02-12-2002 20:40									#121
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So you are admitting that the current bowl system is about money and not about which teams deserve to play based on skill... A bad way to determine post season play.

	02-12-2002 21:15									#122
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"So you are admitting that the current bowl system is about money and not about which teams deserve to play based on skill..."

You've been watching too many TV legal dramas.

The current bowl system (outside the championship game) is not only about which teams deserve to play based on skill but also about money.

	08-12-2002 00:45									#123
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At the half, it's Miami 35 - Virginia Tech 21

Miami's offense looks phenomenal, but their defense leaves a lot to be desired. Still, if the Canes play this way in the second half, the BCS is going to work out fine, just fine.

	08-12-2002 00:54									#124
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OSU will match up well against Miami. It will be tough for Miami to stop OSU's run.

Take away VT's turnovers and this is a tied game.

	08-12-2002 00:58									#125
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I don't think OSU's defense can stop Miami's offense, though. OSU's run, while very effective, hasn't put a lot of points on the board this season. I think Miami wins in a blowout, worse than last year.

	08-12-2002 01:01									#126
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A blowout? Hmmm... On what basis?

OSU is a better team than VT. VT isn't stopping Miami. Yet no blowout. Yet.

	08-12-2002 01:06									#127
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quote: A blowout? Hmmm... On what basis?

It's based mainly on my complete lack of respect for the quality of Big Ten football. Also, Miami has looked damn near unstoppable this year when they come to play. Their rush defense is their only weak point, but I don't think Maurice Clarett and Co. can put enough points on the board to beat the Canes.

This is all guesswork, though. It's extremely hard to compare a Big Ten team and a Big East team, because of a lack of head-to-head matchups between those two conferences. If Miami can hold VT off, however, we'll get to find out.

	08-12-2002 01:15									#128
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So much for VT cutting down on the turnovers...

Miami 49 - Virginia Tech 21

Six touchdowns for Willis McGahee...

	08-12-2002 01:24									#129
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Turn the channel for a couple of minutes and Miami puts on another 14...

	08-12-2002 01:49									#130
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Damn, is Miami trying to lose this game?

Miami 49 - Virginia Tech 37

	08-12-2002 02:37									#131
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Final: Miami 56 - Virginia Tech 45

The game wasn't as close as the final score implies. Miami was dominating; OSU is going to have their hands full.

More importantly, the BCS worked out perfectly. Suck on that, you playoff zealots!

	08-12-2002 03:03									#132
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Yeah... you have to post that it actually worked for a change... pure luck and only highlights how bad the current system is since it does rely on luck...

A playoff system would work EVERY YEAR

*I was just waiting for you to post when the game ended*

	08-12-2002 04:21									#133
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quote: A playoff system would work EVERY YEAR

It wouldn't work this year. It would take a perfectly set-up battle between unbeatens and flush it down the toilet.

	08-12-2002 04:34									#134
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Many EXPERTS would disagree with you. Many feel that OSU, even with their undefeated record, is not one of the best two teams in the country. If they had to play some of the other good teams, then it would answer that question. Instead, we will never know, and some other team that might have a better chance to beat Miami is screwed

Again.. If any team is the "best" team in the country, a few extra games will only prove it... and if they lose, then they weren't

	08-12-2002 04:47									#135
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"Many EXPERTS would disagree with you."

I like how you try to put your personal opinion under the banner of "expert."

How transparent.

	08-12-2002 05:06									#136
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Not at all... I'm just repeating what some of the talking heads are saying.

Just because a team goes undefeated, doesn't make it the best team. Drake would be the first person to say that Bowling Green going undefeated doesn't mean a thing. Yet he is saying that since OSU did, they earned the right. Who can really say if a one loss Iowa team is better than OSU... or maybe Georgia is better... Right now, a damn computer is making the call... and that's crap. Let em prove it by actually playing the games.

Only a playoff will determine who truely is the best team.

	08-12-2002 05:13									#137
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"Right now, a damn computer is making the call..."

And the sportswriters. And the coaches.

You're hyping up a tempest in a teacup.

	08-12-2002 05:29									#138
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No... you are the guys doing that. Take a look at the results of this poll... or any other poll that has been taken on this subject. A far higher percentage of people think the current system sucks. To support a system that is full of flaws is just silly, and most people can agree on that. No other sport allows some outsider to determine their champion... No other college sport allows a computer to determine who makes the playoffs... Every other sport makes the teams fight it out on the field of battle instead of on paper. The current BCS should have no place in college football, and only greed and money is keeping it in place. And that's a fact

	08-12-2002 05:36									#139
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quote: No other college sport allows a computer to determine who makes the playoffs...

You've never heard of the RPI rankings for college basketball?

quote: Every other sport makes the teams fight it out on the field of battle instead of on paper.

How did Ohio State and Miami not earn their spot "on the field of battle"? They were the only two teams to win all their games; they are the only two teams who deserve a shot at the title this year. Your stupid playoff would take away their hard work and make them prove themselves all over again in the "real" season.

quote: To support a system that is full of flaws is just silly

A playoff system has just as many flaws, even if you don't want to admit to them. Nothing is perfect.

	08-12-2002 05:49									#140
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten You've never heard of the RPI rankings for college basketball?

And it is only used as a "guideline" by members of the NCAA Selection Committee... Actual people make the final decision... and people that are part of the NCAA, not a bunch of greedy old farts who run the bowl system.

quote: How did Ohio State and Miami not earn their spot "on the field of battle"? They were the only two teams to win all their games; they are the only two teams who deserve a shot at the title this year. Your stupid playoff would take away their hard work and make them prove themselves all over again in the "real" season.

