09-12-2004 07:42									#1
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http://prisonplanet.com/articles/de...4nationalid.htm

Emergency Alert: National ID/Patriot Act 2 Legislation On Verge Of Passing

Prison Planet | December 7 2004

At approximately 3:30pm today, Ron Paul's press secretary Jeff Deist called Alex Jones to warn him that the legislation that encompasses the national ID card and Patriot Act 2 provisions was on the verge of passing the House tonight.

Deist stated that the bill and what it means for America could be described in a word as 'tyranny'.

Deist's tone was the most concerned that Alex had ever known in his years of communication with Ron Paul's office. Alex made it clear how upset Desit was and that the situation reminded him of a 'war room atmosphere'. Deist and Ron Paul are desperate to mobilize the alternative media before the bill reaches the Senate tomorrow.

There is still a chance that we can shoot down the national ID card provisions before the bill is passed in full.

Deist went on to exclaim his disbelief at how the so-called conservative Bush administration had betrayed America and how Paul's colleagues on Capitol Hill were blindly going along with this and doing whatever Bush tells them to do without question.

For the past two days mainstream news articles have talked of a 'compromise' which was made with the few dissenting voices and that the bill would be steamrolled through.

However, those articles fail to mention the very worst aspects of the bill, instead pitching it as a mere reformation of intelligence communication and protocol.

PLEASE CALL YOUR LOCAL CONGRESSIONAL OFFICE RIGHT NOW AND VOICE YOUR OPPOSITION TO THIS BILL.

The bill is S 2845 or 'intelligence reform' and the sub-section with the national ID card provisions is 7212.

Tell your congressman to get the federal mandates for standardized drivers licenses out of the bill.

According to Deist, the bill would not only introduce the national ID card, but make it mandatory to have a job as well as setting up internal checkpoints in the USA.

	09-12-2004 07:44									#2
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I'm looking for a less kooky source.

http://www.ala.org/ala/oif/ifissues/nationalid.htm
The American Library Association

	09-12-2004 07:53									#3
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prison planet dot com

	09-12-2004 07:56									#4
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Yeah. I should have looked before I lept. But the American Library Association is also reporting this is in there, and I doubt they're kooks.

	09-12-2004 08:00									#5
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Here's the bill:

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query...p/~c1081jV3we::

I don't know where that subsection is.

	09-12-2004 08:01									#6
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Stop worrying and learn to love the police state.

	09-12-2004 08:03									#7
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What's so wrong about a national ID card? I don't see it as that pressing of an issue, but I can certainly think of pros for it...

	09-12-2004 08:04									#8
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prison planet are kooks.....?! I just....please disregard the image I linked to in the 'Bush Says Pakistan is a Democracy' thread. I didn't know it was a crackpot site.

	09-12-2004 08:09									#9
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The meat of what the ACLU has to say on this:

quote: In one of the biggest disappointments, the compromise bill severely watered down a strong, independent review board designed to protect civil liberties. On one hand, lawmakers want to vastly increase the government’s power; on the other, they want to diminish oversight. The civil liberties board, as it currently stands, it little more than window dressing and a token nod to the freedoms that are an essential part of our society. The final bill also lays the foundation for a de facto national ID card. Opposition for the intrusive measure came from the ACLU and numerous groups across the political spectrum, including the American Conservative Union and the Free Congress Foundation. A national ID card is unproven to deter terrorism or weed out terrorists, but it would strip away our privacy and inch us closer to a ‘Big Brother’ society. Finally, the intelligence reform bill unnecessarily expands upon law enforcement powers - several of which were seen in the draft Patriot Act 2 - a measure so controversial, it was never considered by Congress. Specifically, it unnecessarily expands wiretapping to erase a key constitutional safeguard and expands the "guilt by association" material support law, including making mere membership in a designated terrorist organization a criminal offense for the first time. It should be remembered that the 9/11 Commission did not call for any of these provisions in its report.

http://www.aclu.org/SafeandFree/Saf...?ID=17168&c=206

Not that bad in the grand scheme of things (not as bad as Ron Paul's PR guy makes it out to be) - but still quite bad, and it's only going to get worse.

	09-12-2004 08:10									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten What's so wrong about a national ID card? I don't see it as that pressing of an issue, but I can certainly think of pros for it...

