05-06-2005 12:16									#181
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quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker It's a BS argument anyway, since what you want is not going to happen no matter how well or often you demonstrate your point. Give it up.

Yeah, thanks for sharing. Not like I did not say that myself...

quote: Originally posted by Modo44 TechWis, this is no useful argument, and I knew it before it even started. People have different views of what constitutes a civ worth of this game.

TechWis, I will not convince you, and you can obviously not convince me. Me arguments are "moot" to you, but guess what, yours are just as "moot" to me. EOT.

	05-06-2005 12:19									#182
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By that reasoning we would be starting 4000BC with only China, Egypt, and maybe India.

	05-06-2005 12:19									#183
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It's not that people have different views. It's that America is in for reasons completely unrelated to its actual value as a civ and quite sufficient for Firaxis to keep putting it in until Civ 29007

	05-06-2005 12:26									#184
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quote: TechWis, I will not convince you, and you can obviously not convince me. Me arguments are "moot" to you, but guess what, yours are just as "moot" to me. EOT.

I said the argument is moot in consideration to the aspect of America originally being a colony, considering that is the nature of developing civs throughout history. Your argument, valid or invalid, is just as relevant as mine is, valid or invalid.

quote: By that reasoning we would be starting 4000BC with only China, Egypt, and maybe India.

Possibly some Mesopotamian culture as well. FUN!

	05-06-2005 12:27									#185
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It would be really cool if a nation could appear relatively late on the scene (perhaps due to a civil war or some such) and then quickly grow in power. It would add that extra element of suprise in a game.

	05-06-2005 13:27									#186
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278 By that reasoning we would be starting 4000BC with only China, Egypt, and maybe India.

Only if you consider cities to be the absolute requirement for a "civilization". There are many present-day civs that originated just as long ago, but were nomads for a long time (like Germany, or Russia, or Mongolia). The thing is, they had a culture, economy, and military long before building first settlements that could make archeological evidence. So no, to me there are not as few old civilizations as you think. And yes, I think those should be included in CIV, with all others being colonies gone loose, effects of civil war, or new civs just developing later.

This is what you call a personal opinion. I already said I know America will be in CIV, and I said why. I am just stating my point of view here. I accept you guys think different. Why can you not do the same for me?

	05-06-2005 13:35									#187
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I have no problem with you thinking differently. Our points of view are actually pretty close. Please extend the same courtesy to everyone else.

	05-06-2005 13:48									#188
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278 I have no problem with you thinking differently. Our points of view are actually pretty close. Please extend the same courtesy to everyone else.

Good point. Sorry.


What the discussion did was made me think what exactly I would like implemented in CIV. Thanks for that.

	05-06-2005 16:40									#189
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quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker It's a BS argument anyway, since what you want is not going to happen no matter how well or often you demonstrate your point. Give it up.

I don't suppose you ever played RoN

Edit: Mind you, we know for a fact the Americans are in Civ4, but for future Civ games, you never know...

	05-06-2005 18:24									#190
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quote: Originally posted by Locutus I don't suppose you ever played RoN Edit: Mind you, we know for a fact the Americans are in Civ4, but for future Civ games, you never know...

You never know, but one can always suspect...

	05-06-2005 18:57									#191
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quote: Originally posted by Locutus I don't suppose you ever played RoN

... which is not made by Sid. Yes, Bryan Reynolds, but not Sid.

	05-06-2005 20:26									#192
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Civ2-4 weren't made by Sid either, his involvement in the series has decreased with every incarnation...

	05-06-2005 20:52									#193
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It's still made by Sid

	06-06-2005 04:45									#194
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fresh from the pages of PC Gamer magazine pg 37, July issue

19 different civs, 28 leaders

	06-06-2005 05:00									#195
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I know Québec shouldn't be in as a civilization - just like Australia, Argentina, Mexico or Canada shouldn't be. But with the mods everything is gonna be possible.

	06-06-2005 10:53									#196
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quote: Originally posted by Platypus Rex fresh from the pages of PC Gamer magazine pg 37, July issue 19 different civs, 28 leaders

Considering Soren, Jesse AND Barry have all said 18 civs, 26 leaders in the last few weeks, I'm just gonna laugh at PC Gamer for being so far behind on the facts

Any other interesting stuff in the article though?

