24-05-2005 08:21									#61
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quote: Originally posted by Maquiladora Whoever thought that "foot" in football meant "because theyre on foot", is an idiot.

Um... that's the historical basis of the term... so I guess the idiot, rather, is you .

	24-05-2005 08:34									#62
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So handmelon is just as much "football" as real football, and anyone who thinks otherwise is an idiot?

	24-05-2005 09:10									#64
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quote: Originally posted by Maquiladora So handmelon is just as much "football" as real football, and anyone who thinks otherwise is an idiot?

History is your friend.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...g=UTF8&v=glance

In answer to your question... American football (as well as Australian football and rugby football) is just as much "football" as Association football.

	24-05-2005 20:52									#66
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Imran is so clearly historically accurate about this that it seems a bit silly for anyone to be arguing with him.

Anyway, did anyone see Mourinho on TV last night in that BBC documentary? Great stuff.

	24-05-2005 21:28									#67
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More group 4 action. Everyone keeps on saying that France is in the drivers seat, but its really Ireland and Switzerland, who after we assume that the top four beat the bottom two, who will both have 15 points against France and Israels 14, AND will have 9 total points availalbe for them to get vs. only 6 for France and Israel.

Switzerland (15 points) 9 points available vs. France, Israel, Ireland
Ireland (15 points) 9 points available vs. France, Israel, Switzerland
France (14 points) 6 points available vs. Ireland, Switzerland
Israel (14 points) 6 points available vs. Ireland, Switzerland

IF
Switzerland ties all - 18 points
France - 15 points (3 points available)
Israel - 15 points (3 points available)
Ireland - 16 points (6 points available)

Three ties pretty much guarantees Switzerland at least 2nd place, depending on what Ireland does against France and Israel. If either France or Israel beat Ireland, then Switzerland will be the top seed of group 4 and automatically qualify on goal differential (+7)

IF
Switzerland WINS 1, TIES 2 - 20 points
France - 15 points (3 points available)
Israel - 14 points (3 points available)
Ireland - 16 points (6 points available)

Winning one game as opposed to none does not necessairly improve switzerlands position, since they hold the tiebreak advance. If Switzerland beats France or Israel, then they have a pretty good lock on second place due to goal differential. If instead of beating Israel, Switzerland beats Ireland, then Switzerland will lock up first place and be the winner of group 4.

IF
Switzerland WINS 1, TIES 1, LOSES 1 - 19 points
France - 17 points (3 points available)
Israel - 14 points (3 points available)
Ireland - 15 points (6 points available)

Even though this would give Switzerland more points, it makes them more vulnerable to not going on. If Switzerland beats Israel, ties Ireland and loses to France, they will only advance if Ireland does not win both of their matches. If Ireland ties both France and Israel, Switzerland is group winner. If Ireland beats Israel, and ties France, Switzerland takes second place by tie break. If Ireland loses to France, then Switzerland takes second place.

If Switzerland loses two matches, then they will not qualify. If they win two matches, they will win the group. I like our chances, more then I like Frances or Israels chances.

Ireland plays Israel on June 4th, so that will narrow down these options even more (and ireland will join France as having only 3 indirect points available, Israel will have no indirect points left, only direct points against switzerland)

Last edited by Lawrence of Arabia on 24-05-2005 at 21:46

	24-05-2005 21:56									#68
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui History is your friend. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...g=UTF8&v=glance In answer to your question... American football (as well as Australian football and rugby football) is just as much "football" as Association football.

Then, anyone alive today who thinks that "foot" in football should still mean "the players are on foot as opposed to horseback" is most likely a tosser (polo players included !).

	24-05-2005 22:31									#69
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quote: Originally posted by MikeH Anyway, did anyone see Mourinho on TV last night in that BBC documentary? Great stuff.

Naw... what did he say?

	25-05-2005 07:54									#70
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YES!!!! Marco Streller, the Swiss international who plays for Stuttgart has been called up to the team for the June 4th game vs. Faroe Islands. The 23 year old striker. now we've got a bunch of strikers, but one less defender, as Murat Hakan is not in shape enough to play, and his brother Hakan Yakin was not called up for this match because he failed to make 1st team at Galatasray (thats alright, they are both kinda old anyways, keep them fresh for later)
Tranquillo Barnetta is also back (from torn ACL against Israel last year)

Arsenals Phillipe Senderos and Totenhams Reto Ziegler will also both be called up (3rd cap each)

What an offensive powerhouse of a club weve got now:

Alex Frei Stade Rennes - 25 years old, 17 goals in 34 international matches, top scorer by a large margin (20 goals) in the French Ligue A. Striker.
Johan Vonlanthen PSV Eindhoven - 19 years old, youngest goal scorer in Euro Cup history. Striker/midfield
Marco Streller Stuttgart - 23 years old, 6 ft 5, key to Euro2004 qualification. Striker
Daniel Gygax FC Zurich - 24 years old, plays on the left side. wing/midfield

Then you add Phillipe Senderos in the back from Arsenal. And big Ben Huggle in the middle. no one can see us. You play a 4 - 3 - 1 - 2, have Gygax and Frei play with each other up front, bring Streller as the attacking midfielder to get those big headers in. or you can play it Frei/Streller up front, Vonlanthen as the attacking midfielder, and Gygax on the left side of the midfield. Put Huggle as central midfielder (he is also attack minded) with Senderos and Muller in the back.

you guys got no chance.

