08-04-2002 17:43									#1
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quote: A lesbian couple in the US have provoked strong criticism by deliberately choosing to have a deaf baby. Sharon Duchesneau and Candy McCullough, who have both been deaf since birth, were turned down by a series of sperm banks they approached looking for a donor suffering from congenital deafness. The couple, who have been together for eight years, then approached a family friend who was totally deaf, and had five generations of deafness in his family. He donated sperm which was used to impregnate Sharon Duchesneau. Baby Gauvin McCullough is now four-months-old, and has a slight amount of hearing in one ear

	08-04-2002 17:44									#2
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/he...000/1916462.stm

They should be imprisoned.

	08-04-2002 17:56									#3
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"They should be imprisoned."

Why?

	08-04-2002 18:08									#4
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quote: Originally posted by -=Vagrant=- "They should be imprisoned." Why?

	08-04-2002 18:20									#5
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quote: Originally posted by -=Vagrant=- "They should be imprisoned." Why?

For bringing a baby into the world at a deliberate disadvantage. This is just atrocious. It's like cutting off your baby's arm as soon as it's born or blinding it. Just ridiculous and sick. This just shows you what gay parents get up to, appaling

	08-04-2002 18:28									#6
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bod , you need to go retake reading 1 again.
this has nothing to do with their sexuality.
its because they are both DEAF also.

	08-04-2002 18:46									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Boddington's

And that is your final word on this matter?

	08-04-2002 18:48									#8
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quote: Originally posted by SociableMartian For bringing a baby into the world at a deliberate disadvantage. This is just atrocious. It's like cutting off your baby's arm as soon as it's born or blinding it. Just ridiculous and sick. This just shows you what gay parents get up to, appaling.

Actually it's not like that. And, there are heterosexual couples who wan't to have a deaf child. But let's pretend they are all gay.

	08-04-2002 19:00									#9
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quote: Originally posted by SociableMartian For bringing a baby into the world at a deliberate disadvantage.

Coloured people in the western world shouldn't get children either, that's the same thing. Being coloured is a disadvantage and those people actually wants their kids to look like themselves.

	08-04-2002 19:08									#10
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Pah, it's not the same, they basically selected this baby just to be deaf!!! Don't know why people are worried about genetic engineering making designer babies, it's already happening right under our noses. And for this reason

The hetrosexual couples have no choice having a deaf child because of their genetics. They don't selectively abort until they get a guaranteed deaf child. Black couples don't have a choice either, and they're at much less of a disadvantage than a deaf person anyway. I seem to remember a couple who refused surgery on their child (which could have restored hearing), I was against that too. This is just the same, people like this don't deserve kids.

	08-04-2002 19:13									#11
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quote: Originally posted by SociableMartian This is just the same, people like this don't deserve kids.

People like this will, with great propability, give that child a good childhood full of love and care. That is a bad thing? I've seen enough of "normal" healthy children growing in disease, poverty and pain. Why is it such a bad thing to give birth to a child with a good chance for happy life?

	08-04-2002 19:21									#12
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How do you think the child will feel when it's told it was deliberately selected to be deaf? It's like telling a blind person 'your parents had your eyes removed at birth' or something. Don't you think they will blame all the problems that might come out of their disability, all the advantages of hearing that they may long for and will never have? Remember they live a more limited and dangerous life without an important sense. You can't say that being able to hear speech, listen to music, and generally hear the world around you is not worth it. Also, you can't say they couldn't give a child with hearing just as full a life. Deaf parents have children with perfect hearing all the time. I'd love to know what their reason for having a deaf child is. To perpertuate 'deaf culture' perhaps??

	08-04-2002 19:32									#13
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quote: Originally posted by SociableMartian I'd love to know what their reason for having a deaf child is. To perpertuate 'deaf culture' perhaps??

Thats exactly the reason why. Many deaf people dont see being deaf as a disability, and in todays politically correct society anything that has the word "culture" attached to it will be fawned over by dewy-eyed liberals.

Intentionally having a child that is deaf, or refusing a deaf chiild the chance to hear is child abuse IMO.

