22-11-2004 21:49									#61
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Let's see if some legal genius from UK confirms this.

	22-11-2004 21:51									#62
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I thought the queen legally still had a lot of power

there is just a history of not using it (like she could theoretically fire every person in the army)

Jon Miller

	22-11-2004 21:56									#63
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller I thought the queen legally still had a lot of power there is just a history of not using it (like she could theoretically fire every person in the army)

Iirc, she also technically owns all of UK's land.

	22-11-2004 22:00									#64
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller I thought the queen legally still had a lot of power there is just a history of not using it (like she could theoretically fire every person in the army) Jon Miller

No, the Queen is a figurehead. She could refuse to sign legislation put in front of her by the PM, but she'd quickly find herself removed as monarch, and maybe not replaced.

	22-11-2004 22:04									#65
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara No, the Queen is a figurehead. She could refuse to sign legislation put in front of her by the PM, but she'd quickly find herself removed as monarch, and maybe not replaced.

Ok che, now you speak as if you've read this in some legal document; what was that document?

	22-11-2004 22:05									#66
	Remove this text

My comparative politics class. We looked at the governments of Great Britain, France, and Germany. Very interesting stuff.

	22-11-2004 22:11									#67
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara No, the Queen is a figurehead. She could refuse to sign legislation put in front of her by the PM, but she'd quickly find herself removed as monarch, and maybe not replaced.

True. But that means some action would have to be taken. It would not, legally, be just the Parlament saying that the monarchy was abolished.

Jon Miller

	22-11-2004 22:14									#68
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara My comparative politics class. We looked at the governments of Great Britain, France, and Germany. Very interesting stuff.

They teach you cool stuff. Still, I'd like to see how this would be practically implemented without a civil war.

	22-11-2004 22:22									#69
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi I have to concede this point to you, but I am curious as to what you believe qualifies as an atrocity on par with the Final Solution in Germany.

America's "Manifest Destiny".

	22-11-2004 22:26									#70
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller True. But that means some action would have to be taken. It would not, legally, be just the Parlament saying that the monarchy was abolished. Jon Miller

Well, that might be enough really- thought the firt step would be to put heavy pressure on the monarch to get them to abdicate. You could also hold a referrendum on becoming a Republic. That is really the MOST that would have to happen.

	22-11-2004 22:41									#71
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by Kidicious The economy was still on a downfall in 1930. In fact, that was one of the worst years.

Huh? growth in 1930 was 5.8%
Now admittedly growth in the period 1931-32 averaged only 0.4% (However this compares with an average growth rate of -6.4% for the OECD during that period)

quote: Originally posted by Kidicious It's the most amazing period of economic expansion in history.

It wasn't even Germany's most amazing economic expansion.

Between 1933 and 1943 GDP increased by an annual average of 5.9% (following 20 years when GDP stagnated - so a lot of slack was available to take up).
Whereas between 1953 and 1963 GDP increased by 6.2% a year (and this following a 20 year average of 1.9% growth, making for far less 'catch-up' potential)

quote: Originally posted by Saras They teach you cool stuff. Still, I'd like to see how this would be practically implemented without a civil war.

There was a civil war about it, in 1643-49.
Parliment's supremacy over the monarch was confirmed in the 'Glorious Revolution' of 1688 when the current monarch (Charles II) was deposed and parliment invited William of Orange (Statholder of the Netherlands) to take the throne.

	22-11-2004 23:00									#72
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Ned And, btw, Saddam's government was fascist. There is nothing about Saddam's government that is anything like the Republican Party which emphasizes individual liberty, free trade, democracy and human rights. I also think these skinhead share none of these values, so they are not right wing.

Slogans child.

	22-11-2004 23:32									#73
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara quote: Originally posted by Ned [q]Are both groups fascist? No. Skinheads have various range of ideologies, but they tend to lean left or are apolitical.

I think their major impulse in individualism combined with extreme libertarianism. If so, they lean right.

	22-11-2004 23:38									#74
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

What's wrong with fascism, che?

	22-11-2004 23:39									#75
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by VJ What's wrong with fascism, che?

Everything.

	22-11-2004 23:45									#76
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by our_man I'll agree with you that Saddam's government and the Republicans being similar is stretching the imagination a bit too much, but some points I'd like to quibble with: 1. Individual Liberty Hello? John Ashcroft? The Patriot Act? 2. Free Trade What about the steel tariff imposed in March 2002 - December 2003? 3. Democracy I'll give you this one - for now. 4. Human rights Guantanemo Bay. Abu Ghraib. A myriad of other abuses.

1) I mean freedom from all forms of prior restraint, particularly economic. The Patriot Act enhances individual liberty by keeping us safe from terrorists.

2) Agreed that the steel tarriffs were something that one would normally associate with the Dems. I saw a Kerry ad which attacked the steel tarriffs and said that they had harmed wages in the steel industry. I think even the most foolish of steelworkers could see through that crazy allegation.

4) Anyone check the party affilliation of those involved in the Abu Ghraib abuse? They seemed be heavily into S&M, prostitution and all forms of deviant sex. Does this sound Republican to you?

Guantanemo Bay? Why do you libs completely ignore the freeing of 45 million people from extreme abuse? Had Gore been in charge, he would have done nothing serious about either Afghanistan or Iraq. But I also agree that the more anti-American the thug, the better the treatment Gore would have given him or her. In fact, I think he would have given bin Laden a hero's welcome at the White House, handed the keys of America to him, and asked for his forgiveness for the abuses American has brought to the people of Islam. Next, at the direction of America's new imam, Gore would have nuked Israel.

