28-03-2003 08:00									#31
	Chat with GCA via ICQ Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

History Buff at GCA replied to me with their proposal for an NAP.

quote: Non-Agression Pact between Apolyton and GCA: In the interest of peace and future cooperation, to ensure our security and friendship, the nations of Apolyton and The Gamecatcher Alliance hereby agree to the following: There shall be no war or conflict between us. Our units shall not attack each other, nor shall they enter or come within 1 tile of the cultural borders of the other party without permission. Nor shall our units interfere with the travel and movement of each other outside of these borders. This shall be considered a Non-Aggression Pact. This agreement shall last 30 turns after it is ratified by both parties. This agreement shall be open for renegotiation after 25 turns have passed In the event that war is declared on a signatory, border neighbor* of both signatories, or signatories ally, this agreement may be subject to immediate re-negotiation. * = Two Civilizations that share a common border, or that share a neutral area between two borders, which contains no other civilizations. // SIGNED // --------------- Lucky President of the Gamecatcher Alliance

	28-03-2003 08:02									#32
	Chat with GCA via ICQ Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Here is a chat I had with Lucky, checking up on things slightly before I received the NAP from them. This turned into a two and a half hour marathon that left some things unresolved:

All times indicated are Pacific Time

quote: Lucky (02:16 PM) : I am back now WhiteBandit (02:16 PM) : hey lucky WhiteBandit (02:17 PM) : i wanted to know what you guys thought of the proposals we sent you the other day? we haven't heard anything, so i wanted to check up and see if you guys had any questions? Lucky (02:18 PM) : we are in the process of ratifying the treaty Lucky (02:18 PM) : I believe it will be sent back to you today or tomorrow Lucky (02:18 PM) : with one or 2 minor modifications WhiteBandit (02:19 PM) : awesome! Lucky (02:20 PM) : let me get back with my ambassador Lucky (02:20 PM) : it seems we have a majority for ratification WhiteBandit (02:20 PM) : ok, sounds good Lucky (02:21 PM) : but we do have one problem Lucky (02:21 PM) : we didn´t like how you took advantage of Elucidia WhiteBandit (02:21 PM) : i don't understand? Lucky (02:22 PM) : they specifically asked you to move back, but you kept going through their territory WhiteBandit (02:23 PM) : We were only going through their territory in accordence with a prior treaty we had with them. it seemed like a misunderstanding regarding the terms of our treaty, as far as I know the issue is resolved now. Lucky (02:23 PM) : we are just worried that our 2 contacts might engage in war with another Lucky (02:24 PM) : well Lucky (02:24 PM) : but we told you that now your warrior is trapped WhiteBandit (02:24 PM) : don't worry, we have no desire for war. as you know, we have a non-agression pact with CDG as well Lucky (02:24 PM) : yes WhiteBandit (02:32 PM) : i do want to apologize for missing your contact yesterday though. my spring break is just about over and school starts up next week, so things have been hectic as i've been buying books and preparing for that :-/ if you guys need to contact me though, just leave a message here or PM or something and i'll get back to you as soon as i can Lucky (02:33 PM) : I know the feeling Lucky (02:33 PM) : same here WhiteBandit (02:33 PM) : how old are you by the way? WhiteBandit (02:33 PM) : i just turned 21 recently Lucky (02:34 PM) : 22 WhiteBandit (02:34 PM) : nice! hehe WhiteBandit (02:34 PM) : you're in college then i take it? Lucky (02:34 PM) : university, yes WhiteBandit (02:35 PM) : what are you studying if i may ask WhiteBandit (02:36 PM) : i'm going for my geology degree, but i still have 3 years or so left, which totally sucks Lucky (02:41 PM) : I´m studying IT, a course called MEMS, mechanical and elecrical microsystems WhiteBandit (02:43 PM) : i wonder if that is kind of like our equivalent of electrical engineering? i have a friend who is majoring in that and he builds his own guitar amps and effects pedals for his music gear. it is unbelievably crazy Lucky (02:44 PM) : wouldn´t say crazy Lucky (02:45 PM) : got a friend who is into that, too Lucky (02:45 PM) : more into stereo systems and amps, though Lucky (02:45 PM) : but playing guitar, too WhiteBandit (02:45 PM) : well this is coming from someone who is studying how to play in the dirt Lucky (02:45 PM) : and no, it´s not EE Lucky (02:45 PM) : I´m studying at the EE faculty Lucky (02:45 PM) : but this is a little more special Lucky (02:46 PM) : integrated circuits, minuature mechanical systems, sensor and actor applications in the micrometer range, etc WhiteBandit (03:49 PM) : just got emailied the NAP treaty, the last part of it was cut off though: "* = Two Civilizations that share a common border, or that share a neutral area between two borders, which co " WhiteBandit (03:49 PM) : ah nevermind, it is all there in my PM Lucky (03:49 PM) : * = Two Civilizations that share a common border, or that share a neutral area between two borders, which contains no other civilizations. // SIGNED // --------------- Lucky President of the Gamecatcher Alliance WhiteBandit (03:49 PM) : thanks WhiteBandit (03:51 PM) : I'll post this for approval as soon as poly's damn website comes back up. it's been down all day Lucky (03:51 PM) : :O Lucky (03:51 PM) : was up earlier today WhiteBandit (03:52 PM) : i must have missed it Lucky (03:52 PM) : well, today for me WhiteBandit (03:52 PM) : hehe WhiteBandit (03:52 PM) : what do you guys think of the science proposal by the way? Lucky (03:53 PM) : well, wasn´t it us that proposed it? WhiteBandit (03:54 PM) : haha, true! Lucky (03:54 PM) : we are discussing it, but it might take even up to a week before some consens is reached WhiteBandit (03:54 PM) : ok Lucky (04:06 PM) : I have a question Lucky (04:06 PM) : did you already start on WC or wheel? WhiteBandit (04:06 PM) : Yes sir? WhiteBandit (04:09 PM) : We don't feel comfortable revealing our current science research at the moment, especially when we do not know much about the science status of your civilization. Lucky (04:09 PM) : we are just hoping that you do not rely too much on an unratified trade WhiteBandit (04:11 PM) : However, if you guys accept the tech agreement, we would be more then happy to tell you what our research status is. Lucky (04:11 PM) : as said, my populace is still uneasy and undecided Lucky (04:11 PM) : especially due to the fact that our side is worth more WhiteBandit (04:15 PM) : That is understandable WhiteBandit (04:15 PM) : Perhaps we could attach an amount of gold to the agreement? WhiteBandit (04:15 PM) : This is something I would have to take up with my people of course Lucky (04:17 PM) : so we are pondering possibilities to alleviate that problem Lucky (04:17 PM) : yes Lucky (04:17 PM) : of course the question is how much gold WhiteBandit (04:21 PM) : We are also working on a similiar tech deal with CDG that we hope to ratify very soon. That deal actually *favors* CDG!