22-07-2005 18:04									#91
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quote: Originally posted by Winston Heh, you have to wonder how long before the radical lefties start staging street protests demanding full human rights for bombers.

We'll do it right after we demand full human rights for you, so don't hold your breathe.

	22-07-2005 18:06									#92
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quote: Originally posted by Asher My whole point was it's telling that someone so antisocial will automatically assume that the police randomly shoot people for fun. Like che does.

How many people in Canada have been shot for pulling out their wallets or cell phones or "attacking police with a butter knife" while they were trapped in a chair unable to move? Gun plants are a well known tactic for when overzealous police accidentally shoot someone. I know it's in your nature, but really, stop trying to be such an ass.

	22-07-2005 18:09									#93
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara How many people in Canada have been shot for pulling out their wallets or cell phones or attacking police with a butter knife while they were trapped in a chair unable to move? Gun plants are a well known tactic for when overzealous police accidentally shoot someone. I know it's in your nature, but really, stop trying to be such an ass.

I'm not being an ass, che, you're the one being an ass. The boys in blue put their life on the line so people like you can try to live a peaceful one. Some make mistakes, they're human. Just be glad they have the balls to go out there and do something, rather than ***** about how evil those overzealous cops are while hunched over a keyboard on teh intarweb.

You need to respect by default. Doing otherwise is being an ass.

I respect by default, it's only when people make it clear that they don't deserve my respect (like you have just done), that they don't get it.

	22-07-2005 18:09									#94
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quote: Originally posted by Asher So a natural assumption is the British police just wanted to shoot someone without provocation.

"without provocation"? No, without justification. They would obviously have been provoked, since there where explosions going off, and it's not a stretch to think that a police officer in that situation might think he's judge dred.

	22-07-2005 18:10									#95
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If itīs a trade off between a dead suicide bomber (sic!) and a bunch of dead innocent commuters Iīll take the dead bomber every time. That was not my point. My point was that I donīt want the kind of fascist utopia that Asher and Winstonīs craving for...

	22-07-2005 18:12									#96
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quote: Originally posted by General Ludd "without porovication"? No, without justification. They would obviously be provoked, since there where explosions going off. It's not a stretch to think that a police officer in that situation might think he's judge dred.

Where is the lack of justification?

Your city has seen 8 subway bombing attempts in the past week by Islamic extremists.

You see a guy of Islamic origin with an excessively large, bulky jacket probably acting strangely, and you challenge him to open the jacket.

Instead, he bolts for the train.

The justification should be clear -- you usually aim for the torso to disable him, but when you suspect he's wearing explosives, that's probably not the best idea. So you tackle the guy -- but now what? You need to stop him from detonating, taking out half a dozen cops with him, plus passerbys...how do you do that?

	22-07-2005 18:13									#97
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You need to work more on your strawmen, loony.

	22-07-2005 18:14									#98
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quote: Originally posted by Dr Zoidberg My point was that I donīt want the kind of fascist utopia that Asher and Winstonīs craving for...

Oh, you know me, always craving that fascist utopia.

	22-07-2005 18:14									#99
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quote: Originally posted by Asher I'm not being an ass, che, you're the one being an ass. The boys in blue put their life on the line so people like you can try to live a peaceful one. Some make mistakes, they're human. Just be glad they have the balls to go out there and do something, rather than ***** about how evil those overzealous cops are while hunched over a keyboard on teh intarweb. You need to respect by default. Doing otherwise is being an ass. I respect by default, it's only when people make it clear that they don't deserve my respect (like you have just done), that they don't get it.

OMG, I think Iīm gonna puke. How can you be so...clueless?

	22-07-2005 18:17									#100
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quote: Originally posted by Dr Zoidberg OMG, I think Iīm gonna puke. How can you be so...clueless?

The irony, of course, was you and Ludd making judgements without all of the clues, such as the bomb belt the guy was carrying.

One might say this would've made you clueless.

	22-07-2005 18:17									#101
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quote: Originally posted by Winston You need to work more on your strawmen, loony.

My strawman is big enough, thank you very much!

	22-07-2005 18:19									#102
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OK, Iīm gonna drop this before it gets ugly. Unlike Asher I donīt wish for a standing reservation at the Mingapulco Inn...

	22-07-2005 18:20									#103
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quote: Originally posted by Winston Heh, you have to wonder how long before the radical lefties start staging street protests demanding full human rights for bombers.

Human rights is not a left-right issue... It's a universal right (and I don't care what the Chinese say about it being a "western" device, intended to meddle with their domestic affairs)...