Yeah.. it would make them prove if they do deserve to be the best. And what's the problem with that

You always argue that if Bowling Green went undefeated, that they wouldn't deserve a shot because of their strength of schedule... Using that logic, Georgia had the Ninth hardest schedule in the country... far harder than Miami's 30th ranked or even OSU 21st rank.
Maybe if Miami or OSU had played as hard as a schedule, they wouldn't have gone undefeated...
You don't know...

quote: A playoff system has just as many flaws, even if you don't want to admit to them. Nothing is perfect.

Yes... nothing is prefect... but a playoff system has FAR FEWER flaws than the current BCS system.

Again... if Miami and OSU are the best teams in the nation, what is wrong by asking them to play a total of three games instead of one to prove it. The best will win...

	08-12-2002 05:59									#141
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quote: Again... if Miami and OSU are the best teams in the nation, what is wrong by asking them to play a total of three games instead of one to prove it. The best will win...

It's wrong because the regular season is supposed to be the most important part of the game The regular season shouldn't be just a qualification process for the postseason playoff. Every game should matter; every loss should count against you. If you can't see how a playoff makes the regular season less important, you're blind.

Anyway, today has proven mighty useful for debunking the loveably misguided playoff backers. Washington State's victory over UCLA means that USC is the #4 team in the country, but won't win their own conference championship.

How would Guynemer's wonderful playoff idea handle this? Do you give the one wild-card slot to USC? Or do you give it to Iowa? And how do you explain giving North Texas a title shot over one of these two teams? I can't wait to hear the answer to this question. And "tough noogies" isn't a good enough answer in this case...

I'm loving this!

	08-12-2002 06:33									#142
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten It's wrong because the regular season is supposed to be the most important part of the game The regular season shouldn't be just a qualification process for the postseason playoff.

Uhhh... the current system does exactly the same thing. Using your logic, there shouldn't even be a game played then. The computers and sportswriters and Coaches should just pick a winner like they used to. The fact that they added a single game means that the regular season is just a qualification process for the Playoff They just as easily could have added three games.


And the fact that you call it wrong is just your opinion... and from looking at this and any other poll, most people think your opinion is very wrong

I still love the fact that the BCS needs LUCK to work...
You are jumping up and down and saying... see it works... pure luck. A system that doesn't depend on luck is needed.

	08-12-2002 06:33									#143
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On the contrary, as I outlined in the US Sports Discussion Thread (or whatever it is called), Notre Dame is the wildcard due to their success against high-level competition. They have three wins against conference champs & other 9+ win teams; only Oklahoma can equal that. And if Oklahoma loses tonight, Notre Dame wins the tiebreaker by having more wins against 8+ win teams.

Simple. Efficient. No *****ing or moaning. Prove it on the field, screw the polls and the computers. North Texas is in because they are the best in their conference. USC is not; simple as that. Yeah, USC beat Notre Dame like a redheaded stepchild; ND had more success against high-level competition throughout the season. If USC wanted in the tournament, they probably shoulda made that extra point against Wazzou.

As for Iowa, well, Big Ten rules state that the Buckeyes are the conference champs due to a better overall record. Totally sucks, I agree. Of course, if my system were in place, it would encourage the Big Ten to come up with a way to avoid such problems in the future.

Honestly, what's so complicated about this?

	08-12-2002 06:36									#144
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The BCS doesn't need luck to work; it needs luck to work flawlessly, like it did this year. The BCS still works when it has to choose between one-loss teams; in fact, that is what it was designed to do. The BCS has worked every year it has been in existence.

	08-12-2002 06:39									#145
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Guynemer, your playoff is no better than the current system. In fact, it is much worse. Any playoff that lets North Texas and Notre Dame in while denying Iowa and USC is a joke, plain and simple.

	08-12-2002 06:46									#146
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How is it a joke? USC had every chance to win the Pac 10; they couldn't pull it off. Notre Dame had more success against top-level teams than USC did, despite last week's cathartic whoop-ass.

As for Iowa, well, that's not my system's fault; that's the Big Ten's fault. Now, if we expanded to 16 teams, both Iowa and USC would be in, as they are next in line after Notre Dame (and Oklahoma, if they lose tonight). That leaves one or two more spots open--Texas, Virginia Tech, Michigan, and Arkansas are all tied next, I'd have to spend some time figuring out how the tiebreaker would fall for that.

What would you say to that, Drake? A 16-team tourney, it would include USC and Iowa. And yes, North Texas too. But I simply refuse to support a system which doesn't reward Div I-A conference champs. 12 teams or 16; your choice.

	08-12-2002 06:49									#147
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"Despite last week's cathartic whoop-ass"?!?

	08-12-2002 06:55									#148
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Hey, them's the rules I set out. Notre Dame had more wins against top teams than USC. Period.

Anyway, you didn't answer the question. Would you be more comfortable with a system that awarded five wildcards as opposed to one? It would give more "deserving teams" (in your conception) a chance.

	08-12-2002 07:00									#149
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quote: Anyway, you didn't answer the question. Would you be more comfortable with a system that awarded five wildcards as opposed to one? It would give more "deserving teams" (in your conception) a chance.

No. My concern has never been about giving every team that may theoretically be the best team in the country a shot at the title. My concern has always been about maintaining the integrity of the regular season and making sure that it continues to be of primary importance in college football. No playoff achieves this, no matter how many teams are involved.

quote: Hey, them's the rules I set out.

The same defense can be made for the BCS. Every team knows the rules going into the season.

	08-12-2002 07:24									#150
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quote: the BCS worked out perfectly.

Hmmm, must have missed when OSU played USC or Iowa.

Oh yea, they didn't!!

Another year where a team that may be inferior plays for the national championship (that was Nebraska last year).

Just because you are undefeated doesn't mean you are better than a 1 loss team. That's especially proven this year.