=-O Would it be possible that you guys could get the difference from them so how? Lucky (04:21 PM) : we actually know about that Lucky (04:21 PM) : a three nation deal which would help us all WhiteBandit (04:23 PM) : I totally agree Lucky (04:23 PM) : we will think of something Lucky (04:23 PM) : probably be ready with an idea by the weekend WhiteBandit (04:23 PM) : Sounds good. We definitely want this to work out, it would benefit ALL parties involved Lucky (04:24 PM) : yes Lucky (04:24 PM) : early cooperation will help us all in comparism to other teams WhiteBandit (04:25 PM) : exactly WhiteBandit (04:26 PM) : i have a question about the NAP Lucky (04:27 PM) : yes? WhiteBandit (04:28 PM) : we're wondering why you attached that clause at the end? it would seem as if that voids the NAP between us if conflict were to some how unfortunately fall upon my nation? Lucky (04:28 PM) : we attached it because we do not want to be drawn into any conflict WhiteBandit (04:29 PM) : Understandable! But with a NAP is meant to prevent conflict between us anyway, is it not? Lucky (04:30 PM) : it is, yes Lucky (04:31 PM) : but our "plan" in case of war between neighbors would be to take a totally neutral stance Lucky (04:34 PM) : so, as a kind of official explanation Lucky (04:34 PM) : you could add that we added it to prevent ANY form of getting drawn into a war WhiteBandit (04:34 PM) : I can understand your concern to not take sides, it places people in horrible situations We're not worried about that. We just think with a NAP between us and CDG, and a NAP between you and us, there would be no reason for this "automatic trigger" so to speak Lucky (04:34 PM) : remember WW1? Lucky (04:34 PM) : Lucky (04:35 PM) : the states had defensive treaties only, too, some even only NAPs WhiteBandit (04:35 PM) : well it was so long ago, it's a bit sketcy... my memory is failing in old age Lucky (04:35 PM) : yet it became a world war with all involved Lucky (04:35 PM) : even the almost totally neutral US WhiteBandit (04:37 PM) : Yes, but I think with a NAP between our three nations, there is no threat of conflict... unless you guys have fusion already? Lucky (04:38 PM) : hehe Lucky (04:38 PM) : how´d you find out ?! Lucky (04:39 PM) : WhiteBandit (04:39 PM) : it sounds to me like you're thinking this is more of a mutual protection pact in away. this NAP is no way guaruantees a committed alliance to one another. it is just a treaty that we won't be aggressive towards each other no matter what. If you go to war with one of our own allies, we won't go to war with you. Likewise, if we went to war with one of your allies, you wouldn't go to war against us. The NAP ensures that there will be no conflict between us. Lucky (04:40 PM) : it´s an amendment our people wanted to have Lucky (04:41 PM) : agreed, and we know that Lucky (04:42 PM) : but suppose another nation threatens us to help them, like "either you or them", we would like a way out without breaking a pact Lucky (04:42 PM) : or other scenarios that might happen Lucky (04:43 PM) : we are just trying to plan for all eventualities Lucky (04:44 PM) : I hope you understand that Lucky (04:45 PM) : another example would be a "real" military alliance, in the game Lucky (04:45 PM) : of course this is not relevant now WhiteBandit (04:46 PM) : I understand the need to protect your butt I just think it is unneccesary in this case, especially since our three nations have NAPs Lucky (04:46 PM) : oh we surely hope so Lucky (04:46 PM) : but being prepared for everything isn´t wrong, no? WhiteBandit (04:46 PM) : Definitely not WhiteBandit (04:48 PM) : Perhaps we can call it a Peace and Nuetrality treaty? It would still function as a non agression treaty for the time limit we set, but it would ensure neutrality in the sense that we wouldn't ask you to take sides if we went to war with another country for example? Lucky (04:49 PM) : you can call it that, but we still would like to reserve the option of renegotiation WhiteBandit (04:52 PM) : I do understand your point, it is just that my side doesn't find it too agreeable. We wonder if it is worth it to have a NAP between us if it will possibly pose too much of a problem for you to choose sides if conflict breaks out? Lucky (04:53 PM) : the problem is to chose neither side Lucky (04:53 PM) : as you said, we have a NAP with all Lucky (04:53 PM) : of you WhiteBandit (04:54 PM) : yeah WhiteBandit (04:54 PM) : All we want is to be peaceful and live happily next to each other WhiteBandit (04:55 PM) : All we want to offer is unconditional peace for at least 30 turns, it doesn't seem to be too much of a problem. Lucky (04:55 PM) : that is good Lucky (04:55 PM) : we can agree with that, but as said, unexpected events are covered by our amendments WhiteBandit (04:57 PM) : yes Lucky (04:57 PM) : do you have MSN? WhiteBandit (04:57 PM) : but we want a guarunteed peace for 30 turns, ammendment or no ammendment WhiteBandit (04:57 PM) : I don't, sorry WhiteBandit (04:59 PM) : I have AIM, but I don't think that is too popular outside the US Lucky (04:59 PM) : hmm Lucky (04:59 PM) : wait Lucky (04:59 PM) : ah Lucky (04:59 PM) : no Lucky (04:59 PM) : AIM can communicate with ICQ Lucky (04:59 PM) : sometimes Lucky (05:00 PM) : but nothing else WhiteBandit (05:00 PM) : yeah, it is fishy :-/ they use the same protocol Lucky (05:00 PM) : he is getting ICQ now WhiteBandit (05:00 PM) : I should download trillian since it supports all of that Lucky (05:00 PM) : YEAH WhiteBandit (05:00 PM) : i think gaim supports that too, but gaim sucks on windows. it's only decent on linux Lucky (05:01 PM) : give me a minute WhiteBandit (05:01 PM) : ok Lucky (05:06 PM) : 280404177 Lucky (05:06 PM) : is the GCA ambassador to your fine nation WhiteBandit (05:07 PM) : ok, thanks Lucky (05:07 PM) : he will negotiate with you Lucky (05:07 PM) : I gtg to bed WhiteBandit (05:08 PM) : ok, nice talking to you! Lucky (05:08 PM) : but you do agree to the rest of the NAP, yes? WhiteBandit (05:08 PM) : take it easy dude WhiteBandit (05:08 PM) : Yes Now talking with their ambassador... History Buff (05:08 PM) :hey WhiteBandit (05:08 PM) : hey there! gimmie a second here to figure out what the heck im doing History Buff (05:09 PM) : ok WhiteBandit (05:10 PM) : alright, not sure how much you know of what I was talking to Lucky about WhiteBandit (05:10 PM) : Basically, we got the NAP proposal back from you guys, and my people are kind of iffy of the ammendment that was added at the end History Buff (05:10 PM) : yep, I'm talking to him right now WhiteBandit (05:11 PM) : ok History Buff (05:11 PM) : you guys dont like our amendment? WhiteBandit (05:12 PM) : Well, we feel like it provides a loophole. If some civilization were to declare war on us, you guys would automatically be able to renegotiate that. WhiteBandit (05:12 PM) : We want an unconditional 30 turns of peace, much like what we have with CDG, we're not understanding why this is a problem History Buff (05:14 PM) : we just dont want to be forced into a war, shoud you attack another nation. WhiteBandit (05:15 PM) : yeah, we just don't see how a NAP would draw you into war though? WhiteBandit (05:15 PM) : Especially considering the fact that we will have NAPs with everyone we know History Buff (05:16 PM) : well, if some other civ appears north of you, and you attack for whatever reason, we dont want to be forced into it, esp. if you start losing WhiteBandit (05:17 PM) : Hmm, but this isn't an alliance of any sort, it just guaruntees peace between us WhiteBandit (05:17 PM) : If CDG were to attack you and asked us to ally with them, we couldn't. We have a NAP with you WhiteBandit (05:17 PM) : It wouldn't draw us into the conflict WhiteBandit (05:19 PM) : likewise, if you asked us to attack CDG in defense to help you, we couldn't as we have a NAP with them as well History Buff (05:19 PM) : WhiteBandit (05:19 PM) : I don't I have AIM though? WhiteBandit (05:19 PM) : I suppose I can look into MSN, is that whay you guys use to chat a lot with? History Buff (05:20 PM) : all my friends use it, typically, tis all I would use. But if not, thats ok. History Buff (05:22 PM) : hold on, brb WhiteBandit (05:22 PM) : ok History Buff (05:28 PM) : sorry, g2g, ttyl, we'll tlak more then WhiteBandit (05:28 PM) : hmm, ok, later

