23-02-2003 10:13									#301
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by Bearcat One of England's goals going into their game was to not allow a try by the Welsh, according to Clive Woodward. Has Wales sunk that low in the opinion of other 6N teams?

Ask Havak and he'll tell you the Welsh should be relegated to a girls' competition. But then he has a problem with Celts. I think one must have pinched a girlfriend from him at some point.

	23-02-2003 10:15									#302
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin Sorry, I stayed away from the Internet today because I didn't want to know the result of Wales-England. The English players have been impressive today in front of courageous and able Welsh players, a very entertaining game. I looked at the game broadcasted around 2 am, England wins 26-9 though the Welsh players should have scored a try (Taylor forgot two players to its left) and would have deserved to score another one, the score does not reflect the real physiognomy of the game though England has logically won. Very entertaining game...

I'm getting a confusing signal from you. The score doesn't reflect the game? So the Welsh played well? Or England underperformed?

	23-02-2003 10:42									#303
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by finbar I'm getting a confusing signal from you. The score doesn't reflect the game? So the Welsh played well? Or England underperformed?

From what I understand, the English performed rather poorly during the first half despite leading at the break. The Welsh really played with their hearts on their sleeves, probably sensing that they absolutely had too.

	23-02-2003 11:23									#304
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by finbar I'm getting a confusing signal from you. The score doesn't reflect the game? So the Welsh played well? Or England underperformed?

England played an impressive game against a good Welsh team, a score like 26-21 in favor of the English players would have better expressed the Welsh players' performance, better than a 17 points margin.

	23-02-2003 15:42									#305
	Suffering from ads?

Mmmm. So England were only a 5 points better side than Wales. I imagine Havak will plead the "old enemy" case, that certain teams lift against England, and so on, and so on.

I notice also that Wilko went off injured. A game against Ireland sans Wilko would be interesting for England. A game against anyone sans Wilko would be interesting.

	23-02-2003 21:17									#306
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: It remains to be seen how long the tackled player will be given to release the ball. There have been inconsistencies in this area too.

Here they seem quite strict that it must be released at once.

England performed quite well against Wales in the second half. I don't know if the Welsh were good in the first half or the English played under their level. Taylor's not giving the ball to his partners cost the Welsh a try they merited, but I think the difference between the teams should have been of a dozen points not 5 as Tamerlin suggests to reflect the game.

France bet Scotland 38 - 3. The Scots are really low. They managed one or two individual nice actions, but they were never dangerous and most of the time lost terrain when attacking. The French made a good seconf half but had problems around the 8-9 connection on scrums (Redpath was good at being a nuisance here).

	23-02-2003 22:51									#307
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by finbar Mmmm. So England were only a 5 points better side than Wales. I imagine Havak will plead the "old enemy" case, that certain teams lift against England, and so on, and so on.

As LDiCesare has already suggested it in its previous post, England was really superior to the Welsh players and the team has constantly maintained its grasp on the game. No threat for the English players but clearly another Welsh team than the one who lost the previous week against Italia.

quote: I notice also that Wilko went off injured. A game against Ireland sans Wilko would be interesting for England. A game against anyone sans Wilko would be interesting.

He went out of the field dazed, almost a Knock Out. I haven't yet read the newspaper so I don't know if he will be able to play in two weeks. Great game from Wilkinson and Luger by the way, among others...

	23-02-2003 23:43									#308
	Suffering from ads?

One of the others being Finbar's least favourite lock.

And no I have never lost a girlfriend to a welshman (god forbid!).

An interesting game - the Welsh disrupted us quite thoroughly squeezing Bracken for time on every phase. We played quite poorly, never getting out of first gear. And we still comfortbaly rolled them in their own backyard. I'm afraid Tamerlin was watching adifferent game to me - a thirty point margin was a fairer reflection and failed to happen only becuase we made too many errors and could not adjust to another bizarre referee (Steve Walsh, Kiwi).

I'm not worried - I saw plenty in ireland's game to suggest they will struggle against both France and us.

Some sweet tries against the Auld Enemy today gentlemen.

Catch you all tomorrow.

	24-02-2003 03:35									#309
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Havak And no I have never lost a girlfriend to a welshman (god forbid!).

