27-11-2002 12:01									#91
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quote: Ahhh... you seem to now be saying "less" important vs meaningless... We must be making progress on you

I wasn't so much you "making progress" on me as it was me realizing that I had been using hyperbole far too much lately. I re-read part of the original thread while looking for JohnT's stat site and I noticed that my rhetoric had been far softer in tone at the beginning of the discussion. I greatly prefer this style, as it fits my personality far better than the blustery style I've fallen into lately.

I should've never started throwing words like "meaningless" and "irrelevant" around, since they don't really reflect the realities of the situation or my own views. I got caught up in the debate and ratcheted up my rhetoric, something I regret doing. I'm going to try to return to my original tone in the future; I don't like being the unreasonable person in a discussion...

You can claim that you "made progress" on me, however, if it makes you feel better about your impotent attacks against my unassailable logic...

	28-11-2002 00:18									#92
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quote: The conferences aren't anywhere close to being similar in talent levels or structures. To say that winning the MAC is just as impressive as winning the Big 12 is ridiculous. Hell, finishing sixth in the Big 12 is more impressive than winning the MAC!

So are you saying that MAC team's regular seasons are totally meaningless?

Btw, I'd really like to see that video game simulation of a hypo 8 team playoff run by someone on this thread .

	28-11-2002 04:34									#93
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That would be amusing... but it depends on which video game simulation you used

	28-11-2002 04:57									#94
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Sorry Imran... my Gamecube, my tournament.

Drake--I know you're hung up about the non-power conferences getting a shot under my proposal. Look on the bright side--the NCAA is considering downgrading a large number of the schools in those conferences; if I recall correctly, it would leave around 80 or so teams, and would probably lead to realignment of the remaining non-power teams into a smaller number of conferences. If we still had a 12 team tourney, that would open up more slots for supposed "deserving" teams, even if they weren't the best in their conference...

	28-11-2002 16:04									#95
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quote: Look on the bright side--the NCAA is considering downgrading a large number of the schools in those conferences; if I recall correctly, it would leave around 80 or so teams, and would probably lead to realignment of the remaining non-power teams into a smaller number of conferences.

I hope this is true. It's something that really needs to be done.

	28-11-2002 20:12									#96
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten I hope this is true. It's something that really needs to be done.

Why does it "need" to be done. With the current system, it really doesn't make one bit of difference if a school is 1-A or not.

Plus, in the stories I read, they are only considering downgrading the schools because they aren't meeting the attendence requirements needed to stay 1-A, and has nothing to do with any desire to remove perceived weaker teams from 1-A.

	28-11-2002 20:42									#97
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What I can't remember is if they were planning on dropping entire conferences if their aggregate attendance wasn't up to par, even if individual schools were. IE, by-by to MAC, despite the large fan bases and relative success of Marshall, Toledo, Western Michigan.

	29-11-2002 21:06									#98
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I thought it was going to be on a school to school basis, but some of the conferences were concerned that they wouldn't have enough teams, and that a merger might be neccessary.

	29-11-2002 21:11									#99
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That would make more sense... otherwise, Marshall and Colorado State would dominate the I-AA championship year in and year out.

	29-11-2002 21:19									#100
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Neither has ANY desire to drop down in divisions

	29-11-2002 21:28									#101
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quote: Originally posted by Guynemer That would make more sense... otherwise, Marshall and Colorado State would dominate the I-AA championship year in and year out.

That is why Marshall moved up to 1-A in the mid 90's.


ACK!

	30-11-2002 06:29									#102
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Well, drop the teams that don't have a fan base, and merge the remainders into two or three new conferences, instead of the five "lower tier" ones we have now. (Though, for the life of me, I can not conceive why the ACC is not considered "lower tier" as well.)

If this were done, would some of the "BCS Top 8 Playoffs" supporters come along to my position?

(Incidentially, I wonder if they would drop teams that are in the BCS conferences, i.e. Baylor, Duke, Wake Forest, Temple, Rutgers, Indiana...)

	30-11-2002 13:36									#103
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As long as the team can keep up with the "fan" requirement for 1 - A... let them. Any one of those teams can have a magical season... why not

	30-11-2002 20:08									#104
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Why not?

Because they're Rutgers, that's why not.

	01-12-2002 03:17									#105
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The problem with dropping teams for conferences, is that they aren't just in the conferences for football. They are in the conferences in baseball, basketball, etc. That is why teams that suck in college football (Duke, Rutgers, Indiana) are good at basketball or baseball or soccer in those conferences.

	01-12-2002 03:27									#106
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That's why some schools are in multiple conferences for different Sports. Southern Illiniois is in two different conferences for Football and Basketball

	01-12-2002 03:31									#107
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But a lot of conferences don't like that. I'm pretty sure conferences like the Big East, Big 10, Big 12 will not allow that to happen.

	01-12-2002 03:46									#108
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I thought the Big East Does allow that. Isn't Notre Dame in the Big East for basketball..

	01-12-2002 03:53									#109
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That's because it's NOTRE DAME, Ming .

The Big East feels that sooner or later, Notre Dame football may want to going a league, and since basketball is in the Big East... .

When Rutgers wanted to join the Big East for soccer and basketball, the BE mandated that football also had to join, even though RU was hesitant about that.

	01-12-2002 04:08									#110
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Yes... as usual, Notre Dame gets to make their own rules. They will probably stay independent... I know the Big 10 always keeps an eye on them

	01-12-2002 04:34									#111
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Texas overwhelmed A&M. Everything Texas did was pure gold.

Yeah,Notre Dame will always be independent.

	01-12-2002 04:53									#112
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Naw... sooner or later they'll join a conference... or the NCAA will make them .

	01-12-2002 04:55									#113
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If they do... it won't be the NCAA... it will be a TV network

	01-12-2002 20:43									#114
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Speaking of Notre Dame, if they get an at-large bid ahead of Southern Cal, it will destroy what little credibility the BCS has left. Good lord, how I'd like that to happen.

Oklahoma also got beaten last night... not a big surprise, OkSt has a pretty good team. That has narrowed the field to Ohio State vs. Miami (if they beat Virginia Tech next week) or Georgia (if Miami loses, they beat Arkansas, and the numbers go their way) or Iowa (if Miami loses, and the numbers go their way) or... USC (if Miami loses, and the numbers go their way).

A shitty way to decide a championship game, but I admit, it is exciting. (Though not as exciting as a playoff...)

	02-12-2002 07:43									#115
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All I've gotta say is, GO DAWGS!!! GO VA-TECH!!!!!!!

	02-12-2002 10:00									#116
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Yes... a playoff would be more exciting than praying some crappy team will get lucky and beat some power house. It would be far more interesting to watch competitive teams fighting it out on the field.

	02-12-2002 10:02									#117
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On any given Saturday, Ming...

	02-12-2002 10:46									#118
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Good God. You leave for a weekend and all the ND-haters come out to play.

"Speaking of Notre Dame, if they get an at-large bid ahead of Southern Cal, it will destroy what little credibility the BCS has left."

FYI: The attendance for USC v. UCLA was something like 30,000. I can't imagine any of ND's games didn't sell out, including Navy in Baltimore.

	02-12-2002 11:15									#119
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Yes DanS... and that's just the proof that the whole BCS system is money first... and actual skill takes a back seat.

It is a rotten system, run by people not even involved in the sport... Time for this farce to end.

	02-12-2002 20:35									#120
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"and that's just the proof that the whole BCS system is money first..."

It proves nothing of the sort. It does prove that money is a predicate, however. If USC can't earn the $16 million that they would be paid by a BCS Bowl, why should they be invited?