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Elucidus
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Well I just ran a quick test game. It wasn't a straight game, but I reduced the requirements to nothing and reduced its cost to minimal. Built it and low and behold...Army does not show up for this city. Hurry and build another city and not army option...
Well, I am sorry about that. We will definately look into that. Thanks for the info.
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Cian McGuire
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Philadelphia, PA
Aug 2001
time: 00:16
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Dunno- I just noticed about 1500...
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GenTomGun
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No. The Army does not show up in the build queue. I know i have all requirements to be able to build the armies now. Really the only requirement you need besides of coarse the military acad., is an army already existing in your civ and that army be victourious in a battle, and i have done that?! Again, i dont know if i am missing another part in the mixture, or the reichstag wonder is not working properly, but i dont think that is it, the only thing its suppose to do is give you a military acadamy in every city right?, well it has done that in my game, the only other possiblity would be that the small wonder military acad...is broke!!!!! What do you think?
By the way...on up in the posts here...i posted my save game file....right when the reichstag is about to be built..i uploaded that file for people to d/l and test the reichstag ability w/me if they wanted to....maybe you can try it if you have time sometime to d/l that save game and see for yourself.
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Elucidus
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quote:
Originally posted by Cian McGuire
Dunno- I just noticed about 1500... |
Huh?
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mavmcleod
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Frankfurt/Main - Germany
Nov 2001
time: 06:16
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Thanks for your answer Elucidus ,
quote:
Originally posted by Elucidus
I believe we could extend the range of a battleship...never thought about it.
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What do you mean by "range"? You just mean the visual range or also the bombardment rang?
If it's possible to alter the visual range of the battleship it also makes sense to alter the visual range of the radar (!) artillery.
quote:
Originally posted by Elucidus
Also the carrier has radar, but how would you use an AWACS? Set it to Air Superiority, or would it's mere existance in a city or on a carrier activate it? Of course, what's to say you cannot add movement to air units. I've never tried but that might work.
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Well, didn't you add movement to the helicopter or was that in ancients mod (anyway I like your's more!)?
We would just need a new air unit called "AWACS" w/o bombardment and Air Superiority just w/ Relocate and Recon. Set range to perhaps 5 and visual range to at least 4 or 5.
quote:
Originally posted by Elucidus
As far as the small wonder I like the idea, for the most part, but again, currently no capability for it.
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I don't know if it's even possible. 
1. The AI would have to use it.
2. Subs shouldn't be shown (I don't know any satellite that's able to spot subs when dived - otos: perhaps some MAD-sat?).
[For all non-NAVY-fans: MAD = Magnetic-Anomaly-Detector;
But than we would have to distinguish between normal steel-subs (can be spotted by MAD) and titanium-subs (can't be spotted, 'cause titanium=not-magnetic).
- I see, have to get harpoon 4 again!]
I wish my day had 36 hours... 
Thanks for reading...
Maverick
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Elucidus
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Sorry, I had a bit of a headache yesterday, I guess from working on that civilopedia constantly for the last few days.
I meant to say visual range. I had a similar thought for the radar artillery. I am not sure about the helicopter movement, I'll check when I get home this afternoon.
Also I forgot about the recon mission. Thanks for pointing that out.
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Cian McGuire
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Philadelphia, PA
Aug 2001
time: 00:16
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Sorry, that was in reference to your question if it had been occuring all game...
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Cian McGuire
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Philadelphia, PA
Aug 2001
time: 00:16
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I've only ever gotten three leaders, one while playing this mod.
*shrugs*
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Elucidus
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quote:
Originally posted by Cian McGuire
Sorry, that was in reference to your question if it had been occuring all game... |
Oh sorry, you caught me a little off guard. That is weird then.
Oh yeah and GenTomGun,
It is the wonder. I guess we will need to disable it in 1.5 until we can figure out what is wrong with it. Sorry about that guys.
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Elucidus
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Double post...