	28-03-2003 08:44									#33
	Re: Chat with GCA via ICQ Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

(removed. Posted in wrong thread)

	28-03-2003 09:02									#34
	Revised NAP proposal for GCA Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

This is the revised proposal edited by Togas to include some sneaky language Hopefully they will accept it! Sent to History Buff at GCA

------------------------

Alright, here is the revised proposal that Apolyton is willing to put forth. I hope these terms are acceptable. Please let me know!

quote: Non-Aggression Pact between Apolyton and GCA: In the interest of peace and future cooperation, to ensure our security and friendship, the nations of Apolyton and The Gamecatcher Alliance glady agree to the following: There shall be no war or conflict between us. Our units shall not attack each other, nor shall they enter or come within 1 tile of the cultural borders of the other party without permission. Nor shall our units interfere with the travel and movement of each other outside of these borders. This agreement shall last 30 turns after it is ratified by both parties. This agreement shall be open for renegotiation after 25 turns have passed This agreement shall not be implied in any way to create an alliance between GCA and Apolyton. This agreement is a pledge between both of our nations to keep the peace and to not engage in hostilities of any kind with each other. In the event that war is declared on or by any nation that Apolyton or GCA is in contact with, this agreement may be re-negotiated upon the agreement of both parties. WhiteBandit Apolyton Ambassador to GCA Ratified on March 27, 2003

	29-03-2003 02:22									#35
	NAP with GCA! Got spare money?

Looks like we got the NAP with GCA! Buahaha.