Then presumably a Welsh lass knocked you back at some stage.

quote: I'm afraid Tamerlin was watching adifferent game to me - a thirty point margin was a fairer reflection and failed to happen only becuase we made too many errors and could not adjust to another bizarre referee (Steve Walsh, Kiwi).

Mmmm. And if the NSW Waratahs hadn't coughed up so much ball and not stuffed up nearly every lineout and played a hell of a lot better, they'd've beaten Auckland. If ifs and buts were dynamite, you'd be an explosive chap.

	24-02-2003 03:36									#310
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin He went out of the field dazed, almost a Knock Out. I haven't yet read the newspaper so I don't know if he will be able to play in two weeks. Great game from Wilkinson and Luger by the way, among others...

It was reported here as a knee.

	24-02-2003 09:15									#311
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by Havak and could not adjust to another bizarre referee (Steve Walsh, Kiwi).

Kiwi bashing yet again? ...

Actually I shouldn't comment as the AB's don't have to play under Kiwi refs and I haven't seen enough of them in action in the NZ domestic competition for quite some time. Not that, as has come up recently, facts have any place here.

From what I've heard the pundits seem to have divided into the same two camps again.
(1) That England didn't play terribly well away from home and managed to scrape through against a good Welsh side. England -1.
(2) That England didn't play terribly well away from home and yet still won comfortably enough, moreover against a good Welsh side. England +1.
One draws from it what one wills...
Naturally I'm sitting on the fence.

	24-02-2003 09:43									#312
	Remove this text

It's not Friday! Nick off!

	24-02-2003 13:54									#313
	Tired of ads?

quote: Then presumably a Welsh lass knocked you back at some stage.

Given that I toured in Wales once or twice then most probably – but such details are beyond my powers of recall.

quote: If ifs and buts were dynamite, you'd be an explosive chap.

Do you remember all those "if Jonny hadn't kicked those points for you" comments in the press back in November?

I need to avoid defending us when there is no need to do so

We easily rolled a side in their own stadium when they were playing their hearts out – busting the proverbial gut. It will do nicely.

How about Scotland though – three penalties to show for two full games in the tournament – and that from a team that beat the Boks in November.

quote: It was reported here as a knee.

That’s right. And not serious either. Robinson and Back are doubts though. Still the next game is Italy at home. Stimpson will likely come in for Robbo (and that takes the kicking pressure off Wilko too). Worseley may take Backs place (Moody still injured).

quote: Kiwi bashing yet again? ...

No No! The fact he was a Kiwi was incidental rather than a defining characteristic. He just didn’t seem to understand either front row play or conduct in the ruck to my mind. If it makes you feel better the Aussie ref in Paris was far worse and denied France a much larger win.

Referee of the weekend was in the Rome match – and, oh look, Mr Spreadbury is English.

You are fairly right about the pundits. Apparently a two score plus margin in an away match is a huge failure these days. I treat it fairly philosophically. At the risk of provoking Finbar to mention therapy again you get used to the press, foreign press in particular, rubbishing England. It means very little. I can even watch amused as Wales claim a ‘moral’ victory. History books do not record moral victories after all.

And as for the Celtic loading on Planet Rugby’s current Grand Slam poll I can even find that funny – Ireland favourites with France next up? Perlease! You could have driven a bus through their defensive pattern many times on Saturday – apparently Italians don’t drive buses?

	24-02-2003 20:26									#314
	Report from the frontline Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

The first round of the Super 12 in SA, provided little more for SA rugby than confirmation that it will be the Stormers who fly the flag in this year's competition. It would be premature to read too much into the opening weekend, but the results did strongly suggest that the 2001 feat of having two teams from the Republic in the semi-finals is unlikely to be repeated this year.

The Sharks, in slipping to a 40-18 defeat at Newlands, confirmed that they are going to find life tough without Mark Andrews. They were completely overpowered in the very areas where they have put it over the Stormers in the past. Yet, for all that, it might not all be lost for the Sharks. They do boast greater depth at the back this year.

The Cats were completely outplayed at forward by the Bulls . So what of the Bulls? Only Cats supporters would deny that it was great to see the perennial wooden-spoonists starting the tournament on such a positive note and who knows that it might do to their confidence as they head overseas. But the Bulls still rely chiefly on the grinding forward play that brought them success in the Currie Cup rather than the more attacking game they will need if they want to progress in the Super 12. So while the Bulls have started well, it is hard to rank him at this stage alongside the Stormers as possible contenders for a place in the semi-finals.

