26-02-2003 11:29									#151
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think different

	26-02-2003 11:31									#152
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Exactly.

That would be ideal, IMO.
US currency, US military protection, near autonomy...

hmm....

	26-02-2003 11:31									#153
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Che, if we were going to pull a 'Mexico' on Alberta, we would have done it to Canada already.

	26-02-2003 11:32									#154
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara I didn't reply then because I was away from the boards for a few days. Anyway, the report I read was in the 1980s, so there's no way I'm gonna bother traking it down for you. Needless to say, the psoition of the State Department then (1986) was that we weren't interested in any part of Canada except BC, and that mainly for a land connection with Alaska.

Hehe. I think that the oil companies had not spoken in that report.

	26-02-2003 11:33									#155
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither Hehe. I think that the oil companies had not spoken in that report.

Not to mention that the Alaska highway runs through Alberta, not BC.

	26-02-2003 11:35									#156
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I don't see why Alberta couldn't be a full fledged state. It'd be good for the economy, good for securing oil reserves, good for getting new recruits for the US military, good for getting votes for the Republican Party

	26-02-2003 11:36									#157
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quote: Originally posted by Asher That would be ideal, IMO. US currency, US military protection, near autonomy... hmm....

Do you have any clue what we did to Puerto Rico? The island is a ****-hole. We've sterilized 42% of the women of child-bearing age. The economy is totally in the tank.

	26-02-2003 11:38									#158
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither Hehe. I think that the oil companies had not spoken in that report.

Oil companies like the oil to be outside the US. The country of Alberta would have a much harder time standing up to the US and our corporations than the state of Alberta would. Plus, you wouldn't be let into NAFTA.

	26-02-2003 11:38									#159
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Do you have any clue what we did to Puerto Rico? The island is a ****-hole. We've sterilized 42% of the women of child-bearing age. The economy is totally in the tank.

Pureto Rico was never rich; Alberta currently is. Puerto Rico currently sucks up tons of Welfare Dollars, yet doesn't have to pay federal taxes.

	26-02-2003 11:38									#160
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If Alberta became a state, it would have a better chance of producing a president than any of the current states in that region.

	26-02-2003 11:38									#161
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Do you have any clue what we did to Puerto Rico? The island is a ****-hole. We've sterilized 42% of the women of child-bearing age. The economy is totally in the tank.

I'm talking about the perks of being a US territory.

Alberta isn't in the same boat as Puerto Rico was. The reason why the US would love to get Alberta as a US territory is the huge guaranteed oil reserves.

It doesn't make ANY sense why they wouldn't want the province. Better educated than America on average by a good deal, abundant natural resources, low crime, contiguous with the main US states...

	26-02-2003 11:39									#162
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Che, I'm calling BS on that statistic. Put up.

	26-02-2003 11:41									#163
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Oil companies like the oil to be outside the US.

Why do you think that...

quote: The country of Alberta would have a much harder time standing up to the US and our corporations than the state of Alberta would.

Look at US investment figures for Alberta.
Look at how many Americans live in Alberta.

quote: Plus, you wouldn't be let into NAFTA.

Why not? If they didn't let us into NAFTA, your gas prices (particularly natural gas, considering most of the Western US gets natural gas from Alberta) would go way up...

	26-02-2003 11:42									#164
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quote: Originally posted by The Mad Monk Che, I'm calling BS on that statistic. Put up.

I don't have the movie on hand. It's called, La Operacion. Ask any Puerto Rican nationalist about it.

	26-02-2003 11:46									#165
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quote: Originally posted by Asher Why not? If they didn't let us into NAFTA,

Cuz Canada wouldn't let you in out of spite for leaving the Federation.

Oil companies like oil to be outside the US because they don't have to deal with federal regulations or with the states. Independent Alberta can be pushed around. Alberta the state cannot be.

And the number of Americans living in Alberta and the amount of money invested there is meaningless as far as getting annexed is concerned. Yes, Alberta might want to be annexed. Doesn't mean we want you.

	26-02-2003 11:47									#166
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Oil companies like the oil to be outside the US. The country of Alberta would have a much harder time standing up to the US and our corporations than the state of Alberta would. Plus, you wouldn't be let into NAFTA.

We might be willing to take our chances. Thanks.

btw, should i mention that sentiment in BC is also largely towards telling Ottawa where to shove it?

Now, how would an oil and mineral rich new nation with ports on the Pacific effect your equations?

	26-02-2003 11:49									#167
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara I don't have the movie on hand. It's called, La Operacion. Ask any Puerto Rican nationalist about it.

...and if I ask those who are non-nationalist, what will the response be?

	26-02-2003 11:49									#168
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Cuz Canada wouldn't let you in out of spite for leaving the Federation.

They would, trust me. They're quite dependent on Alberta energy, it'd hurt them more than us if they didn't remove tariffs on oil imports. Oil and gas demand tends to be constant, the people getting the shaft would be the Canadians and Americans paying higher prices due to tariffs...

quote: Oil companies like oil to be outside the US because they don't have to deal with federal regulations or with the states.