Last edited by Elucidus on 29-11-2001 at 06:18
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WesW
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Florence, Al., USA
Jan 1970
time: 23:16
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I have attached the civ3mod bic with my changes made to it. You guys can look at it if you want to and put some or all of the changes into the next version that comes out. (If the rest of you want to play with it, that is fine too.  )
Before, I used the editor hack to edit the file, and I think this was the problem. Since I started using the original editor, I have not had any more crashes.
I made all the changes I mentioned in my earlier post- reduced free units for cities and metropolises; reduced the cost of the Forbidden Palace by 33%.
I also made all modern mechanized units "wheeled". I left out the zoc additions, but I would like to hear why you deleted this ability from some units.
I added a shield to the base value of Jungles and Mountains, and I decreased the time to clear jungles from 10 to 5. (Forests take 10 turns, but they also give you 10 shields, so I figured this was fair).
I gave Game a +1 production to go with the +1 food.
I made Ivory a strategic resource, and gave it a 120 apprearance setting (same as Salt Peter, and less than other resources). It is strategic to keep one civ from getting all of them, and it is required now to build War Elephants. They also occur in Jungles now, rather than Forests.
Speaking of units, I reduced the stats of Elephants from 4/3/2 to 3/3/1, reduced their cost from 70 to 30, and made them available with Horseback Riding. All this essentially moves them into an earlier period in history, where they belong. Too many UU's were available with Chivalry anyway. This is the only unit where I made major changes.
I made the Impi to 2 attack and 1 defend (Shaka didn't create an empire by defending).
I increased the Rider from 4/3 to 4/4 (only getting an increase in movement from 2 to 3 is pretty lame for a unique unit imo).
I decreased the Samurai's stats from 4/4 to 4/3, but I also decreased its cost from 70 to 50.
I increased the Panzer from 16/8 to 16/12, for the same reasons as the Rider.
I really don't think any of these changes are very controversial, except maybe for the Ivory. They may give you something to debate, anyway.
I just realized I forgot to change the Marine to 10/8, but I will leave that to your call. I also did not change the cost of any units or advances, since you are probably looking at that on your own as well.
 Attachment: civ3mod.zip
This has been downloaded 34 time(s).
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monkspider
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banned
Aug 2001
time: 23:16
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Hey Wesw, I'm pleased to report that most of your proposed changes will be in 1.5 anyway.
I made all the changes I mentioned in my earlier post- reduced free units for cities and metropolises; reduced the cost of the Forbidden Palace by 33%.
--I haven't reduced the free unit rates yet, but Forbidden palace is exactly a third cheaper now.
I also made all modern mechanized units "wheeled". I left out the zoc additions, but I would like to hear why you deleted this ability from some units.
-I am unsure what being "wheeled" entails, care to specify? sorry
I added a shield to the base value of Jungles and Mountains
-That's already in
, and I decreased the time to clear jungles from 10 to 5. (Forests take 10 turns, but they also give you 10 shields, so I figured this was fair).
-I like this idea, but Jungles were already reduced from 20 (!) turns (I believe) to 10. In any event, i hate Jungles but I may wait until we can give Jungles lumber bonuses.
I gave Game a +1 production to go with the +1 food.
-Fair enough
I made Ivory a strategic resource, and gave it a 120 apprearance setting (same as Salt Peter, and less than other resources). It is strategic to keep one civ from getting all of them, and it is required now to build War Elephants. They also occur in Jungles now, rather than Forests.
Speaking of units, I reduced the stats of Elephants from 4/3/2 to 3/3/1, reduced their cost from 70 to 30, and made them available with Horseback Riding. All this essentially moves them into an earlier period in history, where they belong. Too many UU's were available with Chivalry anyway. This is the only unit where I made major changes.
-This choice I must respectfully disagree with, I don't think the early game should be bogged down with too many resources when your ability to trade is limited
I made the Impi to 2 attack and 1 defend (Shaka didn't create an empire by defending).
-This is good in theory, but puts the Egyptian Chariots in a bind, since they are 2-1-2 as well, but more expensive than spearmen.
I increased the Rider from 4/3 to 4/4 (only getting an increase in movement from 2 to 3 is pretty lame for a unique unit imo).
I decreased the Samurai's stats from 4/4 to 4/3, but I also decreased its cost from 70 to 50.