This was in my mailbox this morning from History Buff:
---------------------------------

Okay, this is our counter:

quote: Non-Aggression Pact between Apolyton and GCA: In the interest of peace and future cooperation, to ensure our security and friendship, the nations of Apolyton and The Gamecatcher Alliance glady agree to the following: There shall be no war or conflict between us. Our units shall not attack each other, nor shall they enter or come within 1 tile of the cultural borders of the other party without permission. Nor shall our units interfere with the travel and movement of each other outside of these borders. This agreement shall last 30 turns after it is ratified by both parties. This agreement shall be open for renegotiation after 25 turns have passed This agreement shall not be implied in any way to create an alliance between GCA and Apolyton. This agreement is a pledge between both of our nations to keep the peace and to not engage in hostilities of any kind with each other. In the event that war is declared on or by any nation that Apolyton and the GCA are (lets work on our grammar ) in contact with, this agreement may be re-negotiated upon the agreement of both parties. WhiteBandit Apolyton Ambassador to GCA Ratified on March 27, 2003

----------------------

So all they wanted was a grammar check? Haha. I sent our reply just to make sure they accepted:

quote: Haha, that sounds good. We accept that change then. Do you guys accept this NAP? If so, I guess we should both email Mongoose at 1BC to verify the treaty. Thanks! WB

Their response back:

quote: Yep, ok. Will CC to mongoose ASAP

Looks like we have our NAP with GCA

I'll forward our treaty to Mongoose at 1BC for verification purposes.

	29-03-2003 05:45									#36
	Suffering from ads?

Trying to prod GCA to hurry up with their tech deal.

All times are Pacific Time.

quote: WhiteBandit (04:23 PM) : hey! have you guys decided what you'd like to do regarding our tech treaty? History Buff (04:29 PM) : still deciding on that one. History Buff (04:29 PM) : too many different opinions, we arent quite sure how to get the fairest trade WhiteBandit (04:30 PM) : ok WhiteBandit (04:31 PM) : how are your trade deals with CDG? the deal we gave them actually favors them, so we're hoping there is some way you can get the balance from them and then everybody wins History Buff (04:32 PM) : well, we completed one trade, and will be doing another when possible, but IIRC its pretty fair. But I think most people are positive about your proposal. Things are looking good. WhiteBandit (04:33 PM) : ok History Buff (04:37 PM) : ok, I can prolly get that back to you soon, but Lucky wnated to go over some things, so I need to hold off. History Buff (04:37 PM) : but I g2g. I gotta share my comp with younger brothers and sisters. :cry: WhiteBandit (04:37 PM) : ok, sounds good! take it easy History Buff (04:38 PM) : cya

	29-03-2003 09:30									#37
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

A little reminder to CDG

quote: Hey GF I haven't heard back from you regarding the Tech deal we proposed. Has your team made any progress on it? I think it's a good deal for both of our teams. Please contact me should you have any questions. BigFree Apolyton Ambassador

	30-03-2003 00:29									#38
	Support Apolyton

Recieved from GF on 29 March; We have a deal.

quote: CDG Agrees to this Treaty. Signed GhengisFarb quote: BigFree wrote on 26-03-2003 01:22: Greetings GF On account of your approval of our earlier propsal, I'd like to offer the following proposal on behalf of Apolyton to the People of CDG. We propose the following: Apolyton agrees to give CDG Warrior Code and The Wheel. CDG agrees to give Apolyton Iron Working. This trade is to happen on the first turn in which both parties have acquired the Technologies required for this trade. No Trade Clause Neither Apolyton nor CDG may trade any technology acquired from the other party by this agreement to any other nation for 10 turns after receiving the technology. Non-Voidable If Apolyton aquires Iron Working from another source, it does not void Apolyton's obligation to give CDG The Wheel and Warrior Code upon Apolyton's completion of the two technologies. If CDG aquires Wheel and/or Warrior Code from another source, it does not void CDG's obligation to give Apolyton Iron Working upon completion of the research. This is the agreement in whole. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Respectfully BigFree Apolytonian Ambassador

	01-04-2003 10:24									#39
	More prodding Put an end to popups!

Here is more prodding to try and get these guys to speed up. Overall, a fairly friendly chat.

All times are Pacific Time.

