11-07-2003 13:33									#241
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Of course you may, Frozzy. We're very generous with our betting system. Newbies are gifted 100 Civ Gold - we took a vote last year and decided it was the only stable currency in the world - and invited to waste it how they choose.

I'll update the bets on the match accordingly.

Oh, and we tend to bet margins more often than not. The margins arrived at by consensus. You probably understand margin betting, but just in case - for tomorrow night, we've given the Boks 12.5 points start. That means, for Caligastia to win, the Boks can lose by fewer than 12.5 points, draw the match, or even win it. For those backing the Wallabies, they simply have to win by more than 12.5 points.

Last edited by finbar on 11-07-2003 at 13:40

	11-07-2003 13:37									#242
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First Betting Update

And a big welcome into our Den of Rugby Iniquity to Frozzy!

So the bets currently recorded - with a margin to the Boks of 12.5 points - are as follows:

Boks
Caligastia 30

Wallabies
Havak 10
finbar 25
Frozzy 15

And the available pool is 80 Civ Gold.

So the updated Bank A/c is as follows:

Andydog 286.5
Bearcat 80.5
Caligastia 67-30 = 37
finbar 56.5-25 = 31.5
Frozzy 100-15 = 85
Havak 106.55 = 96.55
Journeyman 122.5
LDiCesares 141.8
Mickeyj 143.5
NeoStar 114
ravagon 77.75
redbull 80
Tamerlin 69.3

	11-07-2003 13:42									#243
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quote: Yes, logic agrees with you, but then better Wallaby teams than this have succumbed over there. Still, this time it's at sea level.

Yes the second Scottish test was at altitude and it was clear the Scots were struggling badly in the last quarter as a consequence.

quote: Well, if rankings are important. I honestly don't think they mean a thing. I didn't think they meant a thing when we were on top.

I agree – the ranking is of little interest to me to be honest. But it bugs a minority of other Wallaby and Kiwi fans so one has to enjoy it a little. I’m actually far more interested in the head to head stats we are building. I’d love to see us record three wins over France in just six months – but they’ll be desperate to avoid that.

I see Eddie has had his usual pre-game opinion piece on refs. Bizarrely telling them to get fitter before then launching into the usual advice on what they should look for early on and be harshest on. It’s long past time he stopped this little ritual I think.

One of my rugger heroes turns 40 today – the man who preceded J**** as our club skipper and England’s former rock at number 8, one Dean ‘Deano’ Richards. Note the similarly inventive nick name out of the J**** mould.

Not only is Dean one hell of a nice bloke who makes time to talk to anyone he also has the rare distinction of being an Englishman who (legally) winded Campo and gave the world five minutes relief from those endless pearls of wisdom.

Even now I’ve never seen a player who can match Dean’s knack of wrapping up and turning people over in the tackle – it was awesome watching him work sometimes.

Happy Birthday Deano!

	11-07-2003 16:21									#244
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quote: Originally posted by Havak one Dean ‘Deano’ Richards. Note the similarly inventive nick name out of the J**** mould.

Who called the Poms an unimaginative, colourless lot?

quote: Not only is Dean one hell of a nice bloke who makes time to talk to anyone he also has the rare distinction of being an Englishman who (legally) winded Campo and gave the world five minutes relief from those endless pearls of wisdom. Even now I’ve never seen a player who can match Dean’s knack of wrapping up and turning people over in the tackle – it was awesome watching him work sometimes. Happy Birthday Deano!

I hadn't realised you were a sentimentalist.

	11-07-2003 18:05									#245
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Just one of my many hidden qualities... or failings?

	11-07-2003 18:33									#246
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As I'm the only one backing the Boks, I'd like to reduce my bet to 1 gold. If I win I still get all your money, right?

	11-07-2003 19:17									#247
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia As I'm the only one backing the Boks, I'd like to reduce my bet to 1 gold. If I win I still get all your money, right?

Too late, I've already embezzled your 30.

	11-07-2003 19:18									#248
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Just one of my many hidden qualities... or failings?

I didn't know tighthead props got sentimental. Except deep in their cups, reminiscing over various opposing testicles they've removed with their teeth.

	11-07-2003 19:29									#249
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quote: Originally posted by finbar Too late, I've already embezzled your 30.

Enjoy your 15 gold profit if you win. Don't spend it all at once.

Hmmm...did I get that right? The pool is 80 gold and you put in 50% of the money for the Wallaby-backers so you get 40 back if you win...correct?

	11-07-2003 20:35									#250
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It's certainly true that happy sack injuries will get wheeled out every time veterans are raising a glass. They just seem to stick in the memory better than busted fingers, broken teeth and stud inflicted scars.

	11-07-2003 20:41									#251
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I haven't even played that much rugby in my life, but I still managed to break a finger. If you haven't broken a bone you just haven't played enough rugby.

	12-07-2003 06:39									#252
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia Enjoy your 15 gold profit if you win. Don't spend it all at once. Hmmm...did I get that right? The pool is 80 gold and you put in 50% of the money for the Wallaby-backers so you get 40 back if you win...correct?