Sorry Che, this is bull.
The US oil companies hate having to deal with Canada for oil. It's true. Why do they hate it? Well, look what the NEP did in the 80s to them. Look at Kyoto now.

The Canadian Federal Government is borderline hostile with US oil companies, FAR more than the US Federal Government.

quote: Doesn't mean we want you.

Che, why wouldn't you want the province?

Do you just not want us because we're right wing, is that what this is about?

	26-02-2003 11:50									#169
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Cuz Canada wouldn't let you in out of spite for leaving the Federation. Oil companies like oil to be outside the US because they don't have to deal with federal regulations or with the states. Independent Alberta can be pushed around. Alberta the state cannot be. And the number of Americans living in Alberta and the amount of money invested there is meaningless as far as getting annexed is concerned. Yes, Alberta might want to be annexed. Doesn't mean we want you.

Right. So we should continue to take it from Eastern Canada on the off chance that we would get it rougher on our own.

Sorry. I don't buy your gloom and doom.

btw, I don't favour seperation. However, even a relative nationalist like me has his limits on how much Albertans should take before we say enough.

	26-02-2003 11:55									#170
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Asher:

quote: Not to mention that the Alaska highway runs through Alberta, not BC.

Mile 0 of the Alaska Highway is in Dawson Creek, BC.

http://www.alaskan.com/bells/alaska_highway.html

The US does not need Alberta for a link to Alaska. Only BC and the Yukon.

Che:

quote: We've sterilized 42% of the women of child-bearing age. The economy is totally in the tank.

You are close. This source cites 35%.

"
Probably one of the most insidious U.S. population control programs in the Third World has been in Puerto Rico, which has the highest incidence of sterilization in the world. A government issued survey found that 35% of all women of childbearing age there had been sterilized--more than one out of every three such women.45 Thousands of women are sterilized each month in U.S. funded family planning clinics there, which provides them free of charge.46 many sterilizations are performed postpartum, which is standard procedure in some teaching hospitals for women with two or more children. Welfare women, people on food stamps, and people who want housing are all receiving special orientations about overpopulation and sterilization.
It is so common on the island that it is commonly referred to as "the operation."

The primary goal behind this U.S. population plan is to reduce the working class population on the island in order to make way for U.S. corporations. A report of a Puerto Rican economic policy making group proposes reducing the working sector of the population in order to reduce unemployment, which is by some estimates, as high as 30%.47 Heavy industries, mainly U.S. petroleum and petro chemical industries, have moved onto the island in recent years, displacing many rural and light industry workers. These heavy industries require a relatively small workforce--the excess working population must somehow be "disposed" of, either through sterilization or forced migration.

The fact that sterilization programs in Puerto Rico are being carried on in a colonial context in a nation where people do not have control over their own lives and their government makes the term "voluntary" sterilization totally inapplicable. It is our responsibility to put an end to these kinds of programs, just as it is our responsibility to put an end to the forced sterilizations in this country as well.

http://www.cwluherstory.com/CWLUArchive/cesa.html

	26-02-2003 11:57									#171
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quote: Originally posted by obiwan18 Asher: Mile 0 of the Alaska Highway is in Dawson Creek, BC. The US does not need Alberta for a link to Alaska. Only BC and the Yukon.

I stand corrected, someone else on these forums had mentioned it went through Alberta the other day.

	26-02-2003 12:01									#172
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quote: Originally posted by obiwan18 Che: You are close. This source cites 35%.[/url]

Ten years can make quite a bit of difference, can't it.

	26-02-2003 12:08									#173
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Hey, don't pick on me. I'm trying to help you.

	26-02-2003 12:09									#174
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quote: Originally posted by Asher I stand corrected, someone else on these forums had mentioned it went through Alberta the other day.

And it doesn't go through Alberta at some, very large, point?

	26-02-2003 12:10									#175
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1977!?

Never mind that:

quote: The primary goal behind this U.S. population plan is to reduce the working class population on the island in order to make way for U.S. corporations. A report of a Puerto Rican economic policy making group proposes reducing the working sector of the population in order to reduce unemployment, which is by some estimates, as high as 30%.47 Heavy industries, mainly U.S. petroleum and petro chemical industries, have moved onto the island in recent years, displacing many rural and light industry workers. These heavy industries require a relatively small workforce--the excess working population must somehow be "disposed" of, either through sterilization or forced migration.

...and here I was thinking that corporations liked high unemployment, because it guarateed low wages.

Do you have anything more credible?

	26-02-2003 12:10									#176
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither And it doesn't go through Alberta at some, very large, point?

It could very well do that. I don't know, having never had the urge to drive to Alaska.

	26-02-2003 12:10									#177
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Nope. Look on a map.

Dawson Creek is close to the Alberta border, but at no point the Alaska highway enters Alberta.

	26-02-2003 12:16									#178
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Mad Monk:

Read the entire article.

Yes, 1977, but you denied something like this ever happened.

IF you don't like the source, find a better one that does verify your claim. Good luck.

	26-02-2003 12:16									#179
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Oh, really?

Care to view that section in grey?

	26-02-2003 12:18									#180
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Well technically speaking the part in grey isn't the Alaska Highway, it just connects the Alaska Highway to the US.