Nor is it something you "earn" or "lose" depending on your actual behaviour (like a grade in school) during your lifetime...

Carolus

	22-07-2005 18:25									#104
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quote: Originally posted by Asher Where is the lack of justification? Your city has seen 8 subway bombing attempts in the past week by Islamic extremists. You see a guy of Islamic origin with an excessively large, bulky jacket probably acting strangely, and you challenge him to open the jacket. Instead, he bolts for the train. The justification should be clear -- you usually aim for the torso to disable him, but when you suspect he's wearing explosives, that's probably not the best idea. So you tackle the guy -- but now what? You need to stop him from detonating, taking out half a dozen cops with him, plus passerbys...how do you do that?

You have a hard time with context, don't you?

quote: There wasn't any mention about the possibility of an explosive belt when I read the article

quote: There was very little information in the article when I read it, all that was mentioned was that police where chasing someone, they tackled him, and then shot him. No specifics.

	22-07-2005 18:25									#105
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Of course it isn't a left-right issue. The radical lefties just haven't figured it out yet. But what else is new.

My post was meant as a provocation, BTW.

	22-07-2005 18:27									#106
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nm

	22-07-2005 18:27									#107
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quote: Originally posted by Asher You need to respect by default. Doing otherwise is being an ass.

I know too much about the police and have seen them in action too often to have respect for them. Just cuz you live in your little white bread world where nothing ever goes wrong doesn't mean down here on the ground the police don't act like bullies, thugs, etc.

I could tell you stories, but you won't listen so what's the point?

	22-07-2005 18:29									#108
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quote: Originally posted by Winston My post was meant as a provocation, BTW.

Well, it worked!

A sure-fire sign that I'm completely without inspiration (or discipline) at work... When I try to engage myself in the neverending debates at the OT...

Carolus

	22-07-2005 18:30									#109
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quote: Originally posted by Dr Zoidberg nm

Meaning?

Carolus

	22-07-2005 18:32									#110
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never mind

	22-07-2005 18:32									#111
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara I know too much about the police and have seen them in action too often to have respect for them. Just cuz you live in your little white bread world where nothing ever goes wrong doesn't mean down here on the ground the police don't act like bullies, thugs, etc. I could tell you stories, but you won't listen so what's the point?

Never said the police don't act like bullies, thugs, etc. Just that most of them don't, and you shouldn't paint them all with the same brush. They're human.

Something tells me you'd throw a big fit if, say, Ned was generalizing black people -- yet here you are generalizing cops.

Police officers are not thugs by default, you and Ludd need to brush off that antisocial part of your personality and move on.

	22-07-2005 18:33									#112
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Ah!

Thanks.

Carolus

	22-07-2005 18:33									#113
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quote: Originally posted by General Ludd You have a hard time with context, don't you?

Enough information was provided without knowing about the explosive belt.

The problem is you're not very insightful -- you're antisocial (I'm using this as a psychological term, not as an insult) and you jump to conclusions based on that.

	22-07-2005 18:35									#114
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Ah, don't diss yourself for debating in the OT, King Karl.

A level headed Swede is kind of a scarce ressource these days.

	22-07-2005 18:37									#115
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quote: Originally posted by Asher Never said the police don't act like bullies, thugs, etc. Just that most of them don't, and you shouldn't paint them all with the same brush. They're human.

Thugs aren't human?

Dude, I know too many cops for you to be trying to "educate" me. I've seen too much stuff, not even having to do with demonstrations or politis, but just walking home or waiting for a bus.

	22-07-2005 18:37									#116
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I agree with Asher

	22-07-2005 18:38									#117
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Dude, I know too many cops for you to be trying to "educate" me. I've seen too much stuff, not even having to do with demonstrations or politis, but just walking home or waiting for a bus.

Please explain.

	22-07-2005 18:39									#118
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor I agree with Asher

Bad commie.

	22-07-2005 18:39									#119
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Thugs aren't human? Dude, I know too many cops for you to be trying to "educate" me. I've seen too much stuff, not even having to do with demonstrations or politis, but just walking home or waiting for a bus.

Perhaps they treat you like sh*t because you make your disrespect for police in uniform so obvious?

I'd do the same if some punk like you didn't respect the life I put on the line to serve & protect.

	22-07-2005 18:40									#120
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Who said they treat me like ****. I'm scared of them, so I always do what they say, exactly they way they say it. I said I'd seen ****, not that **** happened to me.