30-12-2004 15:39									#451
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quote: Originally posted by Chemical Ollie I'm not flaming, you are getting it all wrong.

I'm glad if I am. So carry on.

	30-12-2004 15:41									#452
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spare a thought for Burma - little or nothing has been heard of the suffering there and their government is too proud to ask for help.

	30-12-2004 16:13									#453
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People should stop being hypocrites. Swedes are the single largest group of people there, naturally after the locals. So Chemical Ollie being a Swede, he might be little closer to it than most of us. Potentially very similar situation to 9/11 in loss of human lives for Swedes. So I guess most of us *****ing about some comments IS over reacting if some other comments makes our panties on a twist. They won't make us hear about it in every media for the next 10 years, so how about some ****ing respect?


... it's kind of surrealistic in a way to go through a list.. I just went through a list of our MIAs, if there were anyone I knew. Fortunately, none so far. Except one singer, Aki Sirkesalo.

	30-12-2004 17:12									#454
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quote: Originally posted by Pekka Aki Sirkesalo.

Must... resist... temptation... to... joke about something... good... coming out of this...

	30-12-2004 17:20									#455
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You know I almost wrote that I KNOW the joke coming out of that one and it's not appreciated................ so resist!

	30-12-2004 17:30									#456
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The Swedish government has issued an order that all Swedish tourists must leave the area, even those who are there to find out the faith of their family members. While they can't legally force them to leave, they can refuse to give them help.

The government has also turned down an offer from 50 funeral agencies who wanted to go down there and assist. Funeral agencies are experienced in the hard work of taking care of corpses and support griefing families. Both services are urgently needed, but the government does not want them.

But what makes most people angry is the fact that it took the government 3 days to react, even though the traveling agencies asked for help on day one.

I guess some political heads will roll.

	30-12-2004 17:37									#457
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As they should.

In here few political heads should roll as well. Most of all our POS minister Tuominoja.... he has done nothing in his career except screw things up. Now he's doing it again. Late response of course like with you guys, and he claimed things like this 'No Finns in Phuket are in danger' early on. Excuse me?! Just turn on BBC and see it yourself! It's lkie the Iraqi dude saying murricans are not here.

Then he goes about stating that Khao Lak is OK, no one in danger in there. But our former minister and future presidential candidate and the VP of euro bank Niinistö was in there, hanging on a pole for his life with his sons. He was, as expected, pretty pissed off about this statement. THe reason why he made it: 'no one had called us saying there's a problem in there too'. What a ****ing idiot this guy is. He should be stoned.

	30-12-2004 17:45									#458
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quote: Originally posted by Pekka In here few political heads should roll as well. Most of all our POS minister Tuominoja.... he has done nothing in his career except screw things up. Now he's doing it again.

Couldn't agree more.

	30-12-2004 17:50									#459
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Pekka, this was a natural incident not caused by terrorists. Additionally, there are 3,000 Americans tourists missing in this too.

As far as the Swedish government goes, I hope heads do roll because it just shows gross incompetence.

	30-12-2004 18:37									#460
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quote: Swedes are the single largest group of people there, naturally after the locals. So Chemical Ollie being a Swede, he might be little closer to it than most of us.

I'm sorry but what exactly makes this different unless there are friends/relatives involved.
A lot of human beings died, that's all that matters and it should hurt all of us equally.
Why should I care more about what happened to any Belgians involved compared to any other nation? ( again, I'm not accounting for the fact that you/I might personally know a fellow country man out there)

	30-12-2004 18:44									#461
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114,000 are now reported dead. THis has taken a turn to the worst that I was fearing. I was hoping the death toll would stop rising but this keeps getting worse and worse. Indonesia itself reports 80,000 dead.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...n_re_as/tsunami

BANDA ACEH, Indonesia - The death toll from last weekend's earthquake-tsunami catastrophe rose to more than 114,000 on Thursday as Indonesia uncovered more and more dead from ravaged Sumatra island, where pilots dropped food to remote villages still unreached by rescue workers. A false alarm that new killer waves were about to hit sparked panic in India, Sri Lanka and Thailand.

	30-12-2004 18:58									#462
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alva, exactly. Can't you just shut up? Do you have to start arguing about meaningless stuff?

Gian, no my point was, when 9/11 happened, it was to be expected that people on the internet will post a lot, and people who are not affected by it should hold their tounge a bit for few days more. That's waht I meant. I wasn't so much comparing these two incidents.

	30-12-2004 19:18									#463
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quote: Originally posted by alva quote: Swedes are the single largest group of people there, naturally after the locals. So Chemical Ollie being a Swede, he might be little closer to it than most of us. I'm sorry but what exactly makes this different unless there are friends/relatives involved.

There are. At least 3 people I have close working relationships with are among the survivors. I just heard one of them lost her son.

