09-04-2003 21:41									#121
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GePap,

	09-04-2003 21:42									#122
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Glad to see things have been going well in Iraq. There hasn't been as much terrorism as I thought, only a few suicide bombers.

And now comes the hard part. Winning the war was easy, now the US will have to win the peace.

Now, if during the rebuilding, the US doesn't use the opposition Iraqi National Congress pudwhack Ahmed Chalabi (aristocratic turncoat asswipe) as a puppet; and if multi-national corporations don't exploit the situation for profit; AND if there isn't a terrorist rejuvination... then I'll say that Bush did a good job.

	09-04-2003 22:04									#123
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Uh, they haven't won yet.

The people dancing are most likely Shias who've been persecuted by the Sunni minority. Saddam is not popular with them - it's no wonder they'd be happy at the invasion. There aren't many of these north of Baghdad, which is still to my knowledge in Iraqi control.

The hard part starts now. I wonder what the Iraqis will do when they find out how many strings are attached to their "democracy".

	09-04-2003 22:06									#124
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Tomorrow we work, tomorrow we fight.

Today...

Today we dance!

	09-04-2003 22:07									#125
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what will likely go right over some heads here is that those who celebrate have been gathered from all over irak in order to come in bagdat... there' not even bagatees...

	09-04-2003 22:09									#126
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btw, no WMD found yet, right?

	09-04-2003 22:11									#127
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One question to all the "dancers": you know, they are looting as well; which is the :looting: smiley?

This one?

Or this one?:

Or this one?

Or do we do a combination?

Come on everybody! LOOT!

	09-04-2003 22:14									#128
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You know, we should create a video compelation of dancing peoples:

you know, when the Soviet Union came down, the Berlin Wall, when the Somoza family was ousted from Nicaragua, when the Shah left Iran, when Batista left Havana, ..........

	09-04-2003 22:18									#129
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I don't think the "war" went much different than expected. I thought it would be a little faster, but with slightly higher casualties. The coalition slowed down a bit, did some extra recon, and reduced the casualties.

However, enjoy your celebration, because it won't get any better than this.

Obviously the people who aren't thrilled are not going to be out in the street protesting. So you only see the ones who are happy. You can be sure that many remain who are p!ssed.

The BEST CASE scenario for the future:
1. Thousands of militant guerillas engage in hit and run tactics against occupying forces.
(How many of the Iraqi RG etc remain at large?)

2. Competing and incompatible political interests in Iraq prove unable to effecting govern the country. The coalition inserts leadership that lacks widespread support. (like in Afganistan). Without strong central control backed by force, warlords and strongmen locally vie for power. Skirmishes and bombings are commonplace. Coalition and/or UN peacekeepers maintain the semblance of control, which deteriorates as the numbers of foreign troops are reduced over the following months.

3. Eventually, a competent, ruthless military leader, manages to establish control over the country, using whatever means necessary to repress incompatible competing interests.

4. The US announces that the previous regime was corrupt and establishes diplomatic relations with the new leader.

5. This leader, call him Hassam Suddein, calls an election. Widespread reports of fraud do not impede him from declaring a decisive victory. The US seems uninterested in the electoral irregularities in Iraq.

5. Over the years, he grows more powerful and becomes increasingly independent of the US. Eventually, the American military intervenes to protect their interests. The US announces that Iraq is once again a member of the Axis of Evil.

	09-04-2003 22:21									#130
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quote: Originally posted by The Mad Viking (How many of the Iraqi RG etc remain at large?)

around 90.000

	09-04-2003 22:24									#131
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I'm afraid there is nothing to celebrate, or at least, not yet. The real war starts mid-August.

	09-04-2003 22:26									#132
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BTW if things are so cheery in bagdat right now ( ) how come the Red Croos has declared impossible to enter the city due to the "chaos that is going on in Bagdat"?


interesting other side

	09-04-2003 22:28									#133
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What are you talking about monkspider? When we attack Iran, Syria, or anyone else?

	09-04-2003 22:28									#134
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Yeahhh! USA! USA!



But this was to be expected. Who really thought US was going to have lots of troubles in this war? Everyone the US would eventually win. But the next challenge? No one knows... I hope it works, since history has a bad record right now of these not working.
But.. until tomorrow?

	09-04-2003 22:32									#135
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quote: Originally posted by GePap One question to all the "dancers": you know, they are looting as well; which is the :looting: smiley? This one? Or this one?: Or this one? Or do we do a combination? Come on everybody! LOOT!

YES!!!

Take back what the Baathist have stolen from you, for all these many years!

Justice comes in many forms.

	09-04-2003 22:33									#136
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Sava- More like friends turning on us. (or from their perspective, we have been turning on them as of late). Something about bio weapons, I dunno. It could be a response of us fighting Persia, or Syria, I'm not sure yet. Then a big economic collapse in mid October. Just watch Bush carefully these next few months. A tough year ahead for us all.

	09-04-2003 22:40									#137
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quote: Originally posted by The Mad Monk YES!!! Take back what the Baathist have stolen from you, for all these many years! Justice comes in many forms.

Oh, yes, public disorder and looting are a form of justice....

