13-02-2003 09:19									#91
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quote: Originally posted by Berzerker Btw, this thread is just more proof that liberals hate treating people equally under the law.

I am stunned that a Libertarian is talking about equality. What did you do to the real Berzerker?

	13-02-2003 09:19									#92
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As loinburger said, you can crudely implement progressive consumption tax through luxury tax. But why would you want to? That would just be encouraging investment over consumption.

	13-02-2003 09:19									#93
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One more point, I found it interesting how NE liberals tried to get a regional exemption from the luxury tax increase passed under Clinton and the Democrats. Their rationale? The luxury tax was killing the boat/yacht building business in their area and rich people were buying boats abroad to avoid the tax. Screw the rich and you screw the little guy too. There's that "trickle down" theory in action...

	13-02-2003 09:21									#94
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quote: Originally posted by Berzerker Btw, this thread is just more proof that liberals hate treating people equally under the law.

Oh my God. How the hell do you get that? What do you think their main objective is?

	13-02-2003 09:23									#95
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Treating people inequally based on how much they earn . Equality means the same treatment regardless of all factors - including income. In this case, inequal treatment results in societal good, but it's still inequal.

	13-02-2003 09:24									#96
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The government intervenes unequally in favour of the rich in enforcing classical property laws, so they should damn well pay more.

	13-02-2003 09:25									#97
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Frogger -

quote: No, it's just more proof that classical libertarians try to disguise their marked preference for the upper echelons of society with talk of fairness.

Where did I mention "fairness"? That's a leftist term used to treat people differently under the law.

UR -

quote: I am stunned that a Libertarian is talking about equality. What did you do to the real Berzerker?

You don't listen much to libertarians then. I believe if you are going to have an income tax, then it should be applied to everyone equally, not "progressively" which is another BS term for treating people unequally.

	13-02-2003 09:25									#98
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Or just give up enforcing property law at all...



I give the current economic system 1 week if that happened.

	13-02-2003 09:26									#99
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quote: Originally posted by Berzerker Frogger - Where did I mention "fairness"? That's a leftist term used to treat people differently under the law.

replace with "equality" then.

	13-02-2003 09:26									#100
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capitalism...
meat masslootingalism.

	13-02-2003 09:28									#101
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Don't worry; we'd have the soviets up and running in short order.

Or maybe they'd shoot me as a sputnik.

	13-02-2003 09:30									#102
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quote: Originally posted by Berzerker Frogger - Where did I mention "fairness"? That's a leftist term used to treat people differently under the law.

The law treats people differently regardless of the Left. That's why we want fairness.

quote: Originally posted by Berzerker UR - You don't listen much to libertarians then. I believe if you are going to have an income tax, then it should be applied to everyone equally, not "progressively" which is another BS term for treating people unequally.

Christ, not again with the terms. What is the problem with the terms?

	13-02-2003 09:30									#103
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quote: Originally posted by Berzerker You don't listen much to libertarians then. I believe if you are going to have an income tax, then it should be applied to everyone equally, not "progressively" which is another BS term for treating people unequally.

Your form of "equality" is not real equality at all, because the lower income groups have a much less disposable income than the rich.

	13-02-2003 09:30									#104
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Forcing the poor to pay for the government is much less fair than forcing the rich to pay for the government as the poor have less of a capacity to spend money on the government than the rich. Therefore, regressive taxes are invariably a much greater assault on liberty than progressive taxes.

	13-02-2003 09:31									#105
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Communism...
Shared misery and deprivation.

	13-02-2003 09:31									#106
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This is like the "slay a Libertarian for Jesus" thread.

	13-02-2003 09:32									#107
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin Communism... Shared misery and deprivation.

Socialism: shared wealth and freedom

	13-02-2003 09:33									#108
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quote: Originally posted by Goingonit As loinburger said, you can crudely implement progressive consumption tax through luxury tax. But why would you want to? That would just be encouraging investment over consumption.

It depends on the rates and other taxs, say, a capital gains tax.

	13-02-2003 09:33									#109
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Wow - even Ramo's joining in!

	13-02-2003 09:34									#110
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin Communism... Shared misery and deprivation.

Capitalism: heartless exploitation of the masses.

	13-02-2003 09:34									#111
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quote: Originally posted by Berzerker You don't listen much to libertarians then.

Your theories are the simplest of all. It's just that you can't communicate with people because you have such problems with the terms people use.

	13-02-2003 09:35									#112
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Capital gains isn't the same as investment. It turns out to actually be very hard to tax investment itself.

	13-02-2003 09:37									#113
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The government itself is set up in the interest of the rich. Of course, they should pay more.

	13-02-2003 09:38									#114
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Duncan -

quote: Oh my God. How the hell do you get that? What do you think their main objective is?

Simple, look at the furor from the left over trying to treat people equally. Their main objective? Playing Robin Hood without the risk.

Frogger -

quote: The government intervenes unequally in favour of the rich in enforcing classical property laws, so they should damn well pay more.

So we should treat people unequally because government does that now? Hmm...I would think the proper solution is to protect the property rights of everyone.

	13-02-2003 09:38									#115
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The government is set up in the interest of the poor. Cause there are more of them.

	13-02-2003 09:42									#116
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I dont think that taxation is stealing because the government is providing you a service. Of course, it has a monopoly, but you need a government to keep market failure from occuring.

	13-02-2003 09:43									#117
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Goinginit and Berzerker,

The rich need the government to protect their property. Why the hell should we pay to protect their property? I don't want to protect their property. I want to take their property.

	13-02-2003 09:43									#118
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The poor need the government to protect them from the rich. All the rich need to protect them from the poor is money. Read your friend Marx, he'll explain it.

	13-02-2003 09:43									#119
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quote: Originally posted by Berzerker Duncan - Simple, look at the furor from the left over trying to treat people equally. Their main objective? Playing Robin Hood without the risk. Frogger - So we should treat people unequally because government does that now? Hmm...I would think the proper solution is to protect the property rights of everyone.

You have the idea that classical property law is fair. I disagree with that assumption.

	13-02-2003 09:45									#120
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quote: Originally posted by Goingonit The poor need the government to protect them from the rich. All the rich need to protect them from the poor is money. Read your fried Marx, he'll explain it.

The government stops the poor from rioting, killing the rich and taking it for themselves. They do so through bribery (the Welfare State) and direct threat of force (police, army etc.)