Yep. If you win, you, naturally, get the pot of 80 Civ Gold.

If we win, I get 40, Havak gets 16, and Frozzie gets 24.

	12-07-2003 06:52									#253
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quote: Originally posted by Havak It's certainly true that happy sack injuries will get wheeled out every time veterans are raising a glass. They just seem to stick in the memory better than busted fingers, broken teeth and stud inflicted scars.

Yes, I'm waiting for David Attenborough's documentary on the rare species known as Props and Hookers entitled "Walking With Front Rowers". I can see him now, huddled in a corner of a bar, whispering into his microphone, describing this vaguely sub-human species as they go about their foraging for crisps, refreshing themselves by lying under the beer taps with their mouths open, interrupted only by the occasional outbreak of rutting in which they apply the squirrel grip to themselves to see whose eyes can water the most.

In fact, I must email the BBC and suggest the concept to them.

	12-07-2003 08:04									#255
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Obviously Havak would get the gig as Technical Advisor for a fee of a carton of crisps and a keg of bitter.

	12-07-2003 08:36									#256
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Just to irritate everybody (sorry Cali ), now that bets are in, - 10 on the Springboks please. - Unless, of course, its already started.
It screens at 20:30 WA time but I'm not sure if thats live.

quote: ... he also has the rare distinction of being an Englishman who (legally) winded Campo and gave the world five minutes relief from those endless pearls of wisdom.

Undoubtably qualified for sainthood.

	12-07-2003 08:37									#257
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dot creation post

	12-07-2003 09:04									#258
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quote: Originally posted by ravagon Just to irritate everybody (sorry Cali ), now that bets are in, - 10 on the Springboks please. - Unless, of course, its already started. It screens at 20:30 WA time but I'm not sure if thats live.

If not live, it's pretty close. I think it's a 3pm kick off over there.

I've recorded your bet. Is that 10? Or minus 10?

	12-07-2003 09:08									#259
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Second Betting Update

So the bets currently recorded - with a margin to the Boks of 12.5 points - are as follows:

Boks
Caligastia 30
ravagon 10

Wallabies
Havak 10
finbar 25
Frozzy 15

And the available pool is 90 Civ Gold.

So the updated Bank A/c is as follows:

Andydog 286.5
Bearcat 80.5
Caligastia 67-30 = 37
finbar 56.5-25 = 31.5
Frozzy 100-15 = 85
Havak 106.55 = 96.55
Journeyman 122.5
LDiCesares 141.8
Mickeyj 143.5
NeoStar 114
ravagon 77.75-10 = 67.75
redbull 80
Tamerlin 69.3

In wonder if, in la petite grenouille's absence, we should record a bet for him? Something like his 69.3 Civ Gold on the ref applying the laws absolutely perfectly to the extent that he would find nothing to grizzle about?

	12-07-2003 10:22									#260
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quote: Originally posted by finbar In wonder if, in la petite grenouille's absence, we should record a bet for him? Something like his 69.3 Civ Gold on the ref applying the laws absolutely perfectly to the extent that he would find nothing to grizzle about?

On his behalf, I'd like to know just what sort of odds you plan on giving for something like that.

[Something you may find useful as a frame of reference - there are theoretically about 10^80 nucleons in the universe and 1 in a hydrogen atom. This might generate a probability a tad on the high side though. ]

	12-07-2003 11:19									#261
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quote: Originally posted by ravagon On his behalf, I'd like to know just what sort of odds you plan on giving for something like that. [Something you may find useful as a frame of reference - there are theoretically about 10^80 nucleons in the universe and 1 in a hydrogen atom. This might generate a probability a tad on the high side though. ]

I'd like to know what the odds were of you posting on a weekend - which is to say, footing the bill yourself instead of ripping off your employer? Unless, of course, you're in at the office on the weekend, in which case you should be even more ashamed of yourself.

	12-07-2003 20:38									#262
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Damn you Ravagon!!

So...what are my winnings Finbar?

Very entertaining game. The Boks played their best game in ages.

	13-07-2003 03:17									#263
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Well, well well

Let me be the first to post the GOOD news

Springboks run circles round the favourites! Wallabies look decisively 3rd rate in front of a packed Newlands stadium.

Final score SA 26 - Aus 22.

Bottom line Springboks showed more cohesion, discipline and effort and continuity than ive seen in a good few seasons from them. Lineout ball, turnovers, good tackling, better ball handling....all over a infinitely better game than ive come to expect from them.


Lets just hope they can keep their cool and work on their depth of skill and experience. Even Gobo and Sepahaka impressed me

OK so Brent Russel, Loius Koen and De Wet Barry did a good deal of the work but i WAS impressed. For the first time in ages i believe the bokke are finally on there way to making a revival. Still a way to go to beat the English but if we keep at this pace we may just be in for a running come next yr and the world cup....

Just maybe. As i said in an earlier post....i refrain from making predictions until the final whistle blows.

