19-09-2003 23:45									#151
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quote: Originally posted by realpolitic In my generation the Mings said, "My country right or wrong"

I was out protesting the Vietnam war back then... what were you doing?

My arguments have had nothing to do with questioning authority... or with Questioning the Authority of Media.

They have everything to do with laughing at some people's conception that Advertising is total mind control and can make people do things that they don't want to.

Advertising is simply one element of the marketing mix... and if it was as effective as some people would like to think... most agencies wouldn't be in serious financial trouble right now

	19-09-2003 23:46									#152
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quote: Originally posted by Osweld Man, you're nuts. They're just skipping class. It's their choice if they want to attend class or not. That is not something you send them to jail for, it is something that you should warn the kid of the effects it may have on his grades, and leave it at that. And please don't tell me you think they should be beaten instead.

That sums it up. "they're just skipping class"
Skipping class was quite serious when we were younger. Getting caught meant major punishment and maybe a little corporal punishment too. (When we did get caught we accepted the punishment)
But now, it's not the kid's fault, they were just skipping class. People have to take responsibility for their own actions instead of making excuses.

	19-09-2003 23:47									#153
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quote: My teacher's often gave me the opportunity of leaving in the middle of a class

I hear they don't mind to let the annoying ones go...

	19-09-2003 23:48									#154
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The only time we were allowed to leave in the middle of class is when they were dragging us into the supply room to apply a whuping to us.

	19-09-2003 23:54									#155
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quote: Originally posted by rah That sums it up. "they're just skipping class" Skipping class was quite serious when we were younger. Getting caught meant major punishment and maybe a little corporal punishment too. (When we did get caught we accepted the punishment) But now, it's not the kid's fault, they were just skipping class. People have to take responsibility for their own actions instead of making excuses.

Excuse me? That's the whole point. It IS the kid's fault, and he SHOULD take responsibility for it. That is why it is HIS CHOICE. If he feels he doesn't need to be there, then by all means, don't be there. If it turns out he did need to be there, and he ends up failing, he is paying the consequences.

And I told you not to tell me that you think kids should be beaten, so stop it.

quote: I hear they don't mind to let the annoying ones go...

That's what I was geting at. I did take advantage of their suggestion once or twice though, quite surprised them.

	20-09-2003 00:09									#156
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Let me get this straight... it's the law that kids have to be in school until a certain age. And if they aren't, the kids, parents or both are breaking he law and subject to arrest... Are you saying that ALL kids should be allowed not to go to school if they don't want to because they don't like something about it...

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA

We would have a lot of empty classrooms if that was the case...

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHA

	20-09-2003 00:11									#157
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Figures, someone else that doesn't even consider the disrespecting the teacher aspect of walking out in the middle of a class. (os, not ming)

	20-09-2003 00:18									#158
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quote: Originally posted by Ming Let me get this straight... it's the law that kids have to be in school until a certain age. And if they aren't, the kids, parents or both are breaking he law and subject to arrest... Are you saying that ALL kids should be allowed not to go to school if they don't want to because they don't like something about it...

Yep.

It wouldn't effect things much, most kids want to go to school even if they don't really like it. And just banishing some law isn't going to change the attitudes that already exist, anyways.

Of course, I'm think about teens. I don't know about the younger kids, I don't think I've ever met one that genuinely resisted going to school.

	20-09-2003 00:25									#159
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There is a reason why they made it a law in the first place...

	20-09-2003 00:28									#160
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Anyways... there's a big difference between droping out and skipping class.

	20-09-2003 00:32									#161
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But what if they could skip class every day with no punishment? It would end up being the same thing.

	20-09-2003 00:33									#162
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quote: Originally posted by Ming But what if they could skip class every day with no punishment? It would end up being the same thing.

And thus it would be droping out, not skipping class.

But to answer your question of "what if..." the answer is that they don't graduate. Simple.

	20-09-2003 00:36									#163
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OS, if punishing those kids for skipping encouraged them to go to classes and actually graduate, don't you think that a stiff punishment was for the good for the student in the long run?

	20-09-2003 00:39									#164
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quote: Originally posted by rah OS, if punishing those kids for skipping encouraged them to go to classes and actually graduate, don't you think that a stiff punishment was for the good for the student in the long run?

