29-08-2005 10:50									#1
	New Orleans and Global Warming Full PM-box? Change here!

Let's limit this thread to that particular discussion.

My piece:
While Global Warming is part of Earth's natural ebb and flow and there are questions about how much Humanity has influenced it, there is no way to prove or disprove that Human activities had anything to do with this hurricane. It's been known for a long time that this day would come. As I have said elsewhere, the city of New Orleans was living on borrowed time: A direct hit on the city was inevitable. That it is a C5 and not a C1 for instance is merely (very bad) luck of the draw. Humanity's presence and meddling in nature will be much more quantifiable in the toxic aftermath. Will this turn the heat up on the debate over Global Warming and environmental degredation in general? I certainly hope so, though it's probably much too late to avert the changes that are already occuring, regardless of whether they started with or without our influence.

	29-08-2005 10:56									#2
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Regardless if Global Warming caused this hurricane or not, this will totally put the question out there.

So yes, 100%, it's going to be a national issue. The fact that the damage was regional may or may not affect how long the strength of the national dialog lasts.

	29-08-2005 11:00									#3
	Full PM-box? Change here!

The one bright point in this otherwise horrific turn of events is that we probably won't have to hear about Cindy Sheehan any more.

	29-08-2005 11:03									#4
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Bush's trifecta +1?

Put a sock in it, Drake. No discussion of Iraq et al here.

	29-08-2005 11:05									#5
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I didn't mention Iraq.

	29-08-2005 11:08									#6
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Iraq et al

	29-08-2005 11:09									#7
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quote: Originally posted by DRoseDARs Bush's trifecta +1? Put a sock in it, Drake. No discussion of Iraq et al here.

Oooh oooh but can I point out that the Bush Administration has steadily cut New Orlean's funds for hurricane preparedness every year since 2001, including a $71 million dollar slash in next year's budget?

	29-08-2005 11:10									#8
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Yes you may.

	29-08-2005 11:11									#9
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own3d

	29-08-2005 11:17									#10
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Though, several thousand LA National Guardsmen who could have been stateside helping the evacuation and the cleanup are serving in a far away land, but that could have just as easily been true under different circumstances as well. So to be fair, let's not bother with that issue either.

	29-08-2005 12:40									#11
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What will Fred Phelps say about Gods role in this?

	29-08-2005 13:11									#12
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http://www.godhatesneworleans.com/

	29-08-2005 13:14									#13
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This has nothing to do with global warming. There were hurricanes long before global warming came about.

	29-08-2005 13:14									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Chemical Ollie What will Fred Phelps say about Gods role in this?

Hmm, there ARE alot of Fwench there...

One bright spot is that Fort Polk might be destroyed.

	29-08-2005 16:26									#15
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It is apparently going to hit Mississippi now and New Orleans won't be hit as bad as many predicted originally.

Going with the God thing, I might tell my evangelical, anti-Catholic ex girlfriend that God is saving the Catholics in New Orleans and attacking the Southern Baptists in Mississippi.

	29-08-2005 17:09									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Apocalypse Going with the God thing, I might tell my evangelical, anti-Catholic ex girlfriend

..................see, see? I've been telling people that people like that still exist around here for years but they wouldn't believe me.

	29-08-2005 17:51									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Dis This has nothing to do with global warming. There were hurricanes long before global warming came about.

global warming = warmer oceans = more hurricanes

	29-08-2005 18:25									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Dr Strangelove .................see, see? I've been telling people that people like that still exist around here for years but they wouldn't believe me.

It's pretty much a non-argument when you have many mission trips to South America to convert Catholics. Then they go around and accuse Catholics of not being evangelical enough because they don't send many missions to South America, even though there are large Catholic evangelical efforts in places like Southeast Asia and Africa.

	29-08-2005 18:46									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Sava global warming = warmer oceans = more hurricanes

= stronger hurricanes...

Can't be any simpler really.

	29-08-2005 18:49									#20
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Global warming 'has doubled storm threat'

quote: Tropical storms have doubled in destructive potential in the past 30 years because ocean surfaces have become warmer, according to a leading climate researcher...

Funny, I remember mentioning this cause and effect last year when all those hurricanes hit Florida one after the other...

	29-08-2005 18:49									#21
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I prefer the term Global Heating. I think it is a better description of what is going on.

	29-08-2005 18:52									#22
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heating

warming

eh?

	29-08-2005 18:54									#23
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quote: Originally posted by Dis This has nothing to do with global warming. There were hurricanes long before global warming came about.

Yeah, but there have been 11 named hurricanes so far this season. Usually there are 4 by now.

	29-08-2005 18:55									#24
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looks like CNN has caught on...

the poll on their webpage:

quote: Do you believe global warming is a factor behind the recent severe weather?

	29-08-2005 19:01									#25
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Global warming may pump up hurricane power

From the New Scientist...

So will New Orleans be the sacrificial cow that finally wakes up the US to the potential destructive effects of global warming by mankind's emissions into the atmosphere?

	29-08-2005 19:08									#26
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Don't think New Orleans will be completely destroyed. And the US government would rather pump a couple of billion into FEMA/aid after the effect than deal with the causes which might hurt the size of the dinners they get bought by the oil companies.

Oil over $70 a barrel, in what basically seems a continuous rising trend over the the last 6 months or so, might start pushing more and more Americans into more fuel efficient vehicles though.

	29-08-2005 19:09									#27
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Katrina isn't even the strongest hurricane to hit this area.

	29-08-2005 19:13									#28
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Global Warming models have been primarily static ones with temperature increases inserted inyto equations at or near equilibria. Global Heating implies a thoroughly dynamic model where it is the heat transfer terms that are allowed to dominate the equations. The math is much more difficult, but I believe science is far superior.

	29-08-2005 20:57									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Lancer Hmm, there ARE alot of Fwench there... One bright spot is that Fort Polk might be destroyed.

No, it will only make it worse for us poor bastards who have to go there from time to time.

	29-08-2005 21:08									#30
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New Orleans is sinking man and I don't wanna swim