27-11-2004 01:05									#121
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

It is stupid to equate the practice of circumcision with ignorance.

	27-11-2004 01:06									#122
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Dissident as usual no one listens to me. I already told you that there is technology that can see underneath clothing and identify suspicious bulges such as weapons and bombs. The problem is people don't like the fact that an outline of their private parts can be seen. But surely this is better than being groped. And they can screen everyone, not just a random sampling.

Diss, how bout you admit that you're obsessed with the idea of seeing underneath peoples' clothing?

	27-11-2004 01:34									#123
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by MrFun It is stupid to equate the practice of circumcision with ignorance.

This is true, because the latter is the chief cause for the former...so it is wrong to equate the two.

	27-11-2004 02:47									#125
	Support Apolyton

Getting back to... whatever. I have no problem with profiling based on behavioral characteristics (like one way tickets, paid in cash, etc). However, when people talk about profiling they are almost always talking about lets get the Arab or lets get the black guy. It's declaring an ethnicity or race guilty before innocent.

And, I'd argue it violates the Equal Protection Clause of the Constitution. Race and ethnicities are protected classes and just because terrorists may be Arab Muslim males, doesn't mean that every Arab Muslim male is a terrorist, or should be treated as such.

	27-11-2004 02:56									#126
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Getting back to... whatever. I have no problem with profiling based on behavioral characteristics (like one way tickets, paid in cash, etc). However, when people talk about profiling they are almost always talking about lets get the Arab or lets get the black guy.

Well, really, it's just "Let's get the Arab".

	27-11-2004 02:58									#127
	Increase Your PM Length

You continue along a tangent that, while of great interest to you personally, has little to do with the thread subject at hand, which deals with people not liking the way body searches are performed.

I have to state again that people should be advised that they have a choice if they don't want to undergo a body screening. Nobody is forcing them on the damned flight.

	27-11-2004 03:02									#128
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: has little to do with the thread subject at hand, which deals with people not liking the way body searches are performed.

You've been long enough to know the term 'threadjack'.

quote: I have to state again that people should be advised that they have a choice if they don't want to undergo a body screening. Nobody is forcing them on the damned flight.

And I have to state again that people shouldn't have to be subject to molestation to get onto a flight.

What if the government said we may have to cut off one of your fingers before you get on the plane. They have a choice if they don't want the finger cut off. No one is forcing them on the plane!

	27-11-2004 03:05									#129
	Support Apolyton

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui What if the government said we may have to cut off one of your fingers before you get on the plane. They have a choice if they don't want the finger cut off. No one is forcing them on the plane!

And how do you propose this practice would be instituted as a means to help prevent the loss if lives to terrorist acts? Because that is what this is all about, you realise that don't you?

	27-11-2004 03:07									#130
	Got spare money?

And that really is one Hell of an annoying avatar you're sporting, not least considering the subject you're posting on here.

	27-11-2004 03:14									#131
	Got spare money?

quote: And how do you propose this practice would be instituted as a means to help prevent the loss if lives to terrorist acts? Because that is what this is all about, you realise that don't you?

There are far less humiliating ways to go about this. Like others have pointed out, the screeners seem to use it as a powertrip.

quote: And that really is one Hell of an annoying avatar you're sporting, not least considering the subject you're posting on here.

Deal with it. IOW, I don't give a damn what you think about my avatar.

	27-11-2004 03:25									#132
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Winston You continue along a tangent that, while of great interest to you personally, has little to do with the thread subject at hand, which deals with people not liking the way body searches are performed. I have to state again that people should be advised that they have a choice if they don't want to undergo a body screening. Nobody is forcing them on the damned flight.

Did you know there are people who fly for business rather than leisure?

	27-11-2004 03:28									#133
	Remove this text

Shocking MrFun!!

And the airlines would rather this rule not exist, but the TSA is shoving it down their throats.

	27-11-2004 03:30									#134
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Deal with it. IOW, I don't give a damn what you think about my avatar.

Nobody's forcing him to come to this site. By his logic, he has no right to complain.

	27-11-2004 03:35									#135
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Correct, Jaguar.

But then it falls on the poster who thought it was absolutely brilliant to pick such an image to represent himself, to deal with others possibly being turned off by his arguments on matters dealing with terrorism and how to prevent it.

	27-11-2004 03:38									#136
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Wow, you gave a thumbs up to my troll, which was supposed to annoy you. Now I don't know how to respond!

* Jaguar flees

	27-11-2004 03:52									#137
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi True, and it's a very good point. Which is why you search a few women, but not out of proportion to their likelihood to commit an attack.

No one ever said you stop searching everyone else. It simply means you focus your resources more towards the greatest threat and as that threat changes we move our resources. We don't have to have static tactics.

	27-11-2004 03:56									#138
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Sorry Jaguar.

How about sketching up something involving people's fingers getting chopped off.

