16-11-2001 07:32									#1
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What do you think should happen to President Dumbass, I mean George W. Bush, for his actions against civil liberties?

	16-11-2001 07:34									#2
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time should be reversed an Al Gore should be president. Then you should watch how many civil liberties we would have lost if this had happened to Gore.

	16-11-2001 07:37									#3
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I forgot my point. we have been losing civil liberties since the bill of rights was passed.

don't tell me this hasn't happened until recently.

This is the price we pay to live in a civilized world with modern conviences such as commercial air travel and open borders.

do what others do who don't like it, move to Montana in a shack. You will not be disturbed by the goverment there.

and you don't see the Amish people complaining. They still have the same liberities as they had before.

	16-11-2001 07:37									#4
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Oh I'll concede Gore wouldn't be any better - and the good things Bush has done (such as the tax cut and refusing to sign the Kyoto Treaty) wouldn't have happened...On the other hand, I'm not sure Gore would have convened military tribunals and started the beginnings of a military dictatorship...he certainly could have though. Pat Buchanan certainly would have, and would have gone further...only Harry Browne and Ralph Nader would have made appropriate and legal responses, especially Browne...I disagree with Nader on most issues but I think he'd act legally in this matter anyway.

	16-11-2001 07:37									#5
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you live in texas?

move to cuba and sniff some of castro's ass. see what the politics are like over there, moron.

	16-11-2001 07:39									#6
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Were you this angered over the passage of the Anti-Terrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act of 1996?

Re Military Tribunals: Do you believe that George Washington should have been assassinated for his use of them?

	16-11-2001 07:40									#7
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quote: do what other do who don't like it, move to Montana in a shack. You will not be disturbed by the goverment there.

Unless I try to purchase certain types of guns, or refuse to let my rights get flushed down the toilet.

quote: move to cuba and sniff some of castro's ass. see what the politics are like over there, moron.

Speaking of morons, no one is saying that Cuba is better than the US. What I'm saying is that losing civil liberties in this manner is unacceptable in any case...and yes, that even applies to World War 2 (speaking of which, if a President who followed the law/didn't provoke the Germans and Japanese was in the Oval Office then, we wouldn't have had 430,000 men die in another foreign war - we wouldn't have had any die).

	16-11-2001 07:40									#8
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the civil liberties crap is just a cover for an already lameass troll.

	16-11-2001 07:41									#9
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this isn't going to sound politically correct, but oh well

until we start seeing U.S. citizens being put on military tribunal with no trial, I wouldn't worry.

why is everyone so paranoid of the goverment? we all know goverments would never hurt us . sarcasm of course

remember folks, if we don't like it, we can overthrow the goverment. I have faith that the goverment will not turn into a military dictatorship.

It just will not happen.

	16-11-2001 07:41									#10
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quote: Were you this angered over the passage of the Anti-Terrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act of 1996?

No, in 1996 I was too much of a right-wing conservative to care about civil liberties.

quote: the civil liberties crap was a cover for an already lameass troll.

Since when do I troll?

	16-11-2001 07:43									#11
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Hehe you wannker your poll turned against you.

	16-11-2001 07:43									#12
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quote: remember folks, if we don't like it, we can overthrow the goverment.

Good point. That was part of the point of the 2nd Amendment.
.
.
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Oh, I forgot, the rights guaranteed by the 2nd Amendment aren't exactly guaranteed anymore. Can't have those pesky citizens owning guns and being able to help check the government, can we?

	16-11-2001 07:44									#13
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This thread seemed to have moved faster than I could have possibly added the extra text into my post. Oh, well.

	16-11-2001 07:45									#14
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quote: Since when do I troll?

since you started a two line thread calling george bush a dumbass and making an ignorant and already discussed crap eating remark.

	16-11-2001 07:45									#15
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How did my poll turn against me? Just because more Americans support Bush than oppose him, and just because most foreigners haven't voted yet, doesn't negate my poll - I posted my poll to get opinions and provoke debate, not to troll or incite or whatever.

And by the way, the number of votes against Bush in this poll FAR outweighs the number against him in real life polls, so I still don't see how my poll turned against me.

	16-11-2001 07:48									#16
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quote: Re Military Tribunals: Do you believe that George Washington should have been assassinated for his use of them?

Mr. Washington should have been called to full account for his actions against American citizens in certain situations - that would include military tribunals (if done at a time when they were illegal, ie when we had a Constitution) and other actions.

quote: since you started a two line thread calling george bush a dumbass and marking an ignorant and already discussed crap eating remark.