quote: WhiteBandit (08:55 PM) : howdy! WhiteBandit (08:55 PM) : i'm probably becoming annoying by asking this just wanted to see how the tech proposal was coming along with you guys? History Buff (08:56 PM) : well, since you guys canceled the three way tech thing, we still have to figure it out, but it looks good. History Buff (08:56 PM) : I think I' just waiting for the final go from Lucky WhiteBandit (08:57 PM) : we did? History Buff (08:57 PM) : hmm, think so, maybe it was CDG History Buff (08:57 PM) : oh, yah, CDG WhiteBandit (08:58 PM) : oh they aren't interested in that? History Buff (08:59 PM) : apparently not. But the message they sent us was something like "We want to work out our deals with each nation indiviidually, hope it doesnt hurt the GCA relations etc. . . " History Buff (09:00 PM) : okay, I've been looking throuhg the discussion, most people think it slants a little in favot of you. we'll probably request some gold or a promise of a later tech trade to even it out. WhiteBandit (09:03 PM) : ok, when you guys have your proposal, send it to me and i'll see what my people will work out with it. from what i understand they might not be happy about gold since it's a 1 point difference between the techs. like i said, we were giving CDG a favor of 2 or 3 points i think? (i forget the tech values for them), but I guess they don't want to work something out with you guys in favor of that? WhiteBandit (09:04 PM) : you think they'd want to cooperate since it's best for all parties involved and ensure all of our survival WhiteBandit (09:04 PM) : are you the ambassador to CDG as well? History Buff (09:05 PM) : well, maybe. I guess they think they can do better by wporking individually. And no, I'm not. I think pggar might be. WhiteBandit (09:05 PM) : yeah, we have a separate ambassador for them too History Buff (09:05 PM) : what I want to know is how you came up with the values for the techs. Is there a system, or did you just make them up? WhiteBandit (09:06 PM) : i'm assuming you have play the world installed right? History Buff (09:06 PM) : I do. WhiteBandit (09:06 PM) : if so, open up the editor WhiteBandit (09:06 PM) : hold on while i see what i'm doing History Buff (09:06 PM) : ok WhiteBandit (09:06 PM) : ok, open up the editor go to scenario menu -> Click Custom Rules WhiteBandit (09:07 PM) : it will give you a warning message, just click okay, then in the tool bar that says "Edit:" click on civilization advances History Buff (09:07 PM) : oh, this has it in there? cool. I never noticed that WhiteBandit (09:07 PM) : in the civ advances menu you'll see the basic info about the tech. the values we're using are based on "Cost" History Buff (09:08 PM) : you dont have to go through it step by step though, I use this alot WhiteBandit (09:08 PM) : oh! ok WhiteBandit (09:08 PM) : but yeah, we use the cost value of what it costs to research, i think Wheel is 4, warrior code is 3, and writing is 8, so 7 for 8 isn't really a bad deal WhiteBandit (09:09 PM) : i think we're giving CDG a 7 for 5 deal in that case History Buff (09:09 PM) : this is what I have: History Buff (09:09 PM) : GC gets: IW+WC+Wheel (6+4+3=13) CDG gets: Wri+WC+Wheel (8+4+3=15) Poly gets: IW+Wri (8+6=14) WhiteBandit (09:10 PM) : OH okay History Buff (09:10 PM) : I agree, its only a small difference, but, we wnat it to be as equal as possible. WhiteBandit (09:10 PM) : well hell, CDG is getting the best damn deal :P they should share the wealth! haha History Buff (09:10 PM) : they are indeed History Buff (09:10 PM) : but how did you guys start out in the game? History Buff (09:11 PM) : you dont need to be to specific of course. WhiteBandit (09:11 PM) : decently of course but not as well as you guys obviously WhiteBandit (09:11 PM) : but then we look at the german team and CHRIST, they are blowing EVERYONE away! WhiteBandit (09:12 PM) : i think german team... i need to look at the scores again, hehe WhiteBandit (09:12 PM) : and poor firaxis is in last History Buff (09:12 PM) : they are, its crazy. Like those stupid KoB people. History Buff (09:12 PM) : but thats kinda surprising that Firaxis is losing. But I guess it all depends on the start locations. WhiteBandit (09:13 PM) : yeah i definitely think so History Buff (09:14 PM) : but you guys aren't beating em by much either. History Buff (09:14 PM) : who are the Netatolians? WhiteBandit (09:14 PM) : well perhaps regarding the techs, later on we can work out a deal where we exchange another tech that favors you? so it would be like (theoretically) we research an 11 tech and you research a 10? something to that effect WhiteBandit (09:15 PM) : i think we'd be willing to agree on a later tech deal WhiteBandit (09:15 PM) : not sure who the netatolians are History Buff (09:15 PM) : yah, that was one of the things Lucky suggested, so I'll have to send that to him. WhiteBandit (09:15 PM) : i was never even aware of these websites until the civ game History Buff (09:16 PM) : I knew of them, but almost nothing about them. There's a surprising amount of little civ sites out there. Plus the ones we dont see cuz of the languaes involved WhiteBandit (09:17 PM) : oh yeah History Buff (09:23 PM) : hey, is there a way to save these things? WhiteBandit (09:24 PM) : i don't think so, i'm just cutting and pasting as we go on WhiteBandit (09:24 PM) : it can't copy those damn smilies though WhiteBandit (09:24 PM) : so if you accidentally select that, it won't even copy everything else you've selected History Buff (09:24 PM) : hmm, that might be it, I'm trying to copy it, but It wont work WhiteBandit (09:25 PM) : i can email you a log when we're through? if you trust me of course, hehe WhiteBandit (09:25 PM) : what do you guys think of where CDG put their "OurGoatsAreTrained2Kill" city? History Buff (09:26 PM) : no, I got *** here. Next time lets avoid smilies though. WhiteBandit (09:26 PM) : that spot seems rather unproductive WhiteBandit (09:26 PM) : yeah, i'll try to definitely remember that, i use them too damn much History Buff (09:26 PM) : as ofr the city, I dont know. But most of thier land looks like desert and jungle. you guys too? WhiteBandit (09:28 PM) : well we don't really have anything that looks as bad as that spot thankfully History Buff (09:29 PM) : I think the CDG city may be a forced port for trading later, or perhaps just to estblich a border. WhiteBandit (09:30 PM) : Strategically it is sort of okay, if I were them, I would have put it on that hill though WhiteBandit (09:30 PM) : you have a port, plus a nice defense bonus WhiteBandit (09:30 PM) : the growth potential for it just seems really horrible History Buff (09:30 PM) : true. but I got to turn it, school tommorow and what not. I'll pass this on to Lucky, and we'll talk again later. cya WhiteBandit (09:31 PM) : definitely! take it easy

	04-04-2003 07:29									#40
	More GCA [Cattle] Prodding Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

More on trying to get GCA info on the tech deal...