No. I think it could do them alot of harm, actually. If they want to get out of school and do their own thing, let them. They can always go back if they wish, or they can educate themselves. Or they can do whatever they want - let them live their own lives, don't force it on them.

	20-09-2003 00:40									#165
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Kids who refuse school deserve a spanking

	20-09-2003 00:41									#166
	Tired of ads?

I'm really hoping that you don't have children. And I highly recommend that you never do.

	20-09-2003 00:42									#167
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quote: Originally posted by rah I'm really hoping that you don't have children. And I highly recommend that you never do.

I'm hoping you don't, either. And if you do, that you can refrain from beating them to death.

	20-09-2003 00:44									#168
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quote: Originally posted by rah I'm really hoping that you don't have children. And I highly recommend that you never do.

Me or Osweld? I have two girls, 2 and 4 years old. I would rather die than they drop out from school.

	20-09-2003 00:46									#169
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My daughter is an Honor student at her H.S. She's also on the Pom Pom squad, involved in student council, and does some charity work when time allows.
This would lead me to believe that I have done at least a halfassed job of parenting. WHAT are your credentials?


RAH
and I meant Os, you got caught in the crosspost.

	20-09-2003 00:47									#170
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Osweld, there are 3 adult men here, compared to you who are barely legal for going to a public bar. Just give up.

EDIT: After reading Arrians post below: make that 4

Last edited by Chemical Ollie on 20-09-2003 at 01:04

	20-09-2003 00:51									#171
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quote: Originally posted by rah WHAT are your credentials?

Been a kid, had parents, and dropped out of school at the age of 14. Got all the experience you could want for this subject.

Nice to see you've got a trophy kid. Chearleader and all, what a princess!

EDIT: And I'm not a drunkard, Ollie, thank you very much.

	20-09-2003 01:02									#172
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Been a kid, had parents? Now I'm yellous! How did you accomplish that? But dropping out of school is not really a merit, is it?

	20-09-2003 01:02									#173
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quote: Been a kid, had parents, and dropped out of school at the age of 14.

Though it doesn't necessarily make you wrong, it does make your self-righteous tone laughable.

-Arrian

	20-09-2003 01:07									#174
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Os, your credentials leave me with nothing left to argue.
One last question.
Were you spanked as a child?

	20-09-2003 01:08									#175
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When I was growing up, we called kids that dropped out of school at age 14 losers. And as years went by, they only proved us more right

	20-09-2003 01:12									#176
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I'm not trying to be self-righteous. I'm not posting anything like "HAHAHAHAHAHA" or "I hope you never have kids, you could never be a great father like me" (except in reply to the same, of course )

And is it a merit? Yes, in a conversation about droping out I think actually having done that is a merit.

Speaking of which, about being self righteous... no one's even responding to my points. It's just dirt slinging.

	20-09-2003 01:13									#177
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quote: Originally posted by Ming When I was growing up, we called kids that dropped out of school at age 14 losers. And as years went by, they only proved us more right

Maybe you think I'd be a bad parent, but atleast I wouldn't call my kids losers if they droped out or didn't become head of the chear leading squad or whatever other ridiculous ideals of success you put on them.

	20-09-2003 01:24									#178
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Your only point seems to be that if kids want to drop out, let them. Do nothing to encourage them to continue to graduate.

I think you have figured out that I think that's lunacy and we there will be no real debate on that question from me.

And your cracks about my daughter only make me more proud of her. And I'll revise my earlier comment to, I hope you don't contribute back into the gene pool.

	20-09-2003 01:25									#179
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That's one good thing about my kids... they don't like to fail at anything, and that's their choice. My idea of success for them is simple. I want them to be the very best at whatever they want to be... their choice... And so far, they have succeeded wonderfully.

The facts of life are very simple. Those that get an education do better in their lives. The more education you get, the better you usually do. And I don't mean just monetary... I mean in being the type of person you want to be.

Yeah... there are exceptions to every rule... and education is no guarantee... but you know what... I'll bet on those that get the education. That's what the odds say

	20-09-2003 01:34									#180
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Maybe from your point of view watching advertising in school is education. From my POV it isn't.

Other than that I agree that the more education you get, the better you usually do (and not only financially).

Edit: so yes, kids should be emcouraged to go to school. Punishing them for refusing to watch commercials in the school is not really helping the cause, is it?