	25-02-2003 01:51									#315
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: How about Scotland though – three penalties to show for two full games in the tournament – and that from a team that beat the Boks in November

They performed so badly that the French considered (rightly) they didn't play well crushing them by 38 points to 3. I really believe Italy has a chance to beat them too.

I wouldn't be so sure about the fate of Ireland-England. The match against France will tell us more.

I am afraid that the tournament this year will look like 2 3 nations tournaments considering the level of play shown by Welsh and Scots (Italy is actually playing better than ever but they are still not up there I think).

	25-02-2003 07:47									#316
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Havak I need to avoid defending us when there is no need to do so

Precisely. Just an alcoholic's first step to recovery is to admit the existence of the problem, a rugby supporter sharing a national lack of self esteem must admit the lack of self esteem exists. Only then can the problem be addressed. Via therapy.

	25-02-2003 07:50									#317
	Support Apolyton

quote: Originally posted by LDiCesare I am afraid that the tournament this year will look like 2 3 nations tournaments considering the level of play shown by Welsh and Scots (Italy is actually playing better than ever but they are still not up there I think).

But, in recent memory anyway, hasn't it really only ever been a 2 or 3 Nations tournament? Or, to put it another way, when was the last time it was a bone fide 5 Nations tournament? I exclude Italy for obvious reasons.

	25-02-2003 08:08									#318
	Remove this text

After today, our computers at work are all going to be locked down with proxy settings, and all use will be monitored. So I guess I will only be able to post from home on the weekend. I'll definitely be posting after super 12 games!

Oh well, I can still go to tech-related websites, so I will probably make better use of my down-time at work and start studying for certifications or something.

	25-02-2003 14:21									#319
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Or, to put it another way, when was the last time it was a bone fide 5 Nations tournament?

1999. When ScoTland edged it from England on points difference and France finished last. Yes, seriously!

quote: After today, our computers at work are all going to be locked down with proxy settings, and all use will be monitored

Seriously bad news. Unfortunately web control is the next big thing in Systems Management at the moment and lots of places are doing this. What surprises me is that you are a Kiwi in the NH and you are not either playing or coaching Union Professionally.

	25-02-2003 15:23									#320
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

I'd like you advice please Finbar - are we looking at a good one here?

Tigers hunt an 'Irish' player to add to the squad

	25-02-2003 16:18									#321
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by Havak I'd like you advice please Finbar - are we looking at a good one here? Tigers hunt an 'Irish' player to add to the squad

You've probably seen enough of him with the Wallabies to judge for yourself. He's been a regular selection for a couple of years. He's quick and strong, his skills are good. He was close to being dropped last season but turned in a couple of good games that saved him. Some people thought he was lucky to make the last NH tour, and that he made it largely because of injuries to younger, longer-term possibilities with more variety to their game. Which is his major drawback at the highest level. As a centre, which is the only position he can play, he's too one-dimensional. He hits it up. That said, he hits it up very powerfully and, if he makes a break, his speed makes him very hard to stop. He's scored his share of tries for the Wallabies. If that's what you're looking for, he will serve you well.

I'm not surprised he's looking to the NH. I think he knew his days were numbered. One only hopes that the knee injury isn't too serious.

	25-02-2003 16:22									#322
	Increase Your PM Length

Sad news Caligastia, you are catch again by Big Brother. I Hope you will take some time to keep in touch with us the week-end.

	25-02-2003 16:24									#323
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Havak 1999. When ScoTland edged it from England on points difference and France finished last. Yes, seriously!

Okay, apart from that obviously one-off occasion?

quote: Seriously bad news. Unfortunately web control is the next big thing in Systems Management at the moment and lots of places are doing this.

There's an obvious answer - work from home!

quote: What surprises me is that you are a Kiwi in the NH and you are not either playing or coaching Union Professionally.

He's turned down numerous offers, apparently, including one from Leicester.

	25-02-2003 16:25									#324
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin Sad news Caligastia, you are catch again by Big Brother. I Hope you will take some time to keep in touch with us the week-end.

OTOH, Tamerlin, we can wreak havoc here during the week without a moderator!

	25-02-2003 16:34									#325
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

You are a very naughty boy Finbar... when do we start?