All times are Pacific

quote: WhiteBandit (06:26 PM) : hey! talking to my people, we would be willing to offer you guys a deal in your favor on a future tech trade in order to balance everything out History Buff (06:28 PM) : well, that was what we decided was needed, so, when we all get everything we need for the trade, we'll go ahead on it. WhiteBandit (06:29 PM) : sweet! History Buff (06:29 PM) : so, the trade is a go, and I dont need confirmation. I guess we'll offer it when we're all ready. WhiteBandit (06:30 PM) : okay, that sounds great WhiteBandit (06:30 PM) : i don't mean to keep haggling you guys, sorry if i was an annoyance History Buff (06:30 PM) : not really. It your job after all. WhiteBandit (06:31 PM) : hehe true enough WhiteBandit (06:31 PM) : you guys have any ideas what we should trade for in the future? History Buff (06:31 PM) : but of course, I can't offer a garuntee this will happen. 99% says we willl, but somehing big might come up, so. . . History Buff (06:32 PM) : as for future trade, I dont really know. Its really too early to tell, but maybe somehing along the lines of literature, and somehing else, currency maybe (I dont know what the costs are) WhiteBandit (06:32 PM) : haha, oh dear, planning an early rush with elephants already? :P History Buff (06:33 PM) : ummm, no? :mischief: History Buff (06:33 PM) : but could I ask whether you are going Monarchy or Repub? It'll make it easier, because we'll know what kind of stuff we'll be trading. History Buff (06:33 PM) : but could I ask whether you are going Monarchy or Repub? It'll make it easier, because we'll know what kind of stuff we'll be trading. WhiteBandit (06:34 PM) : Honestly, I don't think we've even talked about it yet, i'll have to find out and get back to you once i get more info History Buff (06:34 PM) : oh, ok. Well, I'm gonna sign off for now, the little ones want thier turn. cya WhiteBandit (06:34 PM) : ok, take it easy!

	07-04-2003 09:41									#41
	Operation Small Talk Full PM-box? Change here!

Well in order to try and foster trust between GCA and us, I tried some random chit chat with History Buff.

All times are Pacific Daylight Time.

quote: WhiteBandit (06:20 PM) : hey sam! i'm dave by the way WhiteBandit (06:20 PM) : anyways, i tried to get msn messenger to work recently History Buff (06:20 PM) : yah, saw it in the profile. History Buff (06:20 PM) : oh, really, how'd it go? WhiteBandit (06:21 PM) : evidentially, using DirectX 9 and the latest ATI drivers (Cat 3.2), it causes some weird problem making MSN messenger not usable WhiteBandit (06:21 PM) : but I downloaded gAIM the other day, so I will try to setup an account through that since it supports MSN History Buff (06:21 PM) : really? weird. Stupid Microsoft. :roll: As for Aim, cool. Never used it myself though/ WhiteBandit (06:22 PM) : yeah, it's not really aol's AIM though, it's an open source client that some guys made that supports AIM/ICQ/Yahoo/MSN/Jabber History Buff (06:22 PM) : ah, like Trillian WhiteBandit (06:22 PM) : yes WhiteBandit (06:23 PM) : i'm not too fond of trillian though :-/ History Buff (06:23 PM) : me niether. Tried it for like, an hour, then went back to basic Messenger. WhiteBandit (06:23 PM) : hehe yeah WhiteBandit (06:27 PM) : haha, so what is the male-female ration at GCA? WhiteBandit (06:27 PM) : i think over here we're 100% males... WhiteBandit (06:28 PM) : haha, makes it boring... it must be an ego thing, conquering the world and all History Buff (06:28 PM) : lots of guys, very few females, I think 5 WhiteBandit (06:28 PM) : whoa! that's a crap load compared to us WhiteBandit (06:29 PM) : actually, 1 would be a "crap load" compared to us :P History Buff (06:29 PM) : there's Playa (Becka from CFC), Merin Sun (Kundor's Girlfriend) Spycatcher34 (The one who started the site) Orioles, Sixchan, and I think thats it. All them are active posters too. WhiteBandit (06:29 PM) : are they all part of the ISDG with you guys? History Buff (06:30 PM) : makes it fun though. The :groucho: smilie comes in handy alot. :groucho: As for the ISDG, I think only Playa and Spy are, and I think Spy's the only one who actually participates. History Buff (06:30 PM) : theres a big list at GC if you want a full list of members BTW WhiteBandit (06:32 PM) : i think i've seen that list... in fact, i think i'm even on it :P History Buff (06:33 PM) : really? thats doesnt seem right. . . WhiteBandit (06:33 PM) : maybe i was thinking of a list of all registered users at GC? cause i have a username there so you guys can PM me... maybe i'm thinking of the wrong list History Buff (06:33 PM) : yah, prolly. but I'll check. History Buff (06:34 PM) : heres the list though: http://www.gamecatcher.net/fora/gro...c07283ea5b69b74 WhiteBandit (06:35 PM) : oh! nice, ok WhiteBandit (06:48 PM) : oh the other thing we noticed this last turn is that you guys were right regarding our warrior bigfree History Buff (06:49 PM) : what, about how he's horribly trapped. WhiteBandit (06:49 PM) : from what i know of him, he won our "Apolyton's Mr. Good looking" contest so we'll probably just park him next to CDG and watch as all their women flock to him History Buff (06:50 PM) : well, I dont think they'll be too happy about that. WhiteBandit (06:50 PM) : their women will be History Buff (06:51 PM) : hey, you know, he stay's ther long enough, the women might get suffrage and turn the empire over to you. WhiteBandit (06:52 PM) : lol WhiteBandit (06:53 PM) : well the rumor on our side of the continent is that GCA men aren't too shabby either! so if you put a warrior on top of that hill... man! there will be an exodus out of their cities! History Buff (06:53 PM) : Too bad, but BarbCatcher is busy elsewhere at the moment. Otherwise we'd own Poly too. WhiteBandit (06:54 PM) : hahaha WhiteBandit (06:54 PM) : but see, that wouldn't work... poly doesn't have women so we're above those games History Buff (06:55 PM) : Well, by the same token, the Greeks have been known for opting towards Homosexuality, so they'll come anyway WhiteBandit (06:55 PM) : actually... you could just make a female warrior... and then you win anyway WhiteBandit (06:55 PM) : lol WhiteBandit (06:56 PM) : Maybe Markos... as for the rest of us, I'm pretty sure we're safe WhiteBandit (07:00 PM) : well i don't mean to waste your time or anything with small talk i just thought it would be a good thing to help build trust between our nations History Buff (07:01 PM) : oh, no problem. Trust is always good. But of course, should you break that trust. WhiteBandit (07:01 PM) : haha no doubt! WhiteBandit (07:03 PM) : see this is the problem of being a messenger WhiteBandit (07:03 PM) : i bring other people news WhiteBandit (07:03 PM) : if they don't like it, they kill me! WhiteBandit (07:03 PM) : i should request hazard pay History Buff (07:04 PM) : lol, me too WhiteBandit (07:05 PM) : i think next time we meet, we should choose an undisclosed location out in the jungle, away from either of our governments that way if i bring you a message like "you guys smell bad" lucky won't send my body back... without a head! History Buff (07:04 PM) : ah, but how is that funny? WhiteBandit (07:05 PM) : well you guys might get a kick out of it... and admittedly, my people might even find it funny and thank you... but i wouldn't find it funny History Buff (07:09 PM) : yah, I'm safe though. Theres more than 2 thousand miles and the Altlantic ocean between my and Lucky. WhiteBandit (07:09 PM) : haha, nice! i think i'm pretty far separated from all my leaders too History Buff (07:10 PM) : thats in this life of course. in the ISDG one however, its only a river and some trees. WhiteBandit (07:18 PM) : ok, i'm going to take off for now, i have homework and stuff i need to do, nice chatting with you though History Buff (07:18 PM) : ok. cya

