27-10-2002 06:53									#181
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hmm.. Interesting. The last reliable account places him at the towers about 1am before the final battle(Sphrantzes).

After that the remaining sources are varied and contradictory.. although it is reasonable to assume he was at the gate of Lycus valley until the end.

The same source for your quotes is Nicolo Sagundino --a Venetian ambassador-- who goes on to say his body was discovered and Mehmet gave his head to the Sultan of Egypt along with twenty virgins.

I'm not so sure about his account, since he wasn't there and could only have heard second hand.

Sphranzes claims that Constantine was cut down before he could charge in, and his friends soon followed him, he claims the body was never found, which is certaintly more plausible than the Venetian version.

Besides, I bet, unless he was hit in the throat, he made some sort of death cry before he died.

I thought only the Odeon was used for festivals? The smog is doing more damage I think....

	27-10-2002 07:54									#182
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quote: Skopjans. Or Slavomacedonians.

be right back with you tommorow when I sober up

	27-10-2002 16:43									#183
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But, Knevil i have Sphrantzes account right next to me. He is absolute to the fact that he charged: "He spurred his horse,reached the breach and charged the infidels like Samson attacked the Philistines. In his first charge he knocked them all down the walls, which seemed like a miracle to all those who witnessed it. Sword in hand and growling like a lion he slew so many Turks, that blood run like a river from his arms and legs".

That incident happened to the Gate of Romanus, not at the gate of Lycus or at the towers.

	27-10-2002 16:47									#184
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Oh come on, man. What is that sig?



Oh, and Sphrantzes never even mentions the Emperor's death, not only the non-recovery of his body.

	27-10-2002 21:31									#185
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Really? I didn't know that it was the Gate of Romanus. Sphrantzes wasn't there if I remember correctly. I've got the later revised version (with Melissos additions). So maybe thats why the discrepancy. I think its because I've got sources relating to his final resting place, rather than how he died.... I thought he tried to get his friends to kill him, and when they didn't he took off his imperial dress and walked to the battle lines where he was 'cut down almost instantly' -J.J Norwich.

	27-10-2002 23:20									#186
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Absolutely correct. Sphrantzes was elsewhere;according to his own words he was "inspecting the defenses at another point of the City".

I have heard that version of Constantine's death too but i did not know the source.

And please remove that signature.