I'm against it. If this happens, I will move to a shack in Montana

	09-12-2004 08:13									#11
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quote: Originally posted by Seeker prison planet are kooks.....?! I just....please disregard the image I linked to in the 'Bush Says Pakistan is a Democracy' thread. I didn't know it was a crackpot site.

The image seems fine. but PP has stuff on his home page about the "mystery" of the plane hitting the pentagon, which sets off my warning bells.

edit: that was a different site. Look at the links at the top of PP. "Occult Elite, Nazi USA, etc." Seems kinda kooky to me.

	09-12-2004 08:15									#12
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Anybody want to guess what the GOP spin would have been if the Dems had tried to institute a National ID back when they had Congressional control?

	09-12-2004 08:19									#13
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Attention citizen 577-488-8321 Guevara, Chegitz!!!

Your thought patterns are not authorized! Cease them immediately or we'll send the boys round!!

	09-12-2004 08:20									#14
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Yay!!! Intestinators rule!!!

	09-12-2004 08:21									#15
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I won't get one...period.

	09-12-2004 08:22									#16
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You will get one, and you will love it!

Fortress 2 Roked!

	09-12-2004 08:24									#17
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Trading privacy for convenience.

Japher's right though. We'll get them and we'll like them. How many people do you know have discount cards for various chains? How much do you think marketing agencies know about you?

	09-12-2004 08:28									#18
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Trading privacy for convenience. Japher's right though. We'll get them and we'll like them. How many people do you know have discount cards for various chains? How much do you think marketing agencies know about you?

there's always Montana...

	09-12-2004 08:28									#19
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No I won't. I'll leave first. Why are Americans becoming such sheep? I am writing a check to the League of the South right now. They may be our only hope.

	09-12-2004 08:29									#20
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The League of the South? Why not the ACLU?

	09-12-2004 08:30									#21
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quote: Originally posted by PLATO Why are Americans becoming such sheep?

Becoming?

	09-12-2004 08:32									#22
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara The League of the South? Why not the ACLU?

Hmmm...

States rights and the protection of the rights of the majority or national oversight and protection of the minority at the cost of the majority ? Guess it just depends on which side of the fence you sit on. For me personally, the first one works better, although I acknowledge the great merit of the second.

	09-12-2004 08:32									#23
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Becoming?

Point.

	09-12-2004 08:33									#24
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http://www.prisonplanet.com/images/...104bilboard.jpg

"The image seems fine"

In that case....Ameicans, behold your leader! This is a real billboard from Very Large Corporation Clear Channel, found in several states.

Again, behold your Leader!

Just think about who Clear Channel is and why they would pay for such a disturbing ad.

	09-12-2004 08:41									#25
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quote: Originally posted by PLATO Hmmm... States rights and the protection of the rights of the majority or national oversight

I dunno. Anyone flying the Battle Flag of the Army of Northern Virginia scares me. I do not believe they have my best interest at heart.

quote: protection of the minority at the cost of the majority?

More like, protection of the minority from the majority. And, aside from the 2nd Amendment (which has several other organizations dedicated to defending it), their main focus is defending the Bill of Rights. Even right wingers like Phyllis Schalffly have come around to seeing the ACLU as important, after the USAPATRIOT ACT.

	09-12-2004 08:43									#26
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[obligatory Godwinization]



[/obligatory Godwinization]

	09-12-2004 08:44									#27
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Anyone remember the Onion where the ACLU defends the Klans right to burn down ACLU headquarters?

	09-12-2004 08:45									#28
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To protect civil liberties, the best groups are probably the ACLU and the Center for Constitutional Rights.

Not the "League of the South."

	09-12-2004 08:47									#29
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Even right wingers like Phyllis Schalffly have come around to seeing the ACLU as important, after the USAPATRIOT ACT.

I do see their value, but I also see things I don't support. I'm not against the ACLU. Your question was about choice. My choice to defend the ideals that I think are most important are better represented by States rights advocates. Not that I feel that others should agree...just my choice.

The nation could probably benefit from elements of both approaches.

	09-12-2004 08:48									#30
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo To protect civil liberties, the best groups are probably the ACLU and the Center for Constitutional Rights. Not the "League of the South."

I suppose it depends on which "civil liberties" you are talking about.