01-04-2005 21:38									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Odin Ford = Fix Or Repair Daily

or my other favorite...

Found On Road Dead

	01-04-2005 21:41									#32
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quote: Originally posted by Azazel Yeah, ford ain't all bad: I mean, they own Mazda, for example.

They dont OWN Mazda, they own PART of Mazda. 47% to be exact, so Mazda still has control over their production.

Spec.

	01-04-2005 21:42									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin Not surprisingly people in the know disagree with you. They make their living monitoring and comparing this stuff and Ward's Auto World (a trade publication for the Auto Industry) says some Ford engine's are amoung the best you can buy. http://subscribers.wardsauto.com/mi...=1004&siteid=26

Yes, for pick-ups.


Spec.

	01-04-2005 21:46									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Spec They dont OWN Mazda, they own PART of Mazda. 47% to be exact, so Mazda still has control over their production. Spec.

Sorry, but Japanese law says that any share holder who owns 33% of a company's shares has veto power. They can't force through their own plans but the can block anyone elses plans so that is a major amount of control.

In order to have total control of a company in Japan you must own 66% plus one share.

	01-04-2005 21:48									#35
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quote: Originally posted by Spec Yes, for pick-ups. Spec.

The claim made by Asher was that "Ford couldn't build an engine to save it's life" . Ward's auto says that Ford engine is one of the ten best on the market today.

	01-04-2005 22:03									#36
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I really don't care what they say, I know the truth.

	01-04-2005 22:10									#37
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quote: Originally posted by Asher I really don't care what they say, I know the truth.

Hmmm... a typical Asher response... ignore the facts and base his opinion on something he really knows nothing about

	01-04-2005 22:13									#38
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quote: They dont OWN Mazda, they own PART of Mazda. 47% to be exact, so Mazda still has control over their production. Spec

Mazda could have control over their production even if they were a wholly owned subsidiary.

	01-04-2005 22:27									#39
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quote: Originally posted by Azazel Mazda could have control over their production even if they were a wholly owned subsidiary.

Mazda has complete control over the design of their cars, it was part of Ford's "strategy" when they bought such a large share. Diversity in the line.

Ming: Fords are statistically less reliable and less fuel efficient than Toyotas, Hondas, and Mazdas. It's a fact, and one known by most people...

	01-04-2005 22:28									#40
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quote: Originally posted by Asher I really don't care what they say, I know the truth.

Translation: "I don't care what the facts are I'm going with my personal bias!"

	01-04-2005 22:31									#41
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I always go back to these fugly but informative charts...

http://www.autooninfo.net/Reliabili...ntranksFord.htm





Methadology: http://www.autooninfo.net/AutoonInfo/Methodology.htm

There are your facts, ladies and gentlemen. Now continue lecturing me about my personal bias.

What would that be, anyway? Is it my Japanese heritage that is forming my bias, or is it your American citizenship forming yours? Peculiar.

	01-04-2005 22:48									#42
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For FORD owners:

Fixed Or Rebuilt Dodge.

ACK!

	01-04-2005 22:52									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Tuberski For FORD owners: Fixed Or Rebuilt Dodge. ACK!

Dodge is worse:

	01-04-2005 22:53									#44
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I've got an old Ford which is pretty reliable actually.

	01-04-2005 22:53									#45
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quote: Originally posted by Asher There are your facts, ladies and gentlemen. Now continue lecturing me about my personal bias.

I will continue... since your "facts" are not engine specific, and that's the point of contention

	01-04-2005 22:55									#46
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quote: Originally posted by Ming I will continue... since your "facts" are not engine specific, and that's the point of contention

Then show me statistics about Ford's engine reliability from an unbiased source, like Consumer Reports (which the data above is from).

Plus you can draw some striking conclusions...the most reliable Ford vehicles have rebranded Mazda engines (ie, the Ranger). Coincidence?

	01-04-2005 22:59									#47
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin The claim made by Asher was that "Ford couldn't build an engine to save it's life" . Ward's auto says that Ford engine is one of the ten best on the market today.

Which engine is that?


Spec.

	01-04-2005 23:00									#48
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Wards is an unbiased source... and the link provided before shows one of their engines as being one of the best.

	01-04-2005 23:00									#49
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I'm leaning towards Asher on this one. More from personal experience than anything else.

My 1983 Toyota Corolla still zooms along wonderfully.

Which I got after my 1997 Chevy Cavalier finally got to unbearable to fix.

ACK!