	06-06-2005 20:14									#197
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quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker It's still made by Sid

As long as his name's on it, it means it's got the Sid Seal of Approval.

	07-06-2005 04:36									#199
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quote: Originally posted by DerSchwarzfalke

Indeed.

	07-06-2005 17:54									#200
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we don't need offspring suddenly coming back to life. in my games, i always have a civ which is lame for most of the game (the one inhabiting australia, if i play world map is a good example) and then when i land musketmen and crusaders to collect some resource, they charge me with cavalry. it's not exactly a good description of the US scenario, but it proves we can have dormant parts of the world wake up and take charge at some point of the game

	07-06-2005 19:16									#201
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quote: Originally posted by Niptium I know Québec shouldn't be in as a civilization - just like Australia, Argentina, Mexico or Canada shouldn't be. But with the mods everything is gonna be possible.

Vive le Québec libre!

Oops, sorry. I'm not even a seperatist, what was I thinking?

Quebec could be in the game tho. We're the world's #1 source of Poutine... and Celine Dion memorabilia. That's important, right?

	07-06-2005 19:29									#202
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quote: Originally posted by Ninot Vive le Québec libre! Oops, sorry. I'm not even a seperatist, what was I thinking? Quebec could be in the game tho. We're the world's #1 source of Poutine... and Celine Dion memorabilia. That's important, right?

Nope, sorry.

Perhaps the world's #1 source of whiny separatists. I'm sorry.

	07-06-2005 22:34									#203
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Not even that. We have way more in the South.

	07-06-2005 22:39									#204
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Ahem...

So, how 'bout those Greeks, eh?

	07-06-2005 23:20									#205
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't Looks like they will be in after all, if the bullhead flag depicts the Greec civ.

	07-06-2005 23:25									#206
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quote: Originally posted by GeoModder 't Looks like they will be in after all, if the bullhead flag depicts the Greek civ.

I'm not especially hopeful...

	08-06-2005 06:30									#207
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quote: Originally posted by GeoModder 't Looks like they will be in after all, if the bullhead flag depicts the Greec civ.

Does this mean we can start whining that the Babylonians might not be in the game?

(Of all the civilizations, I never thought we'd be discussing the possiblilty of the Greeks or Babylonians possibly not being in the game. IMO, they're among the top 5 civs I figured would be in every version of Civilization.)

	08-06-2005 06:37									#208
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Ooh that'a comfort. Sayin' Québec's resumé getting shortened to Poutine and Céline Dion is like saying Canada is about bacon, mounted police and corrupt federal government !

....


Oh BUT IT IS !

Ok let's give the americans on that board a good old laugh ! Who's the Head of State of Canada ? Exactly that's right. Canada is one of the only country that none of the inhabitants of Canada can become it's head of state ! You have to be the Queen of another country to become the Head of state

Ok this has nothing to do with Civ 4 but I gotta poke fun at those Canadians here... Nothing personna;

	08-06-2005 06:37									#209
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quote: Originally posted by Ninot Vive le Québec libre! Oops, sorry. I'm not even a seperatist, what was I thinking? Quebec could be in the game tho. We're the world's #1 source of Poutine... and Celine Dion memorabilia. That's important, right?

Well, Quebec gets a lot of points for poutine, but you lose a few for Celine Dion.

	08-06-2005 06:47									#210
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quote: Originally posted by Xorbon Does this mean we can start whining that the Babylonians might not be in the game? (Of all the civilizations, I never thought we'd be discussing the possiblilty of the Greeks or Babylonians possibly not being in the game. IMO, they're among the top 5 civs I figured would be in every version of Civilization.)

Yeah. IMO, the always in Civ List was/is/might possibly remain:

"Modern:"
Americans
English
French
Germans
Russians
Chinese
Japanese
Indians

"Ancient:"
Greeks
Romans
Egyptians
Babylonians

"Token:"
Token Native American (Usually Aztecs)
Token African (Zulus/Malinese)