15-09-2003 17:25									#152
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Bustamante was also part of a group called MEChA when he was young college student. This group calls for the western United States to be handed over to Mexico and for everyone that is not hispanic to be kicked out of that land. He refuses to denouce it or distance himself from that group and trys to say it was a "social club." Yeah and KKK is a social club too.

Here is a link to their site.
http://www.panam.edu/orgs/mecha/nat.html#2

	15-09-2003 17:27									#153
	Suffering from ads?

Wow. Mecha is insane...

It's also a humorous name, since "mecha" is slang for ***** in Panama. At least that is what I was told...

	15-09-2003 17:27									#154
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

young people do stupid things, but then as an Arnie supporter in spirit I'll support anything against Bustamante

	15-09-2003 18:15									#155
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Whoever wins this election is going to fail miserably to solve the not soluble in the short to medium run finacial problems of California, and be ruin for future politics, thus let it be Bustamonte.

	15-09-2003 18:56									#156
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote: Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola Whoever wins this election is going to fail miserably to solve the not soluble in the short to medium run finacial problems of California, and be ruin for future politics, thus let it be Bustamonte.

The international media is running as the story as California has gone broke because a succession of populist governors have cut taxes to the point where the state government can't function properly anymore no matter who is elected.

	15-09-2003 19:16									#157
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by Oerdin The debt didn't start until last year! Believe it or not we were in record surplusses.

quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc That's quite a stunning indictment of Davis.

So, presumably you feel the same about Bush and the federal deficit (i.e. "stunning indictment")???

	15-09-2003 20:26									#158
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse The international media is running as the story as California has gone broke because a succession of populist governors have cut taxes to the point where the state government can't function properly anymore no matter who is elected.

This is almost laughable. We are one of the most taxed states in the union.

Arnie recently said that the first thing he was going to do woud be to conduct an audit. I think this is exactly what we need. Spending is way out of control and needs to be cut. There is no way that a state as taxed as California should be running such a deficit.

	15-09-2003 20:41									#159
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by mindseye So, presumably you feel the same about Bush and the federal deficit (i.e. "stunning indictment")???

Of course I dislike Bush. I'm willing to give him a little lee-way due to the war on terrorism and the economy turning south after 9/11 but his tax cuts for the top 1% have been a financial nightmare that haven't help spur the economy.

Billionares normally slush extra cash into the stock market and don't circulate it where as the the other classes will most likely buy something and thus help improve the economy. That's why most economists said that cutting payroll taxes is the way to go if you want to improve the economy, but Bush needs more donations from the ultra rich thus he continues his current policies even after they have repeatedly failed.

	15-09-2003 20:58									#160
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I just visited that MEChA site. Its rhetoric is entirely Marxist. I am not surprised Bootmataxes was a member.

He is dangerous.

As to putting money into the stock market - my God, that is exactly what this economy needs.

	15-09-2003 20:59									#161
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by Ned This is almost laughable. We are one of the most taxed states in the union.

Yeah, after the other 49, you're the most taxed.

	15-09-2003 21:00									#162
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by mindseye So, presumably you feel the same about Bush and the federal deficit (i.e. "stunning indictment")???

Does anyone know the size of the California and Federal budgets? I'd like to do a little comparison.

PS If the Democrats could get over thier ill-fated love affair with Dean and move on to someone more sensible, I might have cause to vote against Bush.

	15-09-2003 21:03									#163
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Yeah, after the other 49, you're the most taxed.

I call BS che. There's only one other state that might reasonably have a higher tax burden than California: Massachusetts.

	15-09-2003 21:04									#164
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Ned As to putting money into the stock market - my God, that is exactly what this economy needs.

No, the most direct and thus efficent way to improve employment is to directly spur demand for factory goods and/or services. If you put money inbto the stock market you are three or more hands away from someone who will spend it so economists have pretty much agreed that 1) it will take longer for the money to trickle down, and 2) much, much less of it will ever be used to purchase goods or services (meaning actually increase employment).

Since the government doesn't have unlimited resources we should be attempting to spur the economy in the most efficient manner possible and most economists have agreed that is to put money directly into the hands of people who will spend it instead of saving it.

	15-09-2003 21:05									#165
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse The international media is running as the story as California has gone broke because a succession of populist governors have cut taxes to the point where the state government can't function properly anymore no matter who is elected.

What the hell??? Calfornia has not cut taxes!!! We pay the highest state taxes in the entire nation!!!! What the hell is this???

	15-09-2003 21:09									#166
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

From http://www.retirementliving.com/RLtaxes.html
Our sales taxes, state income taxes, and property taxes are all very near the highest in the country and taken together they may very well be the highest over all average in teh country. Compare for yourself. Also remember these figures don't include city and county taxes which are very high in California as well.