	27-11-2004 04:16									#139
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

First, to Imrans avatar

This kind of groping is completely insane! In fact I think this whole hysteria about terrorists is disgusting. Its just an excuse by the establishment, particularly the US government to build up a real police state. What the US is doing at their airports is totally inexcusable ear marking of people and the fact that they consider anyone enterig their country a terrorist by default is the only reason that might keep me from ever going there. I hope it is possible to fly to Canada and then cross the border by land in order to avoid this kind of criminal behaviour by foreign officials.

I dont understand how this can be tolerated and why it is tolerated. Even in police states like former USSR, North Korea etc this kind of outrageous attack on individual privacy and freedom let alone the open hatred from the officials towards you as a foreigner would have been totally out of the question.

I say cavity search any US citizen entering the EU area. Make the US airlines pass on their passenger lists and private information about to any EU government who requests them. I will sware that no foreign officials will ever have my fingerprints, DNA or pictures taken.

Whats the next move from the US officials? Start to tattoo bar codes and numbers to every individual? Dont forget the GPS and under-the- skin bio chips.

The other *******s are of course the Australian officials. My parents were suspected to be illegal immigrants last year when they flew to Sydney to attend an international economist forum. Nowadays my dad gets pissed up from even having to remove his watch during the security check. And I admit it, its insulting.

Some people are willing to risk going to a plane with a terrorist rather than being humiliated by foreign official who would be easily bribed anyway by the terrorists. I'm one of those people. In fact I would love to make a scene at some airport security check in. My pride and the soveigrenity is one of the few things people have left in our current mad world, and its a damn good reason to fight or even die for!

	27-11-2004 05:08									#140
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

It would be nice if there was another way. I remember a while back they had developed technology through which they would be able to see if the person had a weapon or anything like that through X-rays: Only problem was the X-Ray scans also revealed naked images of the passengers.

It's may be an unpleasant thing for women to have some other woman patting them down with the back of their hands. But we absolutely cannot allow that discomfort to jeopardize the safety of everybody on board the plane. If we institute a "No searching private areas" rule, then terrorists would be able to sneak weapons or explosive on a plane with impunity by carrying them in their underwear.

Profiling would not be a solution for this. If we were to simply give white caucasian women a pass, all they would need to do is find one white caucasian convert to Islam to sneak on and they have guaranteed sucsess.

	27-11-2004 05:26									#141
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: I dont understand how this can be tolerated and why it is tolerated.

I can think of 2,792 reasons.

	27-11-2004 05:39									#142
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by MrFun Did you know there are people who fly for business rather than leisure?

Last I heard, the USA was still not the USSR - people are free to quit their jobs.

	27-11-2004 05:39									#143
	Increase Your PM Length

Ah yes, trading of freedom for security, away we go blissfully to the police state of the future United State.

	27-11-2004 05:43									#144
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I'd hit it!

Joking aside, what will it prevent?

The idea of using small knifes in airplane high-jacking is wasted forever. The moment of surprise is gone - it will never work again, not anywhere in the World. Before September 11 2001, there were dozens of high-jackings each year, by Arab Extremists, Russian Desperados and Afghanistan refugees, whatever - everyone had their own reason, and most of them just wanted to escape their native country. No one will ever use a fake hand grenade or a toy pistol again, ever. Even if the high-jacker geats the stuff on, the other passengers would resists violently at all costs, making it impossible to use fear as a weapon. Cutting the throath of the stewardess will never passify the crowd any more.

The serious terrorists will use other means. High-jacking is probably an obsolete tactic anyway. If I were Al Queda and had dozens of suicide bombers, I would use perfume bottles or similar small containers filled with liquid explosives. And detonators hidden inside balltip pens, disguised as ink refills. Those things would not be easy to detect in X-ray scanners, but would require dogs or chemical sniffers to find. If they sent 100 people on a simultaneous mission, perhaps 98 would make it and blow a plane off the sky within the same hour. The whole world's business would be stunned for months, even more than 3 years ago.

We don't need to look for knifes, we need to look for explosives- get the dogs out there!

	27-11-2004 05:53									#145
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Oerdin quote: I dont understand how this can be tolerated and why it is tolerated. I can think of 2,792 reasons.

Thats very nice. Would you perhaps like to share some of them?

	27-11-2004 06:00									#146
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

laurentius,

Here

Allow 15 seconds for page to load...

	27-11-2004 06:02									#147
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker Well, if they're rich, it's OK, isn't it?

Did I say that?

	27-11-2004 06:09									#148
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi There are times when one is justified to discriminate, and this is one of them.

No it isn't.

	27-11-2004 06:10									#149
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by Asher You, sir, Mr. McVeigh. You and your large duffle bag can come right on through, I need to get back to work to catching them terrists! You too, Mr. Reid!

Don't forget DB Cooper.

	27-11-2004 06:11									#150
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Ah yes, trading of freedom for security, away we go blissfully to the police state of the future United State.

What freedom has been taken away again? My freedom not to have to go through meaningful security before getting on a plane? Or was it my freedom not to lose a few minutes before getting on a plane?