	01-04-2005 23:02									#50
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A friend of mine from Calgary has had a 1985 Corolla for 3 years now, original engine, 450,000km on it. No problems...

This is with Canadian weather, as well.

	01-04-2005 23:02									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Ming Wards is an unbiased source... and the link provided before shows one of their engines as being one of the best.

Sure does, but I don't know of a lot of Diesel Toyotas or Mazdas........

ACK!

	01-04-2005 23:04									#52
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quote: Originally posted by Asher A friend of mine from Calgary has had a 1985 Corolla for 3 years now, original engine, 450,000km on it. No problems... This is with Canadian weather, as well.

Mine is uglier than crap but it runs smoothly with 200000 miles on it.

I did have to replace the original starter on it though.

ACK!

	01-04-2005 23:05									#53
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Toyotas are the number one selling cars in the world since last year.
I consider toyota to be the BEST reliable cars out there.


Spec.

	01-04-2005 23:06									#54
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Toyota Corolla is one tough mofo of a car.

Old Subarus also spring to mind. This is the car I want to have by my side in a post-apocalyptic future:

	01-04-2005 23:13									#55
	Re: Ford lies about fuel economy. Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by floppy_lobster ...Ford just made up the fuel economy....

quote: Originally posted by Ted Striker What's super ironic is that after Ford took over Jaguar, it went from one of the world's most unrelibable brands, to one THE most reliable brands. Go figure. Ford of all companies.

Recently a Jaguar which claimed a top speed of 200 MPH was tested at an emergency space shuttle landing site...

... it never topped over 176MPH and would have needed another 3 miles of track to hit it, let alone slow down.

Reliability isn't the only trait Ford have bequeathed Jaguar. Lying about performance figures is right up there.

	01-04-2005 23:22									#56
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i get about 12 miles per 50 grams of pasta out of my transport, and dont have to feel too guilty about polluting the atmosphere.

Well with 50 grams of beans its a different story

My old VW camper wasn't hugely economical, but i'd get about 30 mpg out of it if i didnt press the engine too hard(that meant sticking around 50 mph max!)

Edit: Is it beyond the realms of possibilities that in the USA(especially), big car companies and big oil might have done a deal?

Last edited by child of Thor on 01-04-2005 at 23:30

	02-04-2005 01:57									#57
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quote: Originally posted by Tuberski For FORD owners: Fixed Or Rebuilt Dodge. ACK!

Hmm... I always heard it as

Fu**ed Over Rebuilt Dodge

But I have 4 fords over the last 15 years and have really not had a lot of problems with them.

1 89 probe
1 99 Explorer
1 99 ranger
1 03 ranger (still own...he-he paid off even).

I do make a rule not to keep them for more than 80K miles.

	02-04-2005 02:17									#58
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my family has only had 1 Ford, and that was a company car ('96 Taurus) my mom had for about a year...

I drove it... not bad... but I like our Toyotas better.

'04 Highlander
'05 Prius
'99 Camry

We're probably going to trade in the Camry when the Highlander hybrids come out. The Highlander is awesome... it's powerful and luxurious. The Prius is the new hybrid and it gets about 40-45 MPG on average.

About Ford though... they aren't very good cars. The new Mustang is fugly. The Taurus is okay, but a Camry is better. Focus sux. Explorer sux. Expiditions are retarded and only *******s buy them. Excursion is for people who hate the environment. I don't even know any more Ford cars, but I'm sure they suck too.

	02-04-2005 02:43									#59
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quote: About Ford though... they aren't very good cars. The new Mustang is fugly. The Taurus is okay, but a Camry is better. Focus sux. Explorer sux. Expiditions are retarded and only *******s buy them. Excursion is for people who hate the environment. I don't even know any more Ford cars, but I'm sure they suck too.

The new Mustang is one of the best looking cars out there, and people know it, which is why Ford is increasing production to 192k units for 2005, which is a 70%+ increase from last year. The Taurus is plain and an underwhelming looking car (despite it's sales), which is why the Five Hundred was built. Your opinion on Explorers is in the minority, since it is the best selling SUV. Expeditions are a nice SUV, and of course many people buy them simply for a status symbol.

I agree completely with you on the Excursion, though.

	02-04-2005 03:04									#60
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all SUV's are crap. They are more unsafe than regular cars.

Our local newswoman just died when the suv rolled over. SUV rooves (roofs?) are prone to caving in.

And in California, there is a lawsuit against Ford because of the propensity of Ford Explorer roofs to cave in.