I increased the Panzer from 16/8 to 16/12, for the same reasons as the Rider.
-I see no problems, I actually really like that Samurai idea. Consider it implemented.
I just realized I forgot to change the Marine to 10/8, but I will leave that to your call. I also did not change the cost of any units or advances, since you are probably looking at that on your own as well.
-Marine is already changed in 1.5
Thanks so much for taking the time to do this, I am very flattered to see your "artistic interpretation" of my mod Wes. Sorry about my inability to use the quote function very effectively
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Badtz Maru
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I did the same thing with Ivory in one of my mods (with some changes, I made War Elephants MORE powerful and gave them a bombard ability, just to do something neat) but I changed it back because I don't think the AI adjusted to it right - I played a game where I had a lot of Ivory and the Indians didn't, but it wouldn't allow me to trade it to them, it didn't even show up on my diplomacy screen as a strategic resource (though I got the message you get when you obtain a strategic resource when my workers built roads to it). I also decided that it wasn't really fair to have a strategic resource that only one civ could make use of - I was considering making the War Elephants available to everyone and figuring out some way of making it up to the Indians when I discovered it was buggy to change it.
I do like the idea of making the War Elephants 3.3.1 and available much earlier, though, I'll probably do that in my current mod.
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Elucidus
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Monkspider,
Jungles are 9 turns in the last file you sent me. And Mountains were 2 (+1 with mines). I think they should be +2 with mines personally.
Also Classless society was giving +2 pop instead of +1 when a city grows (the effect of longevity), as well as the described bonus. I don't think this was intentional, that's why I point it out.
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Elucidus
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Monkspider,
I am uploading the files for 1.5 now. You can download them and incorporate them with your bic. The civilopedia contains information for all of the changes/additions that I am aware of to date.
Let me know how things go and send me a copy of your newest bic file so I can ensure the latest and greatest info in the civilopedia. Also when do you think we will have a finalized 1.5 bic? I would like to post it to my website before I lose connectivity.
To everyone else,
As I noted above, I will be moving this weekend so will be out of touch for a while starting pretty soon. I wish I had more time in the last week or so to better playtest and balance version 1.5. I had limited time; I chose to work on the Civilopedia instead. I hope this was the right decision and that I did not let you guys down in that respect.
I am afraid we went a little crazy with this version, but we shall see. As always please feel free to send us your comments, suggestions, gripes, moans, etc...
Also when it is released...If you find something that seems broken. Check the civilopedia, under Game Concepts. You will see a section named Balancer Mod Version 1.5. This section lists all of the known issues and contact information.
I hope you enjoy it and have a good weekend.
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Elucidus
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The url I sent you is case specific. It should all be lower case.
All of the civilopedia entries need to be like this as far as capitalization: AAAA_Aaaaaaaa
This of course is only for new stuff that we have added.
I will probably include a version on the first or so line of the civiopedia to avoid any confusion. You don't need to make any changes to it if you only changed unit or terrain stats.
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Yaga
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Hrm...
Personally, I'm feeling inclined against government-specific Great Wonders:
- You must be in the gov't to build: if two civs discover, say Democracy on the same turn, and both then switch to Democracy in the hopes of building the Statue of Liberty, the civ with the Religious trait is only going to have one turn of anarchy, as opposed to a non-Religious Civ having two or three (or more) turns of anarchy. This effectivly gives the Religious civ a 2-3 turn head start on building the wonder.
- Switching out of a gov't doesn't negate the effects of the gov't specific wonder. Somehow I find the image of a Civ benefiting from a Classless Society, Statue of Liberty and Reichstag all at once to be a little too much...
- Presently, only the three modern gov'ts have their own wonder.
- The AI is programmed to "shun" specific gov'ts, meaning that while the human player playing the British may switch to Fasicm to build the Reichstag, the AI-controlled Britian, which shuns that Gov't, won't build it. At least, insofar as I understand 'shunning' in the game at present.
