24-01-2003 04:01									#1
	Exidus of Jews from France reaches record levels. Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

The flow of Jews out of France has doubled in the last 12 months and looks likely to increase still more if a war in Iraq occurs. The numbers are still only a few thousand a year but it begs the question of why so many Jews are packing up and leaving France. Personally, I think it is in response to French politicians pandering to Arab bigotry.

Here is a recent BBC article on the subject.

quote: French Jews leave with no regrets By James Coomarasamy BBC Paris correspondent In a small tele-sales office near the Gare du Nord, gap year student Jonathan Taieb persuades another customer that his company should be listed in a new business directory. But nothing, it seems, can persuade Jonathan to stay in the country where he was born and grew up. He is part of the growing exodus of French Jews leaving for Israel. "As a Jew I don't see any future for me in France," he said. "Just put on a skull cap in the street and see the reaction you get. While Muslim girls can wear veils and no-one says a word." In a few weeks he will leave this office for the last time, pack his bags and head for Haifa university to study aeronautics. Although he is a practising Jew, Jonathan is very different from the Orthodox Jews who have traditionally made the trip back to the Holy Land. This is a part of the reason why, in the past 12 months, the numbers leaving France have doubled. Anti-Semitic violence Olivier Rafowicz runs a Jewish agency in Paris, which helps those who have made a similar choice to Jonathan. He says you cannot pinpoint a single reason why the phones began ringing off the hook last year, although he says it should not come as a surprise. "Surprise will I think be a lie, we are living in the world and we are aware what is going on of course, in France Le Pen the last year, when he got to the second round of the elections, had a serous impact, and also the aftershock effect of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict." Indeed the violence in the Middle East was seen as one of the reasons for a series of attacks on French synagogues last year. With Europe's largest Arab and Jewish communities, France is ever sensitive to the possibility of violence far away being reflected close to home. And now after a relatively calm few months the malaise is creeping back. At the weekend's anti-war demonstrations it was noticeable how many protesters sang anti-Israeli songs, while just a few weeks ago a liberal Rabbi in Paris was stabbed and had his car set on fire for reasons which remain obscure. Roger Cukierman is head of the Crif, France's largest Jewish organisation. "There is a reduction in the number of violent acts but the atmosphere is still very heavy and we fear that if and when the war with Iraq starts we may face a revival of anti-Semitic acts." No regrets But at the same time he is keen to put the exodus of French Jews in perspective. In fact, the number of immigrants from France to Israel has increased from 1,000 to 2,000 people, but out of a community of 600,000 people it is really not significant. "Jews have lived in France for the last 2,000 years," Mr Cukierman says. "There is a saying 'happy like a Jew in France' and I think it is still valid." Not everyone is so positive though. Listening to Israeli music at home with his father, Jonathan says he is leaving this country with no regrets. "I'm sad to say goodbye to my family and friends, but France, no. How can I be sad to leave a country which is without exaggeration, anti-Semitic?" It is the sort of accusation which makes French leaders indignant but also concerned. In a country which saw Nazi occupation, no-one belittles the significance of Franco-Jewish relations, and as long as French Jews continue to leave and a war in Iraq continues to look likely, it is an issue the authorities here can ill afford to ignore.

	24-01-2003 05:12									#2
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don't blame them. come to america. that is the best place for them.

	24-01-2003 05:19									#3
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The article says most of them are going to Israel. Apparently, French anti-Semitism has become unbearable for many French Jews.

	24-01-2003 05:25									#4
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Personally, I like jews a lot more than I like French people.
The French can't win a war and they are trying to find a scapegoat for their lack in military power.
And Israel is a new country and won way more wars than France did in the last century.

	24-01-2003 05:26									#5
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Can't fault Jews for leaving Europe; it has been a fairly dangerous place to be in the last 1000 years.

	24-01-2003 09:33									#6
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Any western europeans care to answer?

	24-01-2003 10:07									#7
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is this a surprise? If I were a Jew there is no chance I would choose to live in the cesspool of anti-semitism that is continental Europe.

	24-01-2003 11:11									#8
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Any idea on how bad anti-semitism is occuring in the rest of Europe?

	24-01-2003 11:14									#9
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Good for them! France is horrible.

	24-01-2003 11:15									#10
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The same, though from different reasons, happens in Argentina.

	24-01-2003 11:43									#11
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I've seen some french immigrants at the technion. one of them is a good friend of mine.

	24-01-2003 11:49									#12
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The new Nazi's are the European left. They join the old Nazi's who never left. Is there anyone left in Europe that is not racist?

	24-01-2003 11:56									#13
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Well, Finland isn't actually western europe, but I can still say something.

Here are not many jews to be seen. And I actually don't know why. Or it's just that they aren't so easily noticed as jews. The skull cap doesn't show very well under a fur cap

OTOH the muslims seem to be a growing religion here. Or it seems so, because the veil can be seen more easily than the skull cap.

