19-04-2003 01:58									#241
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor If I had understood correctly, the policy that's being put into place in Washington is to : - punish the French - ignore the Germans - forgive the Russians. Well, that's what I heard on French TV, so it is obviously biased, but I wonder what truth exactly there is behind these words. Anyone can tell me what is said in the US about this issue ?

Spiffor: From what I can see here in California the attitude of people runs something like this:

1) Russia is expected to be anti-American so we can't get mad at them for staying true to form.

2) Gerhard was vocal about Germany not taking part but he didn't go out of his way to enfluence other, non-EU, countries against US policy plus no one really expected Germany to help out. Thus many want to give the present German government the cold sholder and then improve relations once Gerhard is gone.

3) France is thought of as a traditional friend and ally so many people really did think Chirac would eventually lend a hand in some small way or failing that to not actively hinder a corner stone US policy. When Chirac decided to not only use French anti-war sentiments to revive his failing political standing but also to become the poster child of anti-US policy in every way he could he pissed alot of American people off. It is these people who have organized the informal boycott agaisnt French made goods.

My thinking is that the boycott will slowly fade away but some people are going to stick to it as long a Chirac is in office.

	19-04-2003 02:00									#242
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paiktis, I'm telling you. The US wouldn't back Turkey. Ok? Good...

	19-04-2003 02:03									#243
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And I'm telling you Lancer, it has backed it up already (just look at all its weapons and geopolitical clout). And even a neutral stance is no good.

You have to actively engage against Turkey (such as freezing US weapons sales to it) in order for us to have a guaranteed result.



Also Greece would have to radically change in order to push back the Turks from Cyprus. Massive money to weapons, militarization of society...

Dangerous games and with lots of casualties.

As one person put it: Greeks have much more to lose than Turks in a war (=stability, economic prosperity, our way of life and peace) for a not at all guaranteed result.


Thus why Greece doesn't get the ball rolling... and goes for it through other means.

	19-04-2003 02:06									#244
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UN resolutions of course call for an immidiate withdrawl of turkish occupation forces from Cyprus anyway... That's why it seemed so funny to us when people talk about UN resolutions not being respected...

	19-04-2003 02:07									#245
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Ok...

	19-04-2003 02:08									#246
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quote: Originally posted by Lancer Menlas, actually it does. I'm boycotting French stuff. I buy what I want. It has nothing to do with Bush, the US goverment... It's personal.

Oh, no ! Lancer is boycotting French stuff ! Damn, we are done, our economy will suffer

Precisely what i want to underline : those are personnal, limited actions.

quote: It's costing France a fortune already

Riiiight
As far as I know, no. Source ?

quote: The French have counter-bocotted

Sorry man, but this is pure bull****. Again, source ?

	19-04-2003 02:08									#247
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OK...

	19-04-2003 02:10									#248
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Come on Paiktiss. We both know UN resolutions get ignored or enforced at the pleasure of the great powers. Most of them end up getting ignored until some power decides to use the resolution as a rubber stamp for one of their pet projects.

	19-04-2003 02:11									#249
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Did I say anything different?

That is exactly what I'm saying!

	19-04-2003 02:11									#250
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All I'm saying is, if you want something bad enough, you DO something about it. If you don't, then don't expect the support of others...

If you do, you might not get the reaction you expect.

Besides, the Brits would help you, particularly since you are enforcing a UN resolution, particularly NOW. The US would have to help the Brits, even if we didn't help on our own...but we would.

	19-04-2003 02:11									#251
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 Did I say anything different? That is exactly what I'm saying!

But I said it better!

	19-04-2003 02:13									#252
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That's a bit fantasy land Lancer...

The geopolitical interests and realities are there and clear, I'm afraid.

	19-04-2003 02:14									#253
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Menlas ...Ok...

	19-04-2003 02:16									#254
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paiktis, not at all. My fantasies involve Britney Spears and a bathtub full of jello, and this isn't like that.

	19-04-2003 02:20									#255
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quote: Originally posted by Lancer paiktis, not at all. My fantasies involve Britney Spears and a bathtub full of jello, and this isn't like that.

That has as many chances of happening as the US (the primary one that matters and can do something to aid) actively helping Greece

	19-04-2003 02:22									#256
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Yeah, you're right. I'm not going to call her back this time.

	19-04-2003 02:29									#257
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Right, tell her I said hi