	10-04-2003 07:46									#42
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Alright! Do they know of CFC or not? Debate amongst yourselves Togas, MasterZen, Trip all helped out in the chat with working on this plan of "Oh I screwed up acronyms" and seeing how far we could get away with it...

All times are Pacific

quote: WhiteBandit (06:48 PM) : hey! History Buff (06:48 PM) : hey WhiteBandit (06:49 PM) : i was wondering if i can get an update on how you guys are doing with that tech proposal? History Buff (06:50 PM) : umm, I dont think we've talked about it too much, so I really dont know. The first one is a go, but the second nobody has even thought about yet. WhiteBandit (06:50 PM) : well we can discuss the second proposal at another time, we just want to get a ratified agreement down so we can go ahead and research towards our collective goals History Buff (06:51 PM) : yes. Well, we were giving Writing, in exchange for WC and the Wheel IIRC. I can check if need be, but I'm playin AC, so, it'll take a bit. WhiteBandit (06:52 PM) : you don't have to check, that was the correct plan History Buff (06:52 PM) : ok. WhiteBandit (06:53 PM) : that plan will be acceptable to your civ then? History Buff (06:58 PM) : yes History Buff (06:58 PM) : oh, wow, sorry that took so long. WhiteBandit (06:59 PM) : hehe it's fine, i just got home a few minutes ago from school so i'm all over the house catching up on news, talking to parents, etc WhiteBandit (07:04 PM) : i noticed CFC placed another city too, so it looks like they are starting to pop out settlers History Buff (07:04 PM) : really, how did oyu know? If its score, whats thier relative score at? History Buff (07:06 PM) : really? how? WhiteBandit (07:09 PM) : i don't know? i guess when a civ builds a new city in an area you've already explored (and it's in the fog), civ updates the map to show that city... WhiteBandit (07:09 PM) : all i know is we opened up our map and there's a new city there History Buff (07:10 PM) : around which area, north in your area like? WhiteBandit (07:13 PM) : well it was towards the south of our area WhiteBandit (07:16 PM) : you guys have sent explorers out too right? :P i'd assume you'd be able to see something like that as well... i guess it depends on where you've explored though WhiteBandit (07:24 PM) : your still there right? you're probably teaching the morganites a lesson with a planet buster, if so, then WhiteBandit (07:25 PM) : doh! away? :P History Buff (07:28 PM) : oh, soryy, back, playing b-ball with my brother. But I already took care of them. They had one city, by the time I had chaos guns, because of a war, and an unfortunate fungul bloom in their area. WhiteBandit (07:28 PM) : haha nice, they always stab me in the back whenever i play no matter what i seem to do History Buff (07:31 PM) : eh, they usually end up getting erdicated by the Hive no matter what, so I free em ASAP, and just mooch funds off them, till I can win some other way. its AX BTW though. WhiteBandit (07:32 PM) : OH, man i wish they made it so you could put all 16 civs on one map, including both the alien ones History Buff (07:32 PM) : that would be SOOO cool. History Buff (07:32 PM) : the progentitors are so fun to play, but they're too easy WhiteBandit (07:32 PM) : especially the custom maps, you can do INSANE sizes, i played on a 9999 x 9999 before but with only 8 civs, it gets REALLY damn boring History Buff (07:33 PM) : yah, I usually just stick to the Huge maps. Those Quantum guns have the coolest sound History Buff (07:34 PM) : the best thing about the Prog's is that you can commit atocities with no fallout, because you cant be sanctioned. WhiteBandit (07:34 PM) : i've never played as either of them, i used to stick with university. i think that is ALL i have ever played as, haha. History Buff (07:35 PM) : they're good too. I like playing Gaia, but she falls behing too much, so it becomes hard to turn it around. But if you like the University, try the Cyborgs. WhiteBandit (07:36 PM) : plus she's hot... of course his voice makes anything attractive about her picture void. History Buff (07:36 PM) : true. Deidre has the worlds best eyes though. WhiteBandit (07:51 PM) : relations between you and CFC are still on pretty good terms right? History Buff (07:52 PM) : yah, why? History Buff (07:56 PM) : g2g, cya WhiteBandit (07:57 PM) : oh, alright man, take it easy

	10-04-2003 08:03									#43
	Tech reminder Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

At the request of Togas, I sent this reminder to Lucky and History Buff to help prod them along.