quote: CALIFORNIA Sales Taxes State Sales Tax: 7.25% (food and prescription drugs exempt. Tax varies according to locality. Can be as high as 8.5%) Gasoline Tax: * 18 cents/gallon Diesel Fuel Tax: * 18 cents/gallon Gasohol Tax: * 18 cents/gallon Personal Income Taxes Tax Rate Range: Low - 1.0%; High - 9.3% Income Brackets: ** Lowest - $5,834; Highest - $38,291 Number of Brackets: 6 Tax Credits: Single - $80; Married - $160; Dependents - $251; 65 years of age or older - $65 Standard Deduction: Single - $3004; Married filing jointly - $6008 Medical/Dental Deduction: Same as Federal taxes Federal Income Tax Deduction: None Retirement Income Taxes: Social Security and Railroad Retirement benefits are exempt. There is a 2.5% tax on early distributions and qualified pensions. All out-of-state government pensions are fully taxed. Retired Military Pay: Follows federal tax rules. Military Disability Retired Pay: Disability Portion - Length of Service Pay; Member on September 24, 1975 - No tax; Not Member on September 24, 1975 - Taxed, unless combat incurred. Retired Pay - Based solely on disability: Member on September 24, 1975 - No tax; Not Member on September 24, 1975 - Taxed, unless all pay based on disability and disability resulted from armed conflict, extra-hazardous service, simulated war, or an instrumentality of war. VA Disability Dependency and Indemnity Compensation: Not subject to federal or state taxes Military SBP/SSBP/RCSBP/RSFPP: Generally subject to state taxes for those states with income tax. Check with state department of revenue office. Property Taxes After taxes have been paid, homeowners 62 and older who earn $35,051 or less may file a claim for assistance on 96 percent of property taxes, up to $34,000 of the assessed value of their homes. Call 800-852-5711 or visit for details. Homestead exemptions are handled at the county level.

	15-09-2003 21:10									#167
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Jack_www What the hell??? Calfornia has not cut taxes!!! We pay the highest state taxes in the entire nation!!!! What the hell is this???

A couple of years back we eliminated the highest tax bracket (I believe it was the 11% tax bracket). Now 9.3% is the highest bracket.

	15-09-2003 21:27									#168
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Your property tax isn't listed, and, IIRC, it's the lowest in the country.

My previous statement was hyperbole, btw. Every state I've visisted claims it is taxed the most, BTW. The exception is Florida, which abolished it's inome tax and relies on taxing tourists.

	15-09-2003 21:31									#169
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

According to your link, California ranks 8th in highest taxes.

	15-09-2003 21:32									#170
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

California and Massachusetts have been trading the title for most taxed state for decades now. Is it just coincidence that these two states are run by tax and spend liberals?

	15-09-2003 21:34									#171
	Put an end to popups!

Massachusetts ranks 13th.

Course, these are also the states with the highest per capita income, so apparently they're doing something right.

	15-09-2003 21:35									#172
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Which site are you quoting from? Also is that just income tax or total tax burden? Some don't include property and sales taxes nor the taxes from the local government. Don't forget to weight the gas tax by the average number of miles driven per year.

	15-09-2003 21:36									#173
	Increase Your PM Length

The site you linked.
http://www.retirementliving.com/RLtaxburdens.html

	15-09-2003 21:41									#174
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Yeah, after the other 49, you're the most taxed.

Wrong. California has the highest aggregate taxes at the state level in the US.

Vermont has a slightly higher maximum personal income tax bracket. Trouble is, Vermont's maximum kicks in when you make a bit over 300 grand a year. If you're single, California's max income tax rate kicks in at a little under 40 grand a year, and roughly double that for married couples filing jointly.

California doesn't have quite the highest corporate tax rate any more, but it's near the top. Trouble is, California's is a flat rate with a minimum tax, and no allowance for losses.

California is the only state with a direct income tax on Subchapter-S corporations (which are by definition small businesses) which are taxed like a partnership (i.e. the owners are taxed at their individual tax rates)

California's sales tax isn't quite the highest in the US, but all the states that are close or higher have much lower personal or corporate income taxes.

Same thing with property taxes - plenty of other states are higher on property tax alone, but they offset it with lower income or sales taxes.

If you're Michael Jordan (when he was still playing) and you play a road game in Calfornia, the state figures that since there's 82 basketball games in a regular season, for each game you play in California, you get to pay California personal income tax on 1/82 of your total basketball earnings. If you're Shaq, and you play a game in New Jersey, the State of California doesn't care - it's offshore income from a state employer, so it's California's.

If you're a resident individual or corporation who makes money outside the state, California taxes you on those earnings anyway.

If you're a non-resident individual or corporation who makes money in the state, Calfornia taxes you.

And that doesn't even count "user fees", special assessment district taxes, or county and local taxes.

	15-09-2003 21:45									#175
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat Wrong

You missed the part about it being hyperbole.

Everyone complains their state has the highest or next highest taxes in the union. Except maybe Mississippi, but they have the worst funded education in the nation, so we can't take what they say seriously.

	15-09-2003 21:45									#176
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara The site you linked. http://www.retirementliving.com/RLtaxburdens.html

Nice of them to (a) not show how those numbers were calculated, and (b) to base it on retirees, who generally have most of their income unearned, and presumably aren't buying as many sales taxable items as the average family with a couple of kids.

Tax burdens for retirees are primarily property taxes, whether prescription medicines are subject to sales taxes, and a smaller portion of sales tax and income tax in proportion to their income (because a lot of them already have lots of stuff, and a lot of their income may be below taxing threshold (i.e. social security without outside income, etc.)

	15-09-2003 21:46									#177
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara You missed the part about it being hyperbole. Everyone complains their state has the highest or next highest taxes in the union. Except maybe Mississippi, but they have the worst funded education in the nation, so we can't take what they say seriously.

And if they're not Californians, they're wrong.

	15-09-2003 21:58									#178
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Your property tax isn't listed, and, IIRC, it's the lowest in the country. My previous statement was hyperbole, btw. Every state I've visisted claims it is taxed the most, BTW. The exception is Florida, which abolished it's inome tax and relies on taxing tourists.

That is the only tax in California that is low. Like MTG said we are the highest taxed state in the nation.

	15-09-2003 22:04									#179
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Anyone remember a few years ago, when either California or one of its major cities attempted to place a property tax on satellites when they were overhead?

	15-09-2003 22:07									#180
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Found it:

http://www.forbes.com/2001/07/18/0718satellite.html