	25-05-2005 13:47									#71
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Naw... what did he say?

Some quotes are here. Did I post this before?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/foo...sea/4565127.stm

And while he has bonded with Ferguson his rapport with Wenger remains distant.


"I don't know him well, so I think it's not fair to speak about someone I don't know personally," added Mourinho.

"When he says he likes other Chelsea teams much more than our team I know why - because we are the champions. He preferred the other way when they were the champions.

"I didn't like Arsenal at the start of the season when they smashed everybody and I don't like them now when they beat Everton 7-0 and they win.

"But I liked them very much in the middle of the season when every weekend they lost points.

"I was in love with them then, so I can understand why Arsene doesn't like us."

	25-05-2005 15:21									#72
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4577621.stm



In short Malcom Glazer has to explain himself to the NFL governing body because they are very wary of any association with gambling and ManU has bookies in the ground (as do a lot of grounds these days) and apparently a link to Vegas casinos.

	25-05-2005 16:19									#73
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Didnt UEFA already confirm that Liverpool wouldnt be in the CL next season? I heard it on BBC this morning like it happened today.

Martin O'neill is also leaving Celtic to look after his wife who has cancer. Kind of weird its annouced now after they lost the title on the last day, as if had they won the title he might have stayed on. I dont think hes that kind of bloke but its weird.

	25-05-2005 16:30									#74
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I think he was announcing it after the season ended to allow the focus to be on the football.

Last I heard UEFAs official position was that it's up to the FA to decide - the UEFA rule says that if a country is normally allocated less than 4 places in the champions league it can get an extra place for the Champions League Winners to enter the next years competition if they don't qualify through the league but if a country already gets 4 slots (the maximum) then that county's assocation has to decide what happens.

The FA have confirmed that they will give the qualification slots to the top 4 finishers (see here ) but will lobby UEFA for a 5th slot. I believe that UEFA have said that they will not change the rules for next years competition. Which means (I think) that Liverpool wouldn't be in it even if they win.

	25-05-2005 16:41									#75
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You can have your *LIFE* on Liverpool being in the CL next year if they win it.

	25-05-2005 17:03									#76
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I don't see that there's any way it can happen.

The FA have said the top 4 qualify (quite right too, Everton deserve it) and UEFA have said they won't change the rules.

	25-05-2005 17:15									#77
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Everton will be in it, so will Liverpool if they win it.

	25-05-2005 17:42									#78
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I bet you they won't. I have just heard from another source that UEFA has confirmed we won't get an extra place even if Liverpool won.

If you still want to bet I suggest as a punishment the loser has to put

"I AM OFFICIALLY A LOSER! I was wrong about the Champions League Qualification and *winner's user name* was right"

with a link to this thread into their signature for one calendar month.

	25-05-2005 17:49									#79
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You're on!

	25-05-2005 18:18									#80
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http://www.soccerway.com/news/full/...area=1115330056

This seems to sum up the position

	25-05-2005 18:21									#81
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You'll have a few weeks after the final to watch UEFA gradually backtrack and let Liverpool in the CL. Remember where you read it first!

	25-05-2005 18:23									#82
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You have to win it first, difficult enough.

	25-05-2005 18:27									#83
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quote: Originally posted by MikeH You have to win it first, difficult enough.

true, i get a feeling both the FA and UEFA are hoping we'll lose so the 'problem' will go away!

	25-05-2005 18:29									#84
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I think the problem has gone away. Decisions made.

	25-05-2005 18:34									#85
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quote: Originally posted by MikeH I think the problem has gone away. Decisions made.

And i think your wrong, thats why were having this bet.

if you want a quick example of how 'flexible' UEFA can be, check out the conditions of Liverpools European ban after Heysel, then check out what actually happened.......

	25-05-2005 18:35									#86
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I'm sure that won't stop Liverpool crying like babies and blaming UEFA and the FA rather than blaming their manager and team for finishing much closer to the relegation zone than to the title and failing to qualify for the champions league despite needing a paltry 61 - the second worst points total for a 4th place seam in the Premier league ever.

The worst points total for a 4th place team in the Premiership ever being Liverpool's 60 points last season.

	25-05-2005 18:37									#87
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But I do still hope that Liverpool win.

	25-05-2005 18:40									#88
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The league position is irrelevant in this issue.

Last edited by reds4ever on 25-05-2005 at 18:49

	25-05-2005 18:51									#89
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That's true.

Still, in an alternate reality where Gerrard didn't score against Olympiakos this would be an awful season for Liverpool.

At least you get a good shot at the UEFA cup next season.

	25-05-2005 18:54									#90
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Oh, and before you call 61 points 'paltry'. check out your points totals before you whored yourselves to a Russian mafia boss.....

www.chelseafootballclub.net/historytable.htm