became truncated in the conversion. Remedied this by moving the large descriptions to the describe.txt file. Here's the link for the fix only: Pedia_Fix.zip
quote:
Originally posted by fairline
This is worrying Curt. Did you follow Catfish's notes on tweaks that need to be made to the sceanrio post-conversion? I think they're posted on his site. |
There are no such guides on my site. They're all hidden away in various forum threads.
quote:
Originally posted by curtsibling
I hope it may just be a bug in my rules, and not the conversion.
Catfish, Tech or Merc will know for sure. |
Not necessarily. I remember converting John Ellis' Bonaparte II scenario a long time ago. It crashed every time I opened the city @PRODUCTION box. The problem was definitely in the .scn file, but I never actually got around to nailing it. I'll take a look, anyway.
quote:
Originally posted by curtsibling
Meanwhile, I am off to Catfish's Cave (eek!) to see what wisdom awaits me there!
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Ha!
Last edited by Catfish on 06-03-2005 at 17:10
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Catfish
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Wollongong, Australia
Aug 2000
time: 14:16
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quote:
Originally posted by curtsibling
I found the posts on ToT conversion problems at CFC. |
It's not a very comprehensive list though. The list of fixes in Red Front is considerably larger (in the .zip file) and I suspect it'll grow if people start comparing the conversion to the original. For example, one thing I noticed last night is that there is no contact with other civs in the Foreign Minister screen. There is in the FW version.
quote:
Originally posted by curtsibling
I found that my scen works fine until I add the 'rules.txt' file in. |
Actually I meant that I may not necessarily have the answers – but it reads both ways. 
quote:
Originally posted by curtsibling
If you have the time or inclination, take a look at the rules zip file in the 'stamping out bugs' thread. |
I guess I'm too late on the scene. Good you got it sorted. 
quote:
Originally posted by fairline
Catfish - that's another one I owe you, cheers Your conversion has saved me a lot of time and head-scratching! |
I expect lots of tanks and planes and stuff in return.  That reminds me, there's something else I forgot about from a few weeks back:
Sorry, but it hasn't been touched since you asked me about it. Got to finish off the cities and fix some of the river connections. I'd better head back to the Cave.
quote:
Originally posted by fairline
Catfish: I've just read your ToT changes list; all that was well beyond the call of duty and I'm sure I'd have missed a lot of it had I converted RF myself. A big thanks for that, and we'll be sure to include this list of changes (and credits) in the final revision readme. |
If it's going to be done, then it might as well be done properly. I'm guessing that very few people would know about all of those CivConverter issues. A list of any changes should definitely be in the accompanying documentation. Anyway, if someone wants a straight conversion of RF (with the exception of some of the sounds), it's there. One thing I forgot to mention: you don't need to tamper with any of the sprites in the Original directory. All you need to do is deselect Animated Units in your Graphics Options. Simple. Interference from animated units would be negligible in any event.
BTW, in case you decide to change the icons for the units with hidden health bars, I've attached the source BMP files for the static sprites (for use with SpriteGen). Note that all but the required units have been removed to reduce the size of the output files.
quote:
Originally posted by AGRICOLA
I certainly understand and can't argue with your reluctance to change anything fundamental in the scen. It's just that you and others will be putting major work into upgrading the graphics and converting to TOT while three easily remedied, significant flaws remain in the scen. |
I guess that could be the Red Front Redux Deluxe version.
 Attachment: rfstaticbmps.zip
This has been downloaded 37 time(s).
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01-11-2004 23:12
Bit tricky that one, I know, as the guy gave up on civ years ago. If anyone knows how to contact him then please let me know.
This is worrying Curt. Did you follow Catfish's notes on tweaks that need to be made to the sceanrio post-conversion? I think they're posted on his site.
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