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chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
King
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:29
  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:05 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
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The Administration's Lying Again! Put an end to popups!

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/inte...-iraq-bush.html

The are releasing portions of the National Intelligence Estimate, which claims that Irq was seeking uranium in Africa.

What the Administration isn't saying is that it was the White House that demanded that these already disproved allegations be put into the NIE. State and the CIA had a note put into the NIE saying that the CIA found these claims to be dubious, but it was moved to page 55, away from the relevent part of the text.

They're using they own previous lie to justify their subsequent lie.

From Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity:

quote:
It's very clear to me how: Condoleezza Rice has actually told us how it happened. Her explanation says the evidence was in the National Intelligence Estimate prepared last August and September on weapons of mass destruction in Iraq -- which is true. The NIE is by far the most authoritative pronouncement, not only by the CIA, but by the entire intelligence community. It's very carefully done. This story about Iraq trying to get uranium from Niger was in there -- this was evidence long since disproved, and yet someone insisted it be included in the document. The State Department was so shocked by this, they put in a footnote saying that in their view, the information was garbage. Rice says the footnote appeared on Page 55 or something like that, so that nobody paid any attention to it.

So the real question is, how did that information get into the NIE last fall? The reality is that the vice president's office knew that it was spurious -- but the vice president had led the charge on Aug. 26, saying Iraq was reconstituting its nuclear program, and there wasn't a shred of evidence of that. So they dusted off this forgery and peddled it on the Hill to get Congress to vote for war. Since the NIE was in progress at that time, they insisted it be included despite [objections] at the State Department and the Department of Energy.

So around Christmastime, here's this drafter of the State of the Union speech, whom Condoleezza Rice instructs to draft a couple of paragraphs about WMD in Iraq, and the drafter says, "Where do I get that?" and she says, "Well, consult the NIE." So the damage had already been done with the NIE report itself. Condi should've known better with this. The key question is, who allowed it to stand in that report? It's exactly the kind of pressure that folks who are malleable managers do not have the guts to resist. The senior person in charge of the NIE bowed to the pressure that came from the White House, and presumably from the vice president's office, so that the report would support what the vice president had already said. Cheney set the terms on Aug. 26, and who's going to come out with a report that says otherwise?

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
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Sep 1999
time: 23:29
  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:07
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Can't you just make one thread? I mean it's all the same topic.

mrmitchell is offline mrmitchell
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Sep 2002
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:08
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why does it matter? their credibility is already shattered anyways, on a wide range of topics.

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
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AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:29
  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:11
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It just gets boring and makes che appear to be one note.

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
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Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:29
  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:12 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
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Put an end to popups!

quote:
Originally posted by DinoDoc
Can't you just make one thread? I mean it's all the same topic.


This is a new lie. Granted, it's part of a pattern of lies to try and cover-up (ooh, there's that word) their previous lies.

Of course, the President's already 'moved on.' Wouldn't that be great if we could do that. Cop gives you a ticket, tell him you've moved on. Get caught cheating on your wife, tell her you've moved on. The possiblities are endless.

Giancarlo is offline Giancarlo
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Apr 2000
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:13 Visit Giancarlo's homepage!
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NO the adminstration is not lying again. This is credible.

quote:
why does it matter? their credibility is already shattered anyways, on a wide range of topics.



MrFun is offline MrFun
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Nov 2000
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:13 Visit MrFun's homepage!
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Che -- I agree with you somewhat.

By the way, when is this "revolution" of yours suppose to happen?

Giancarlo is offline Giancarlo
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:14 Visit Giancarlo's homepage!
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Well I heard Zimbabwe might be a good place for his little revolution...

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
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Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:15 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by MrFun
Che -- I agree with you somewhat.

By the way, when is this "revolution" of yours suppose to happen?


Tomorrow, ten o'clock, be there or be a running dog imperialist lacky.

Giancarlo is offline Giancarlo
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Apr 2000
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:16 Visit Giancarlo's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara


Tomorrow, ten o'clock, be there or be a running dog imperialist lacky.


*noted*

*calls secret police*

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
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AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:29
  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:17
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Personally, I think the Administration would be better served by saying that they screwed up and say the statement shouldn't have gotten into the speach and point to the intel that is on firmer ground (ie that related to the Biological and chemical programs). The defense of what is apparently a mistake on their part only serves to give the story more life.

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
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Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:19 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
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It wasn't a mistake. Tenet said in closed hearings yesterday that the White House fought the CIA to include the dubious story. He even named a name, but since it was a closed hearing, . . .

of course then already been leaked.

Giancarlo is offline Giancarlo
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:19 Visit Giancarlo's homepage!
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I think what they are doing is a good strategic move...

GePap is offline GePap
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Nov 2001
time: 23:29
  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:21
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Put an end to popups!

This admin. seems to have some pathological fear of ever being proven wrong: accepting that mistakes were made is against the nature of this admin. After all, George W Bush., his Lord and Savior, is infallible. And don;t you ever forget that!

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
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AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:29
  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:21
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Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara
It wasn't a mistake.
Whatever. I'd spin it that way either way when doing what I suggested.