It's a forking poll...of course it's two lines! I've certainly posted more than 2 lines in each of my responses, eh? How is it trolling to have an honest opinion that disagree from the majority, or, more to the point, disagrees with you?

	16-11-2001 07:51									#17
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quote: How is it trolling to have an honest opinion that disagree from the majority

what opinion did you state, other than 'bush is a dumbass'?

	16-11-2001 07:53									#18
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What opinion did I state? Why not read the rest of my posts? Sure, the President Dumbass remark was a snipe at Bush, but that's certainly not the substantive part of my posts. Damn.

	16-11-2001 07:56									#19
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quote: What opinion did I state? Why not read the rest of my posts? Sure, the President Dumbass remark was a snipe at Bush, but that's certainly not the substantive part of my posts. Damn.

right, let's hang that republican bastard.

	16-11-2001 07:56									#20
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Well very few people agree with you, thats my point.

	16-11-2001 07:58									#21
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Wiglaf -

quote: move to cuba and sniff some of castro's ass. see what the politics are like over there, moron

Why is someone a "moron" for opposing the destruction of more of our freedoms and civil liberties?

	16-11-2001 07:58									#22
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Wiglaf are you getting paid for this or summit?

	16-11-2001 07:58									#23
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quote: right, let's hang that republican bastard. [/quotes] Your words, not mine...I'd be careful saying stuff like that, though, unless you want the American Gestapo after you... [quote]Well very few people agree with you, thats my point.

More than you might think, especially in the international community, as do about a third of those who have already voted in this poll, and only a few think he should be re-elected because of his actions here. Hardly "very few people agreeing with me", eh?

	16-11-2001 07:59									#24
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You anarchist commie. "Civil liberties" What a joke, that kinda thing dont exist. If you wanna have the right to partyyyyy and drink booze all the time, go live in Germany.

	16-11-2001 07:59									#25
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it's in the way it was worded.

his initial post was pretty blatant.

	16-11-2001 07:59									#26
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David, I have a few questions/ points:

1) Re Wiglaf: The ignore feature will save you a lot of grief.

2) What other actions by Mr. Washington do you find objectionable? Not looking for a debate on the subject, I'm just interested in hearing more of your POV on the subject.

3) Is there a President that you do like/admire?

4) Are you part of any militia groups or is that too personal a question?

5) Why don't you have ICQ?

	16-11-2001 08:00									#27
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like I said, its no time to worry yet. but just keep a watchful eye

and I still have my guns, don't know about you. I'm prepared to take on a tank with them . as we all know that won't be necessary as in the case of a necessary revolution the military will desert anyways (freedom of speech allows this- the military won't support that sort of goverment). Sh1t our military is about to desert right now for having to fight afghanistan people . Our military isn't what it used to be.

	16-11-2001 08:03									#28
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quote: 1) Re Wiglaf: The ignore feature will save you a lot of grief.

I don't use that garbage, it's anti intellectual. why pass up the chance to expose someone for the rambling idiot they are?

	16-11-2001 08:05									#29
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quote: You anarchist commie. "Civil liberties" What a joke, that kinda thing dont exist. If you wanna have the right to partyyyyy and drink booze all the time, go live in Germany.

Funny. I thought you were a Libertarian. Or so you said in the other thread. Guess not, eh?

quote: 2) What other actions by Mr. Washington do you find objectionable? Not looking for a debate on the subject, I'm just interested in hearing more of your POV on the subject.

Well it seems that putting down the Whiskey Rebellion was a bit hypocritical on his part, eh?

quote: 3) Is there a President that you do like/admire?

Well, Coolidge was pretty good in that he didn't do much...Truman was honest although I didn't agree with a thing he did...ummm...there are good points about Jefferson, agree more than disagree with him, outside of those, very few...

quote: 4) Are you part of any militia groups or is that too personal a question?

It would be if I was in one

quote: 5) Why don't you have ICQ?

I do have ICQ, I just don't use it...AIM and MSN are much easier for me to use, don't like ICQ much.

	16-11-2001 08:08									#30
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quote: I don't use that garbage, it's anti intellectual. why pass up the chance to expose someone for the rambling idiot they are?

The only rambling idiot I see is the one using ad hominems instead of counter arguments.

quote: and I still have my guns, don't know about you. I'm prepared to take on a tank with them

Before you laugh, if you can defeat a tank's supporting infantry, then defeating the tanks themselves is not a problem...tanks without infantry support just do not survive long. And if you can lure a tank into an urban environment, it's gonna be doubly dead...don't believe me? Ask someone like MtG, he should back me up on that.