So how much can blacks loot from whites in this country? I mean, aren;t they owed somewhat for back wages their ancestors were not paid by white folk's ancestors?

Hey everyone, MM here is getting together a party of ex-Enron employees to loot the homes of various Enron officers..any ex-enron workesr want to join? I mean, its all about the justice, sin't it?

	09-04-2003 22:45									#138
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quote: Originally posted by Ming One of the CNN reporters covering how the Arab Media was covering the story was talking about how the Arab reporters were still wondering where the heck the Iraqi army was. They been hearing about how good they were, and how they were willing to fight to the end, and they have been looking for signs of this, and can't find any... They seem to be scratching their heads...

Too bad our own reporters aren't being as curious about the alleged stockpiles of WoMD. We kept hearing before the war how Saddam was hiding buttloads of chemical and biological weapons, we have been looking for signs of this, and can't find any...

Why aren't we scratching our heads?

	09-04-2003 22:47									#139
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Too bad, so sad.

When I see what the Iraqi people have had to put up with, I can afford to look way for a time with a smile on my face and a song in my heart.

In summary, GePap,

Ppppppbbbbbttttt.

	09-04-2003 22:57									#140
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at MM's reply.

Boris: don;t you get it, it was never about WMD, it was always about liberating Iraq..now stop being a traitor and Saddam lover! Don't you see how Iraqis dance (and loot) today?

Hmmm..now that the war is wrapping up (a week at most until someone calls it victory..can;t have it last more then the first one, now can we?), how long till the issue of Iraq is dropped like a sack of potatoes?

We followed post "liberation" gov of Afghanistan for about 6 month....

I say one year tops before Iraq is relegated to the back pages of the newspapers, even if thousand of GI's will probably (hopefully if this is to come to a good conclusion) in the country.

Any other bets? How long will the US's attention span last?

	09-04-2003 23:09									#141
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quote: Originally posted by GePap at MM's reply. Boris: don;t you get it, it was never about WMD, it was always about liberating Iraq..

rubbish, it was about America getting it's pound of flesh for 9/11, they could n't get OBL so they vented their rage on Saddam, the fact they were able to pass it off as some sort of moral crusade just made it easier.

	09-04-2003 23:09									#142
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Afganistan was very different: The war was a UN coalition (even if the US did most of the heavy lifting,) and the UN set up a summit of Afgan opposition, and rubber stamped the agreed administration, then sat back and let them rule.

Its no real surprise that the Afgans have devolved into a tribal system.

Iraq doesn't have the same tribal warlords. They are very used to a centrally administrated system, so there will be fewer problems, provided we hold on the reins of 'national security' long enough.

	09-04-2003 23:10									#143
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quote: How long will the US's attention span last?

first we need to find the next target. there is still a long way to go for the elections and no gaps are allowed

	09-04-2003 23:20									#144
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quote: Originally posted by SlowwHand Oh, bullshit, MtG. Lancer starts a celebratory thread, Curt spams the **** out of it, and Lancer gets banned? Yeah? You can kiss my ass, too. I'm banning myself for 48, other than Lyrics Thread. Finally! Something I can protest! Unfair! Unfair! Unfair!

Lancer's lucky I didn't give him a week for this:

quote: You're a little worm and I'd take your ****ing head off if you said that to my face, *****.

	09-04-2003 23:24									#145
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quote: Originally posted by spiritof1202 Iraq doesn't have the same tribal warlords. They are very used to a centrally administrated system, so there will be fewer problems, provided we hold on the reins of 'national security' long enough.

Iraq is an Arab country. Tribal and clan loyalties mean a hell of a lot more than nationalism.

Why do you think Saddam's relatives and Tikriti clansmen occupied such a position of power?

What do you think was the driving force behind the rebellion and purge of the Republican Guard in the mid '90s, and the reason they were prohibited from entering Baghdad in force?

A massive central thugocracy (largely clan dominated, but driven on pseudo-socialist totalitarian principles) has dominated tribal and clan power struggles, but nature abhors a power vacuum more than any other kind.

	09-04-2003 23:31									#146
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"With the exception of Egypt, there are no Arab countries, just tribes with flags."

-Charles Glass?

	09-04-2003 23:36									#147
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quote: Boris: don;t you get it, it was never about WMD, it was always about liberating Iraq..

For me, this is true. And for a lot of others, I expect. And if there are no WMD's, that's embarrassing for the politicians, but politicians are paid to risk embarrassment just as soldiers are paid to risk their lives.

Sure, many have died, and more will die. And there are troubled times ahead.

But if we can't dance on an occasion like this, then when can we dance at all?

	09-04-2003 23:43									#148
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Yay USA
The fall of Saddam's regime really made my day


(I didn't read the thread, but I assume it is about the fall of Baghdad ; I know the reconstruction challenge awaits ; but I am really glad today ; the moaning and pessimism will come back tomorrow )

	09-04-2003 23:47									#149
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor (I didn't read the thread, but I assume it is about the fall of Baghdad ; I know the reconstruction challenge awaits ; but I am really glad today ; the moaning and pessimism will come back tomorrow )

stupid frog.

	09-04-2003 23:49									#150
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quote: Originally posted by UberKruX stupid frog.

HEY

Keep it up and you will join the ranks of the restricted...