	22-11-2004 23:46									#77
	Full PM-box? Change here!

The Republicans support democracy and human rights?

	22-11-2004 23:47									#78
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by problem_child Slogans child.

Well are they even fascist? They seem to be extreme libertarians.

	22-11-2004 23:48									#79
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by el freako Huh? growth in 1930 was 5.8% Now admittedly growth in the period 1931-32 averaged only 0.4% (However this compares with an average growth rate of -6.4% for the OECD during that period) It wasn't even Germany's most amazing economic expansion. Between 1933 and 1943 GDP increased by an annual average of 5.9% (following 20 years when GDP stagnated - so a lot of slack was available to take up).

Let's cut to the chase. What was the growth rate for each year between 1932 and 1938 Mr. Stats?

I have already agreed that there was plenty of slack to take up, because that only reinforces my point. The Nazis put people to work and made profit for the capitalists. For that I suspect that they recieved a lot of support from the people. That is until they made it obvious that they were going to try to take over Europe.

	22-11-2004 23:49									#80
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Odin The Republicans support democracy and human rights?

Why yes, Odin. The kind of democracy that brings the vote to 45 million people in the ME. The kind of human right that frees people from fascism.

No Democrat you could name would have done either. In fact, they would have gone out of their way to appease bin Laden, Mullah Omar and Saddam Hussein.

	22-11-2004 23:55									#81
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: The kind of democracy that brings the vote to 45 million people in the ME. The kind of human right that frees people from fascism. No Democrat you could name would have done either.

FDR.

quote: In fact, they would have gone out of their way to appease bin Laden, [..] and Saddam Hussein.

Ronald Reagan supported both.
William Clinton opposed both.

Well, that was surprisingly easy. Am I missing something here, Ned?

	22-11-2004 23:57									#82
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Ned 4) Anyone check the party affilliation of those involved in the Abu Ghraib abuse? They seemed be heavily into S&M, prostitution and all forms of deviant sex. Does this sound Republican to you?

what the hell does Abu Graib have anything to do with sex, deviant or otherwise? The scandal of Abu Graib was all about control and what better way to control a muslim prison population then through religious guilt. Especially when Arabs are more sensitive to the subject and more easily shamed then Americans are.It appears the abuse was used in an attempt to gather intelligence through blackmail, but regardless the methodology is purely republican religious right. After all, who but religious wingnuts try to control people through guilt about sex?

Also consider that the military, especially in the command enviroment, leans heavily to the republicans, and it was republicans who were ultimately in charge of military when these events happened.

	22-11-2004 23:58									#83
	Tired of ads?

1. Individual Liberty; nope, since they are against abortion and let religius nuts impose thier will on the individual.

2. Free Trade; nope, farm subsidies and corporate welfare are not free trade.

3. Democracy; nope, they installed puppet regimes in Iran, Nicaragua, Chile, Iraq (SADDAM!!!) etc.

4. Human rights, nope; Guantanomo bay, supporting dictators, party filled with southern racists.


Not looking too good, Neddy.

	23-11-2004 00:00									#84
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: The kind of democracy that brings the vote to 45 million people in the ME.

You mean the kind of democracy that isn't elected?

quote: In fact, they would have gone out of their way to appease bin Laden, Mullah Omar and Saddam Hussein.

Like Reagan?

	23-11-2004 00:02									#85
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by Ned In fact, I think he would have given bin Laden a hero's welcome at the White House, handed the keys of America to him, and asked for his forgiveness for the abuses American has brought to the people of Islam. Next, at the direction of America's new imam, Gore would have nuked Israel.

Dude, that was too over the top. If you pulled it back a tad, it would have been a much better troll.

	23-11-2004 00:04									#86
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

funny though

	23-11-2004 00:06									#87
	Got spare money?

quote: Guantanemo Bay? Why do you libs completely ignore the freeing of 45 million people from extreme abuse?

Just because you did one it doesn't excuse the other, and that's what you seem to be implying in the above statement. And 45 million? I'll concede that Afghanistan is better now than it was under the Taliban, but look at Iraq at the moment - it's still a shambles. No sooner had you crushed Fallujah than fighting broke out in Mosul! There's still a substantial amount of the Iraqi people suffering 'extreme abuse'.

Oh, and labelling me as a 'lib' isn't very accurate, and I don't think it helps when people (usually Republicans) resort to this label. I'm liberal in some aspects, but I'm easily as conservative as the Republican party on some issues e.g. abortion.

	23-11-2004 00:07									#88
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Ned is going deeper and deeper into his delusions, he needs to see a psycologist.

	23-11-2004 00:14									#89
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by VJ FDR.

The era of valiant Democrats died with the rise of McGovern. The party of FDR (foreign-policy-wise) no longer exists. Foreign policy liberals are now known as neocons.

Clinton did nothing at all serious about bin Laden during his watch. The recently retired CIA agent listed at least 10 different opportunities Clinton had to capture or kill bin Laden. Clinton took advantage of none of these opportunities for fear of alienating the Europeans and the Arabs.

	23-11-2004 00:16									#90
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Odin 1. Individual Liberty; nope, since they are against abortion and let religius nuts impose thier will on the individual. 2. Free Trade; nope, farm subsidies and corporate welfare are not free trade. 3. Democracy; nope, they installed puppet regimes in Iran, Nicaragua, Chile, Iraq (SADDAM!!!) etc. 4. Human rights, nope; Guantanomo bay, supporting dictators, party filled with southern racists. Not looking too good, Neddy.

This is just a bunch of hate-filled propaganda and deserves no serious response.