	08-04-2002 19:39									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia Thats exactly the reason why. Many deaf people dont see being deaf as a disability, and in todays politically correct society anything that has the word "culture" attached to it will be fawned over by dewy-eyed liberals. Intentionally having a child that is deaf, or refusing a deaf chiild the chance to hear is child abuse IMO.

I wonder how many people who went deaf say at age 20 would insist on having a deaf child. Deaf from birth people are not fit to decide a child's sensory capabilities like this because they don't know what hearing is like. I agree with you on the child abuse part, a parent's responsibility is to give their child as happy a future and as much potential as possible. It's time they started making laws to stop this crap, and cut out the PC bullshit.

	08-04-2002 19:44									#15
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quote: Originally posted by SociableMartian I wonder how many people who went deaf say at age 20 would insist on having a deaf child. Deaf from birth people are not fit to decide a child's sensory capabilities like this because they don't know what hearing is like.

Thats exactly right.

You wouldnt think anyone who can hear would support these woman who want their child to be deaf, but amazingly there are people who do.

	08-04-2002 19:47									#16
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quote: Originally posted by SociableMartian Don't you think they will blame all the problems that might come out of their disability, all the advantages of hearing that they may long for and will never have?

They migh or they might not. Who knows? I live a limited life because of my rheumatism, can't do sports or any exhausting activity. That's why I'm always here. Should I blame my parents because they choose to have me allthough they knew my granparents from both father's and mother's side had rheumatism? And my mother has rheumatism.

quote: Remember they live a more limited and dangerous life without an important sense. You can't say that being able to hear speech, listen to music, and generally hear the world around you is not worth it.

One of my best friends is deaf. She does not live a limited life. For excample: she can go to clubs and dance to the music(!). You could never tell that she is deaf. She "feels" the beat though her body. She has lots of friends, both deaf and us "normal".
I can't understand bulgarian speech, am I missing a important part of life? Deaf have their own language. They do not have a life without communication. I can only sign the basic of deaf "talk", but I can "talk" with my deaf friend without any problems. Notepad and a pen are a must.
Because of my deaf friend, and the "culture" she showed me I can not see deafness as a disability.

quote: Also, you can't say they couldn't give a child with hearing just as full a life.

I'm not saying that. What I am saying is that it doesn't make a difference.

quote: Deaf parents have children with perfect hearing all the time. I'd love to know what their reason for having a deaf child is. To perpertuate 'deaf culture' perhaps??

I can't answer that.

	08-04-2002 19:48									#17
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quote: Originally posted by -=Vagrant=- People like this will, with great propability, give that child a good childhood full of love and care. That is a bad thing? I've seen enough of "normal" healthy children growing in disease, poverty and pain. Why is it such a bad thing to give birth to a child with a good chance for happy life?

Instead of giving the child a chance at being able to hear(by choosing a father without genetic deafness), they are ensuring that the child will be deaf (by choosing a father with genetic deafness). You dont see a problem with this? How can you call this "loving"???

	08-04-2002 20:01									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia Instead of giving the child a chance at being able to hear(by choosing a father without genetic deafness), they are ensuring that the child will be deaf (by choosing a father with genetic deafness). You dont see a problem with this? How can you call this "loving"???

First, as I explained above I don't see deafness as a disability.
Second, the two woman in question have a good chance of giving that child a good life. Deafness does not prevent a good and happy life. Or does it?

	08-04-2002 20:02									#19
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quote: Originally posted by -=Vagrant=- "They should be imprisoned." Why?

Probably because it's a sacred British tradition to put innocent people behind bars.

	08-04-2002 20:06									#20
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quote: Originally posted by boann bod , you need to go retake reading 1 again. this has nothing to do with their sexuality. its because they are both DEAF also.

I fully agree. The fact they're stupid has nothing to do with their homosexuality.


and also , I don't think the government should pay any welfare. Sadly , we can't do anything else about it. At the moment, that is.

	08-04-2002 20:34									#21
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia Thats exactly the reason why. Many deaf people dont see being deaf as a disability, and in todays politically correct society anything that has the word "culture" attached to it will be fawned over by dewy-eyed liberals. Intentionally having a child that is deaf, or refusing a deaf chiild the chance to hear is child abuse IMO.