	30-12-2004 19:23									#464
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Yhum since most didn't apparently get what I was saying is with the whole 9/11 thing is that everything said and done right after that incident is supposed to be thought as messages in crisis. SO, people who are not so close to it should bite their tongue if they feel a bit insulted by some comments. Because it's the wrong time to start flame wars. THAT was my message. This is similar case. Lot of people close to it, so we must bite our tongues now if we feel a bit uncertain about some comments. And what does it make any difference that there are lot of swedes? Well, I tell you the difference it makes. Not everyone of us is internationalist euronites, OK? 100 000, million, 10 million casualties, it's a horrible thing. If people amongst the gone ones include 0 Finns, 1000 Finns or 10 000 Finns, IT MAKES THE WORLD OF DIFFERENCE to ME. And lot of other people too in that situation. And if someone feels it's a bit hypocrite, well they are the ones who must bite their toungue now for a while. Because those people make arguments, what good does it make now? Except coming off as an *******. That's just basic respect. I'm overwhelmed that I even have to explain this on this board.

	30-12-2004 19:25									#465
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I still treat every loss as I would if Americans, Spanish or any other person would of died. Every one of the 114,000 confirmed dead is a human being.

	30-12-2004 19:32									#466
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I think it's quite natural to care more about people you know, than about people you never heard of. Every town in Sweden will have someone who died. Every school and large workplace will have a survivor to tell the horror stories. Every person knows someone who was there.

To make a comparison, you hear much more American griefing over the 1000 soldiers who was killed in Iraq, than you hear about the 100 000 or so Iraqis. (and don't jump on these numbers, the are not the point). It's natural to care more about your own nationals.

	30-12-2004 19:36									#467
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Well I care about the Iraqis that died (100,000 is an overblown number). I still grieve for them and the soldiers. But I know it was all worth it despite the sarcifice but this isn't the thread for it.

	30-12-2004 19:55									#468
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo but this isn't the thread for it.

Something I can agree with Giancarlo on...

To Everybody:
Enough with the trolling
Enough with using this thread to continue your personal political agendas
Enough with flaming

Show some respect for the dead. Show some respect for those who are concerned about love ones... Just show some DAMN RESPECT PERIOD!

This is an awful tragedy... go troll, throw around insults, further your damn political agendas SOMEWHERE ELSE!

	30-12-2004 19:58									#469
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A girl who is working in the same building as me is a Red Cross medic. She was away from work today to take care of people who landed at the airport. According to the local newspaper, they had infactions, open wounds and broken bones that needed treatment before the transportation to their home towns. In the plane of 266 passengers, ten family members were missing.

She has also started a fund raising campaign for the IRC at my job. I gave 300 kr (30€, 40$), in addition ot the 600 I already payed to the Unicef. A pathetic sum really, but all I could spare at the moment.

	30-12-2004 20:17									#470
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quote: Originally posted by Ming Something I can agree with Giancarlo on... To Everybody: Enough with the trolling Enough with using this thread to continue your personal political agendas Enough with flaming Show some respect for the dead. Show some respect for those who are concerned about love ones... Just show some DAMN RESPECT PERIOD! This is an awful tragedy... go troll, throw around insults, further your damn political agendas SOMEWHERE ELSE!

	30-12-2004 20:19									#471
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The Taiwanese space organisation (NSPO) has for free released sattelite pics of the disaster area (normal price 3.000 $).

They can be found at http://www.nspo.org.tw/e60/news/n931228.html - i haven't tried, the small ones are at 3 Mb and the large at 300 Mb

	30-12-2004 21:04									#472
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U.S. Navy as usual, saves the day

actually even one carrier and one expeditionary group along with hospital ships won't be able to do enough to counter this catastrophe. At best, they will be able to help a few medium sized towns directly.

Although the choppers could airdrop a lot of supplies. But that will take some time. And carriers do have limited number of supplies they can drop. People think carriers are self sustaining, but they need continuous resupply from other ships. I'm sure this will happen, but the supply ships will have to go to unaffected areas for resupply- such as Singapore (a frequent navy stopping point).

	30-12-2004 21:53									#473
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Swedish Governent has initially decided to give 500 Mkr ($75 M) in foreign aid, to be shared between the IRC, Unicef and other UN institutions and some Swedish civil defense organisations.

	30-12-2004 22:12									#474
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Sri Lanka added 3,000. The estimate is now over 120,000.

http://reuters.myway.com/article/20...S-QUAKE-DC.html

In other news, British citizens have given 23 million pounds in 24 hours, and that number has stayed steady.

http://www.thisislondon.com/news/ar...20Standard&ct=5

	30-12-2004 22:30									#475
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I donated 100 Euros together with my gf.
I wish everyone well.

	30-12-2004 22:43									#476
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Just got the news that the last of my missing friends have been located and are alright...

	30-12-2004 22:52									#477
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten Just got the news that the last of my missing friends have been located and are alright...

	30-12-2004 23:00									#478
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Atahualpa,

	30-12-2004 23:06									#479
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Several hundred of the missing Swedish charter tourist have turned up on the evacuation flights.

But the number of missing backpackers is still uncertain. Swedish Prime Minister admits that at least 1000 citizens could be dead, while only 44 bodies have been officially identified.

	30-12-2004 23:10									#480
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It's one of the few events that directly affects a significant amount of people in the West.

Monk's backpacker friend P. sent his last e-mail on December 15 saying he was on his way to Thailand, and I just learned that for a number of reasons, he was still in Cambodia when hell broke loose.

Had me worried for some time there. And I must say I symphatize with those who have yet to experience their loved ones reporting back that they're safe.