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BlackCat
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Hope DanS doesn't read this thread - he'll go bezerk with all this photographical evidence.
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Muad'Dib
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Of The Known Universe
Jan 1970
time: 05:24
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From No More Vietnams by Richard Nixon.
quote:
Our bombing provoked hysterical outbursts from our critics. A news magazine wrote that "civilized man will be horrified at the renewed spectacle of the world's mightiest air force mercilessly pounding a small Asian nation in an abuse of national power and disregard of humanitarian principleds." One newspaper wrote that it caused millions of Americans "to cringe in shame and to wonder at their President's very sanity." One columnist said the bombing was the action of "a maddened tyrant," and another stated that we had "loosed the holocaust." One senator said it was a "stone-age tactic." Another called it "the most murderous aerial bombardment in the history of the world" and "a policy of mass-murder that's being carried on in the name of the American people."
Seldom has so much heated rhetoric been so wrong. Our critics denounced our actions as the "Christmas carpet bombing." But they were wrong on both points: We did not bomb on Christmas day, and we never covered whole areas with a carpet of bombs, as had been the case with our bombing of German and Japanese cities during World War II. Our pilots struck only at specific military targets and had explicit orders to avoid collateral damage to civilian areas--even if this exposed them to greater risks.
Our critics should have known better than to make the utterly false accusation that we were indiscriminately bombing civilians. Hanoi at the time had put the number of civilian fatalities at between 1,300 and 1,600. Regrettable though these accidental losses were, they did not approach the death tolls that resulted when the Allies deliberately bombed civilian targets in World War II. Over 35,000 civilians were killed in the triple raid on Dresden, over 42,000 died in six nights of bombing in Hamburg, and over 83,000 Japanese were killed in just two days when we fire-bombed Tokyo in 1945. If we had targeted civilian areas during the December bombings, North Vietnamese losses would have been a hundred times higher than they were.
Our bombing achieved its purposes, Militarily, we had shattered North Vietnam's war making capacity. Politically, we had shattered Hanoi's will to continue the war. Admiral James Stockdale, one of our POWs who was awarded the Medal of Honor when he returned, later described the scene when the prisoners heard the explosions as the bombs began hitting their targets. He wrote that "cheers started to go up all over the cellblocks of that downtown prison. This was the new reality for Hanoi." He observed that the bombing took a heavy psychological toll on the enemy: "One look at any Vietnamese officer's face told the whole story. It telegraphed accommodation, hopelessness, remorse, fear. The shock was ther; our enemy's will was broken." Our POWs knew that they were coming home, even if our editorial writers did not.
Hanoi quickly accepted our first offer to resume the talks. We had forced Hanoi to come back to the negotiating table to end the war through a fair settlement. On January 8, 1973, when our highlevel negotiations reconvened, North Vietnam agreed to our basic terms within forty-eight hours. |
pages 157 & 158.
I suggest you dick heads read the rest of the book. It may actually enlighten you, but I doubt it, since you all are beyond enlightenment.
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Pekka
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em seu burro dos pais!
Feb 2002
time: 07:24
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Perhaps Zyklon B and concentration camps were .. well extermination camps. They were to serve in killing Jews, Gypsies, gays.. all kinds of folks, most notably Jewish people because they took the heavy casualties and suffering from it.
In Vietnam, it was more regular war. It's different to fight as a soldier in a war and being in camps, snuffing people with goal to kill as many as you can more efficiently than before.
Some might say there's no difference, but I think there's a big difference. To make a movie about war, yeah, well, Apocalypse Now is a great movie. And to say you are supposed to hate every moment is just kidding ourselves. Even in the moment of death and destruction, some people get high from it, and not all of them are insane. Fighting where it's more fighting than just executing people is different, and joking the other one is more stupid even though the ohter one is kind of stupid too.
Of course, if you watch Apocalypse Now without being America hater, you'd know that Lieutenant Colonel Bill Kilgore is a ****ing nut case in all respects of the word and is displayed as one. A person who has gone little crazy in the head. Or do you think that the surfing bit was to show they enjoy surfing in there? No. It was to point out he is not sane. In teh Redux, he actually flies his choppers around the jungle and uses loud speakers to get his surfing board back because they stole it from him. that's not exactly sane. That was the whole point. They were not idolizing him at all. Only haters would interpret it like that, and war masturbators. He was shown as kind of a cowboy rock'n'roll who is nuts. Kind of like when the dudes in Full Metal Jacket, the dude in the chopper shoots water buffalos and civilians for fun, and explains he is the baddets mother****er and makes jokes about killing women and children. The joke is pretty funny, in very sinister way, because it's totally absurd. The idea is again, to showcase the insanity of the situation. And in the end, where they sing mickey mouse, it wasn't to make it childrens movie or to make people laugh, or to make it more acceptable. It was the opposite.
If you feel that Apocalypse Now shows the war as fun, you should watch the entire movie. It shows exactly the opposite. It portrays the insanity.
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01-06-2005 22:52
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