Giancarlo is offline Giancarlo
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:23 Visit Giancarlo's homepage!
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Gepap, I am sorry to say but what the opposition has put up is bull. I am sick and tired of hearing the flaps open from some people in the democratic party. The rhetoric stinks more than a fart. And it is wrong too.

monkspider is offline monkspider
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Aug 2001
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:25
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"The rhetoric stinks more than a fart. And it is wrong too."

Good quote.

GePap is offline GePap
King
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Nov 2001
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:27
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Fez, you are a one note (and a shrill one at that) character when it comes to politics. Just know I will ignore anything you say in this thread, no matter what sicne it will very likely be of absolutely no use to anyone, so don't waste your time, becuase I certainly won't waste mine with you.

Entiendes?

Odin is offline Odin
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Biology Nerd at Minnesota State University Moorhead
Sep 2000
time: 23:29
  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Fez
Gepap, I am sorry to say but what the opposition has put up is bull. I am sick and tired of hearing the flaps open from some people in the democratic party. The rhetoric stinks more than a fart. And it is wrong too.


The only thing I smell is this administration's piles of SH!T.

MrFun is offline MrFun
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:29 Visit MrFun's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara


Tomorrow, ten o'clock, be there or be a running dog imperialist lacky.


I'm a moderate liberal -- not some delusional communist whose hope hangs on some off-future revolution.

(just poking fun, Che)

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
King
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:29 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
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I also won't admit to any of the other weapons programs being good intel either, as the CIA itself seems rather divided on this.

Rummy decided that he wanted his own intelligence group, and handpicked a groups of DoD bureaucrats to cull through the available intelligence to cherry pick the answers he wanted.

Finally, remember, what brought Nixon down in Watergate wasn't the buglary, it was the cover-up.

mrmitchell is offline mrmitchell
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quote:
Originally posted by Fez
NO the adminstration is not lying again. This is credible.





And the Great Fez comes in and lets it known that I am incorrect.

O Great Fez, I am infinetely sorry that I might spread false rumours, please forgive me.

I see the light! Never again will I speak such heresy as the Bush administration was wrong or the USA is in financial trouble, for Fez has shown me the way.

Giancarlo is offline Giancarlo
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:30 Visit Giancarlo's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by GePap
Fez, you are a one note (and a shrill one at that) character when it comes to politics. Just know I will ignore anything you say in this thread, no matter what sicne it will very likely be of absolutely no use to anyone, so don't waste your time, becuase I certainly won't waste mine with you.

Entiendes?


Uh huh, and I do not view you any differently. You are all the same. You have offered nothing of value in this thread besides your own little insignifcant partisan opinion on the matter.

Odin: The only thing I smell right now is the awful stench from this forum. This awful stench of excessive bullsh!t.

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
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Sep 1999
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:31
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quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara
I also won't admit to any of the other weapons programs being good intel either, as the CIA itself seems rather divided on this.
Who needs the CIA when you can look at UN reports on the matter?

MrFun is offline MrFun
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Nov 2000
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:32 Visit MrFun's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Fez


Uh huh, and I do not view you any differently. You are all the same. You have offered nothing of value in this thread besides your own little insignifcant partisan opinion on the matter.

Odin: The only thing I smell right now is the awful stench from this forum. This awful stench of excessive bullsh!t.


He said he's going to ignore you in this thread -- what part of that don't you understand?

Giancarlo is offline Giancarlo
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:33 Visit Giancarlo's homepage!
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http://www.defenddemocracy.org/publ...m?doc_id=183348

Okay, okay.. maybe what some of you will describe as not credible... lol...

"Whatever you think about George Bush, whomever you'd prefer to see in the Oval Office come 2005, this much is clear: What the President said in his State of the Union address was accurate."

And this little clip is very important to me:

"If Saddam wasn't seeking uranium to make bombs, he could have established that by cooperating with the inspectors - for example by allowing his nuclear scientists to leave Iraq for questioning, and turning over centrifuges and other hidden weapons-building components. He refused to do so."

GePap is offline GePap
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Nov 2001
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:33
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Personally I think too much is made of just the Uranium claim: eveyrone speaks as if this was the only porblem with the intelligence provided. The porblems were huge. At elast on MSN's page right now (July 18th, 1:30 am), they have one of those MSNBC stories in which they talk about what the President was given, and what he cared to read.

The admin. would be better off chucking the whole WMD's story and stick to the "BUT we liberated Iraq!" line. But as I said, this admin. can never give an inch on anything, speically making Shrub look like the second coming.

Odin is offline Odin
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Sep 2000
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Fez
Odin: The only thing I smell right now is the awful stench from this forum. This awful stench of excessive bullsh!t.




I think the stench of excessive bullsh!t is comming from you.

BUSHGATE!!!

Giancarlo is offline Giancarlo
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:37 Visit Giancarlo's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Odin




I think the stench of excessive bullsh!t is comming from you.

BUSHGATE!!!


Nope.. I think it is leaking from your pants...

mrmitchell is offline mrmitchell
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Sep 2002
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  Old Post 19-07-2003 10:38
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No, no, no, Odin! The excessive stench is coming from you. After all, is Fez ever wrong?



(Bring out the helicoptors... )

 
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