Mind you, I think they're a great idea, I just don't think that the current game code can support it. Personally, I believe that gov'ts should be able to build small wonders; a culture benefits greatly from its political past, regardless. More, I think each gov't should have it's own small wonder in order to balance the game more. Call me crazy, but unless I'm playing a Religious-trait Civ, I rarely switch from Republic to any modern gov't type - the game's just too close and I can't afford 3, 4 or 5 turns of anarchy when myself and the rest of the world discovers a Civ and all race to build the Wonder. (Which I probably won't get anyways...)
So I'd suggest having the Reichstag be a small wonder, probably one that either had a cumultive effect with Heroic Epic and/or addressed corruption; considering the propaganda machines of 40's Germany and Italy, and their deification of political figures, perhaps this would be appropriate?
As for the others
- How about "Royal Family" or "Summer Palace" for Monarchy (the raising of the Royal Linage to such high levels - increased luxuries? Increased trade? Happiness? Or hey, make the "Forbidden Palace" Monarchy only...
- "Roman Senate" for Republic - As the first representative gov't, the notion of a Republic did decrease corruption and provide many infrastructural improvements to Roman life. Would that it could provide a colosseum or courthouse to each city, but as that's not available, I'd again look at a small corruption benefit, or maybe some way to pay for units, increase worker productivity, etc.
- Ah, Despotism. It should have *something.* Afterall, it pretty much is the required gov't type for the whole of the first Age. Only thing I can think of is Xanadu, Kubla Khan's pleasure palace, or maybe Gilgamesh or Beowulf, a mini-heroic epic that expires with Monarchy?
You're smart kids, I'm sure you'll think of something
Actually, while I'm at it, a question about Wonders - Anyone know why you don't receive any culture from captured Wonders? In my present game I just captured Moscow, aquiring the Hanging Gardens and JS Bach's. While I get the Happy Faces, I don't receive any culture from them. At first I thought it was just because the city is in Resistance, but now the Resistance is over I still don't have culture from it. Built a temple, and I get culture from that. Captured Stalingrad, aquired the Lighthouse, same deal. Don't remember if this was in the original or not, or if it's a result of the modding. Any thoughts?
Looking forward to 1.5,
Yaga
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Elucidus
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Yaga,
You can move the gov specific wonders to another tech down the line. That would help it out pretty much. It would also balance out the fact that you just switched to a new government, you shouldn't be able to build a wonder right away that will help you enhance that government. Just my thoughts.
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WesW
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Florence, Al., USA
Jan 1970
time: 23:16
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Regarding Impi's: I just looked in the editor, and War Chariots cost 20, just like Impis and Spearmen. If you have changed the Chariot cost for the new version, I would recommend changing it back to 20.
As for Mountains, they still give +2 with mining, so that they give 4 shields when mined. I think this is fair since Hills give 3 shields and 1 food when mined.
Note: You may want to reduce the cost of Musketeers by 10, to 50.
Also, if a unit is wheeled, it cannot cross mountains or jungles without a road.
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gamecommander
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North Carolina
Nov 2001
time: 00:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Yaga
- Ah, Despotism. It should have *something.* Afterall, it pretty much is the required gov't type for the whole of the first Age. Only thing I can think of is Xanadu, Kubla Khan's pleasure palace, or maybe Gilgamesh or Beowulf, a mini-heroic epic that expires with Monarchy?
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I agree that despotism should get at least one gov-specific wonder. I cannot think of any specific structure that would work for this aside from Xanadu, as Yaga said. But, the wonder could be more of an event, like the "uniting of the clans" that was accomplished by Genghis Khan and attempted by William Wallace. That would offer some sort of Military and/or trade bonus I would say. Another possibility (maybe even as a gov-specific small wonder) is a sacrifice temple like the Aztecs and Mayans used. This could provide Military and/or happiness bonuses.
Keep up the good work guys!
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28-11-2001 09:34
I dont know if the miltary acad is broke in the game or if its the reichstag wonder that is in the mod causing the problem....has anyone built an army w/the military acad?????????? Also, someone tell me exactly what are the requirements you have to meet in order to build armies using the small wonder military acad...maybe i missing something etc.........................thanx
At least you don't have to change it each time you change the stats it gets those directly from the bic.
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