So you're making a generalization about liberals based on stereotypes?

I'm a moderate liberal, the extreme liberalism of places like Berkley scare me.

As for deliberately having deaf babies -- I do not see that as something that should be supported, regardless of sexual orientation.

Boddington is implying that everything that goes wrong with conceiving children, or adoption is the fault of only homosexual couples, and not heterosexual couples.

His ignorant, and unfair, distorted claims are getting old.

	08-04-2002 20:44									#22
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun So you're making a generalization about liberals based on stereotypes? I'm a moderate liberal, the extreme liberalism of places like Berkley scare me. As for deliberately having deaf babies -- I do not see that as something that should be supported, regardless of sexual orientation. Boddington is implying that everything that goes wrong with conceiving children, or adoption is the fault of only homosexual couples, and not heterosexual couples. His ignorant, and unfair, distorted claims are getting old.

What a surprise, MrFun tried to defend child-abusing bastards just because they happen to be homosexual.

	08-04-2002 20:45									#23
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It definitely has nothing to do with their sexuality. There have been several stories about heterosexual couples choosing to have children "against the genetic odds", knowing their children will be at high risk, or even guaranteed, to have a a genetic disorder.

I personally have struggled with depression all my life. It is a hereditary trait in both sides of my family. I would never bring a child into the world knowing they had an increased risk of suffering from the same genetic problems. I can't understand how any parent would do so knowingly, whatever the disorder may be. To actually request such a thing is horrific.

Being deaf isn't the end of the world, but it certainly isn't something people are choosing to become on a regular basis.

	08-04-2002 21:01									#24
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2.3/10

But you did get Mr. Fun to respond, so I suppose your troll was successful.

	08-04-2002 21:03									#25
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The problem is that they want to have a deaf baby, not to "try against the odds"!

and Boddington's ... MrFun was not defending them, simply saying that it has nothing to do with them being gay.

	08-04-2002 21:53									#26
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I certainly do not condone doing this to children, I read the article in the paper today. Deliberately giving a child a disability is wrong - it would be different if the man with the disability was part of a relationship with the mother, but he's essentially a doner - and one who was rejected by sperm banks .

The people who did this did it because they are deaf, not because they are gay. This should not reflect on gay couples adopting (and the parents seem pretty selfish - this would also harm gay rights movements )

Infat is just bitter because no girl in her right mind would ever go out with the sexist homophobe

	08-04-2002 22:00									#27
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quote: Originally posted by red_jon I certainly do not condone doing this to children, I read the article in the paper today. Deliberately giving a child a disability is wrong - it would be different if the man with the disability was part of a relationship with the mother, but he's essentially a doner - and one who was rejected by sperm banks . The people who did this did it because they are deaf, not because they are gay. This should not reflect on gay couples adopting (and the parents seem pretty selfish - this would also harm gay rights movements ) Infat is just bitter because no girl in her right mind would ever go out with the sexist homophobe

Ha ha. Proved wrong again.

No guy in their right mind would go out with the sexist heterophobes that are you and MrFun.

	08-04-2002 22:05									#28
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quote: Originally posted by Boddington's Ha ha. Proved wrong again. No guy in their right mind would go out with the sexist heterophobes that are you and MrFun.

And how exactly am I a heterophobe? And sexist? That's a laugh.

	08-04-2002 22:13									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Dalgetti The problem is that they want to have a deaf baby, not to "try against the odds"! and Boddington's ... MrFun was not defending them, simply saying that it has nothing to do with them being gay.

Thanks for reading and understanding my claim and argument.

Boddington apparently did not understand what I said. What a big surprise.

No one should deliberately conceive a child with a disability. READ my posts more carefully, Boddington.

	08-04-2002 22:13									#30
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quote: Originally posted by Boddington's Ha ha. Proved wrong again.

Yes you were. -ottok

quote: No guy in their right mind would go out with the sexist heterophobes that are you and MrFun.

I'm a heterophobe, all who have hurt me were heteros. Most of the murderers are heterosexuals and dare I point out that most of the republicans are heterosexuals (gasp!). Maybe that's why I'm engaged to a slightly bi, must mostly hetero girl.