	25-02-2003 16:35									#326
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

We already have!

	25-02-2003 16:38									#327
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote: Originally posted by Havak Unfortunately web control is the next big thing in Systems Management at the moment and lots of places are doing this.

Spoken like a Systems Manager! Which explains why he's the only one in his business happily posting from work!

	25-02-2003 18:22									#328
	Support Apolyton

quote: If that's what you're looking for, he will serve you well.

I’m quite happy if we sign him. That aspect of play will serve us well. It’s almost certainly a signing that looks to cover the absence of Ollie Smith for RWC duty and to give him two Aussie veterans to learn from for a prolonged period. Tug Boat has good ball skills and solid vision but he lacks in ‘hitting’ it up – doesn’t break the line with any regularity. I suspect Kafer has one more season in him with us – I’d be surprised if they signed this chap for less than two seasons first up. It should help Smith come into his own at just 21.

quote: One only hopes that the knee injury isn't too serious.

Whatever his career plans I echo that sentiment.

Healey may be fit in two weeks apparently. I’m sure you wanted to know?

quote: I Hope you will take some time to keep in touch with us the week-end.

On the plus side he will not have to suffer too many ‘hooks’ from me as I struggle with my 56k weekend link. And who will start the threads if we fill them up during the week?

quote: Okay, apart from that obviously one-off occasion?

Well Wales won it using mathematical guile in 94?

Seriously Finbar it’s been a fairly two horse race since the late 80s in actual fact. The shake up of English rugby commenced in 1988 and I think I’m right when I say I think we have only finished as low as third once since then. When Wales and Scotland got those maths based wins it was England they pipped to the posts.

quote: There's an obvious answer - work from home!

I chose the wrong type of career path – but I still suggest this occasionally!

quote: He's turned down numerous offers, apparently, including one from Leicester.

The Leicester Lions are a very strong side within the county – he would have done them proud I don’t doubt.

quote: Spoken like a Systems Manager! Which explains why he's the only one in his business happily posting from work!

Ssshhh!!!! Someone might hear you.

I disagree with it actually, and it hasn’t been implemented here as yet. There is pressure - but I will resist any moves to do so. Happy staff are staff you treat like adults to my mind.

	26-02-2003 06:57									#329
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by Havak Tug Boat has good ball skills and solid vision but he lacks in ?hitting? it up ? doesn?t break the line with any regularity.

That was never his go, though he was capable of it. He organised others to do the hard work. Sensible chap.

quote: Healey may be fit in two weeks apparently. I?m sure you wanted to know?

Must mean I have a dental appointment in two weeks. They say disappointment travels in pairs.

quote: On the plus side he will not have to suffer too many ?hooks? from me as I struggle with my 56k weekend link. And who will start the threads if we fill them up during the week?

Looks like the baton will have to pass. I can hear Tamerlin cranking up from here.

quote: Seriously Finbar it?s been a fairly two horse race since the late 80s in actual fact.

That's what I meant. So presumably, prior to then, things were relatively equal? Or, in fact, I'd imagine Wales might have been a strength back in their halcyon days?

quote: I chose the wrong type of career path ? but I still suggest this occasionally!

One simple tip - start your own business.

quote: I disagree with it actually, and it hasn?t been implemented here as yet. There is pressure - but I will resist any moves to do so. Happy staff are staff you treat like adults to my mind.

Look at Alexander's Horse. He has managed to go way beyond Deity level around here - including his myriad post count reductions for misbehaviour - while posting from work without interfering with his work. OTOH, there will always be some idiot who abuses the system, but they can usually be sorted out. I'd go mad without this place to escape to!

	26-02-2003 07:01									#330
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Havak Seriously bad news. Unfortunately web control is the next big thing in Systems Management at the moment and lots of places are doing this. What surprises me is that you are a Kiwi in the NH and you are not either playing or coaching Union Professionally.

Well, I certainly would be more involved if I had the time. Last year I was playing on and off in a club here in NYC, but since going back to school I just haven't had the time.

The reason for this policy at my work is because of the abuses of the internet outside my department (the IT dept). Hopefully when it has been proven that we are not a part of the problem, things will go back to normal. Being in the IT dept means that I have certain skills of course, and I could easily bypass the proxy server, but I don't feel like risking my job just at the moment.