Here we have some hatred towards the immigrants, especially people from Africa. But this has nothing to do with religion. It's because (and what I want to believe in) the small minority of them has formed 'robber gangs' in Helsinki. They rob people in broad daylight, threathening with knives and chains. They should get some education and a job - and the city would be safe place to live again... hopefully.

	24-01-2003 12:08									#14
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I didn't think that jews lived in finland, historically.

	24-01-2003 12:09									#15
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Yep, I think that jews want to live comfortably, and see the sun around the year.

	24-01-2003 12:10									#16
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quote: Can't fault Jews for leaving Europe; it has been a fairly dangerous place to be in the last 1000 years.

Ironic that they seem to be going somewhere much more dangerous, eh?

	24-01-2003 12:12									#17
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It's probably just me, but if I were a Jewish person, I'd come and settle in America before going to Israel. I'd feel more secure over here than on a spit of land that's under terror attacks every other day or so (and surrounded by a lot of people who likely don't like you very much).

Gatekeeper

	24-01-2003 12:45									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Ned The new Nazi's are the European left. They join the old Nazi's who never left. Is there anyone left in Europe that is not racist?

do you have any idea of what you're talking about?

	24-01-2003 12:46									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Ned The new Nazi's are the European left. They join the old Nazi's who never left. Is there anyone left in Europe that is not racist?

Mr. Bean?

	24-01-2003 13:24									#20
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quote: Is there anyone left in Europe that is not racist?

Me?

	24-01-2003 13:32									#21
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quote: Originally posted by Gatekeeper It's probably just me, but if I were a Jewish person, I'd come and settle in America before going to Israel. Gatekeeper

Maybe they are done with depending on others to protect them, personally?

	24-01-2003 13:52									#22
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many moronic comments
If the first one of you knew how to count, he would go 'oh, 0,003% of jews are leaving France, the situation must be really bad, that's a massive exodus, then'

This is Sharon's message since the start, 'come back fight for Israel, France is anti-semitic, bla bla yadda'

There is one big issue of racism in France, but it's against arabs, not jews : a jew has never been refused a job, an appartment, entrance in nightclubs, etc. Arabs, yes, everyday, everywhere.

I'd prefer 100 times be a jew in France than an arab. But then again I'd prefer 100 times to be an arab in France than in Israel.

	24-01-2003 13:55									#23
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Here's the real story:

quote: In fact, the number of immigrants from France to Israel has increased from 1,000 to 2,000 people, but out of a community of 600,000 people it is really not significant.

It's 'doubled' from 0.17% to 0.33%. Calling it an exodus is utterly ludicrous.

	24-01-2003 13:57									#24
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Funny how the exaggeration of european antisemitism has been engrained into american brains. Just wondering, ever read a story about jewish immigration into Germany? Or about comparing the attacks in France with US hate crime stats?

As for immigration into Israel,

http://www.cbs.gov.il/shnaton53/st04_04.pdf

Yes, France seems to be a bit out of line....

	24-01-2003 14:04									#25
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One wonders if the emigration rate of palestinians from the Israels colonies (sorry, the 'occupied territories' ) is higher than 0.3% a year.

If so then, by the standard's of Oerdin, the there is an exodus caused by the racist treatment of them by Jews.

	24-01-2003 14:10									#26
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El Freako: The article was published by the BBC not me. I simply posted it here in order to stimulate public discusion.

	24-01-2003 14:30									#27
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Ahhh, the Euros have arrived. Good.

Of course, no Synagogues have been burned in France. Jewish people have no reason to start to look for the exits. Of course not.

	24-01-2003 14:31									#28
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I think some of you are missing the point here. The real question is why is the emigration rate of Jews out of France so disproportionate high compared to every other group in France? I dare say the emigration rate is many times higher then for native born Catholics or Protestants or even foreign born Arabs who have immigrated to France.

I don't know for certain but I'd wager that the Jewish emigration rate out of France is one of the highest emigration rates of any group with in the EU. Would anyone care to speculate why?

	24-01-2003 14:33									#29
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The war seems to be coming, and they are going to defend their holy land?

	24-01-2003 14:45									#30
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"Of course, no Synagogues have been burned in France. Jewish people have no reason to start to look for the exits. Of course not."

Well, let's look at how many jews get killed in acts of antisemitic violence:

EU: 0 (unfortunately 0 just in most years, not all)
US: 0 (unfortunately 0 just in most years, not all)
Israel: 100? 200? (unfortunately over the last years)

So why is Israel such an antisemitic country?

Oerdin:

"I dare say the emigration rate is many times higher then for native born Catholics or Protestants or even foreign born Arabs who have immigrated to France."

Based on what ? I actually have no idea how the rates compare.