I have to say the Aussies looked outplayed, outclassed and without their usual flair. Lacklustre to say the least. Whats happening mateys

VIVA Amabokke

	13-07-2003 03:32									#264
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I should have known better not to back Finbar.

	13-07-2003 07:02									#265
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia Damn you Ravagon!! So...what are my winnings Finbar?

You win 67.5 Civ Gold and ravagon picks up 22.5 Civ Gold.

So our updated Bank A/c reads like this:

Andydog 286.5
Bearcat 80.5
Caligastia 67-30 = 37+67.5= 104.5
finbar 31.5
Frozzy 85
Havak 96.55
Journeyman 122.5
LDiCesares 141.8
Mickeyj 143.5
NeoStar 114
ravagon 77.75-10 = 67.75+22.5 = 90.25
redbull 80
Tamerlin 69.3

Oh, technically speaking, Tamerlin's balance is 0. On his behalf, in his absence, I bet his entire fortune that the ref would, in applying the laws, uphold all that was dear to Tamerlin about rugby. I don't think I've ever seen a ref so blatantly ignore so much offside play. So Tamerlin loses his bet, so he's now bankrupt.

	13-07-2003 07:29									#266
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quote: Originally posted by Frozzy I should have known better not to back Finbar.

What can I say, Frozzy? Apart from sorry? I haven't seen such an incompetent performance from them in ages. The lineouts - they lost 6 from their own throws - were schoolboy standard, as were most of the errors they made. I cannot imagine what Matt Burke's problem was on the day that caused him to mishandle so many times. Nerves?

Certainly, the Bok defence was brutal - with, I have to say, most of them offside for much of the match - but the Wallabies showed a complete lack of nouse against them. De Wet Barry was constantly charging up out of their line, meaning there had to be some sort of gap in their line, but the Wallabies expoited it only once - when Sailor scored through the gap. Other than that, they presented a player with the ball for Barry to cut in half.

The Bok defence's job was made even easier by the Wallaby runners constantly starting so deep. Gregan was forever retreating with the ball, looking for runners, taking us well back from the advantage line, giving the Bok defence a mountain of time to prepare.

There are now grumblings that Eddie Jones has to stop experimenting with players and combinations and settle on a team. That's not the problem. The problems are the fundamental errors - lineouts, in particular - and the apparent absence of tactical nouse on the field, and these problems have been patently obviously apparent for over a year. The way they're travelling at the moment, they'll be very lucky to make it past the WRC QFs.

	13-07-2003 07:41									#267
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quote: The problems are the fundamental errors - lineouts, in particular

If they can't fix the lineouts, they could always take a leaf out of the Waratah's book - throw it to first man. Doesn't help your attacking options, but at least you secure it.

The backline was, in a word, s**t. They looked about as out of place as a donkey in a horse race. Gregan was a lone ranger out there.

Full credit to the Boks, but it's looking increasingly like a Kiwi-Pom Final now.

	13-07-2003 08:09									#268
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quote: Originally posted by Frozzy If they can't fix the lineouts, they could always take a leaf out of the Waratah's book - throw it to first man. Doesn't help your attacking options, but at least you secure it.

Well, yes. Securing it should be, I'd've thought, the priority. Whomever was calling the throws last night needs their arse kicked. Remember the lineout about 10 metres from the Boks' line? In that vulnerable position, you throw short and secure the bloody thing. They threw to the very back!

quote: The backline was, in a word, s**t. They looked about as out of place as a donkey in a horse race. Gregan was a lone ranger out there.

Why were they constantly so deep? They were sitting ducks for the Boks' defence!

quote: Full credit to the Boks, but it's looking increasingly like a Kiwi-Pom Final now.

They did well. They were obviously psyched for it. Which wasn't unexpected, but the Wallabies seemed unprepared for it. As Havak says, when you're at or near the top - as we once were - other teams lift against you.

	13-07-2003 09:45									#269
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Another interesting (and entertaining) game again.
What came as a bit of a surprise was the apparent ease with which the Wallabies seemed to become rather rattled ... this and a few discipline problems (and thats saying something for a team playing against the boks in SA!) really evened up the odds IMO.
On top of this, SA seems to have made an effort to come to terms with their own disciplinary issues - one player sin binned for holding onto the ball and a couple of careless penalties from a newcomer are a huge stride forward for their overall game.
All-in-all the Wallabies are probably lucky not to have been another try down at the final whistle. It might make for an interesting NZ-SA match next week in Pretoria.

quote: Originally posted by Frozzy I should have known better not to back Finbar.

I knew the mini-kangaroos were doomed as soon as I saw which way Havaks money had fallen.
Such a generous chap - willing to part with civ-gold just to put the hex on the Australians.

	13-07-2003 09:53									#270
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quote: Originally posted by ravagon I knew the mini-kangaroos were doomed as soon as I saw which way Havaks money had fallen. Such a generous chap - willing to part with civ-gold just to put the hex on the Australians.

You're onto my secret formula I see..