Also to note, I'm now a Prince baby! BAM!

---------------------------

Hey there History Buff and Lucky,

It sounds like we pretty much have an informal trade treaty worked out, but my people would really like to make it official. I'm hoping you guys would be willing to ratify this and send it back to me? We can work on a second trade deal that favors you after this. We just want to get this initial one out of our hair finally so we can focus our scientific research. Let me know!

quote: Apolyton agrees to give GCA Warrior Code and The Wheel. GCA agrees to give Apolyton Writing. This trade is to happen on the first turn in which both parties have acquired the Technologies required for this trade. No Trade Clause Neither Apolyton nor GCA may trade any technology acquired from the other party by this agreement to any other nation for 10 turns after receiving the technology. Non-Voidable If Apolyton aquires Writing from another source, it does not void Apolyton's obligation to give GCA The Wheel and Warrior Code upon Apolyton's completion of the two technologies. If GCA aquires Wheel and/or Warrior Code from another source, it does not void GCA's obligation to give Apolyton Writing upon completion of the research. This is the agreement in whole. Ratified in Apolyton WhiteBandit April 9th, 2003

	14-04-2003 05:05									#44
	Haven't we seen this movie before? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Well with Togas and MasterZen's permission I further pestered History Buff. It was a quick coversation of all about 5 minutes. But if they don't honor this, we should start thinking of our response to them.

quote: WhiteBandit (05:07 PM) : Hey! sorry to be pushy again, have you guys had time to review the updated tech proposal? History Buff (05:07 PM) : oh, right, sorry. I think its all right, I just need to check it once more, then send it back. Just havent found the time to do it yet WhiteBandit (05:09 PM) : okay, we're pretty anxious to get this thing out of our hair since it's been on the table for what, about 2 weeks now? :P History Buff (05:09 PM) : understnadable. I should have it send by the end of today WhiteBandit (05:10 PM) : that would be so great WhiteBandit (05:12 PM) : I think our whole team would really appreciate it too. Hopefully this tech deal can be the start of a strong relationship between our teams. Send your side my thanks History Buff (05:12 PM) : will do

	14-04-2003 23:11									#45
	Will this be futile? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Talking to Togas in the ISDG Chat, he helped me to write up a letter to send to GCA. This was sent to Lucky and History Buff. Hopefully it will net some beneficial results. If not... hmm...

quote: Hey Guys, Well we know that during our quick chat the other day, it seemed like we pretty much agreed on a tech deal. I sent you our ratified version the other day and was hoping for a prompt responce, or at least a reply that would detail any changes you would like to make. The members of our team are starting to get ansy and tell me that GCA is "up to something." I personally feel they are being paranoid, but I talked to History Buff yesterday and he said that he would send back a reply by 'the end of the day.' I never received a response and I am starting to feel worried as well. We have agreed to put in the clause that our next deal will favor you, and we'd like to start on the next deal soon, but first we need to officially finish this deal. You have this modified proposal already. I ask that you sign it and send it back. This will make everyone on my team feel less worried and work more confidently on future deals between us. Thanks. WhiteBandit

	15-04-2003 01:47									#46
	Buahaha! Ratified. Increase the size of your Attachments

Received the following from Lucky:

quote: To the best of my knowledge that trade is ratified and sent to mongoose. I´ll talk to HB myself, but you can rest assured that for us that trade is official. He probably forgot or didn´t think he´d need to send another copy to you again.

And the following from History Buff shortly thereafter.

quote: Sorry, forgot. Here it is, be sure to make sure Mongoose get the updated one. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Apolyton agrees to give GCA Warrior Code and The Wheel. GCA agrees to give Apolyton Writing. This trade is to happen on the first turn in which both parties have acquired the Technologies required for this trade. No Trade Clause Neither Apolyton nor GCA may trade any technology acquired from the other party by this agreement to any other nation for 10 turns after receiving the technology. Non-Voidable If Apolyton aquires Writing from another source, it does not void Apolyton's obligation to give GCA The Wheel and Warrior Code upon Apolyton's completion of the two technologies. If GCA aquires Wheel and/or Warrior Code from another source, it does not void GCA's obligation to give Apolyton Writing upon completion of the research. During the next tech deal between Apolyton and GCA, Apolyton will be required to offer technology that favors the GCA by 1 point. This is the agreement in whole. WhiteBandit Ratified in Apolyton April 10th, 2003 Ratified by the Gamecatcher Alliance April 14, 2003

I am sending to Mongoose as a witness

	26-04-2003 01:16									#47
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

The last two weeks have been fairly quiet on the diplomatic front. Talked to History Buff today though, didn't get much information out of him besides the fact that they are going the "Monarchy" route (which CDG appears to be doing too? Hmm. Not smart...) and they will have writing in 1 turn.

Times are Pacific

quote: (13:06:16) WhiteBandit: hey there! (13:06:38) History Buff: hey (13:06:43) WhiteBandit: i wanted to keep you guys updated. it looks like we shall have the wheel in roughly 5 turns (13:07:06) History Buff: ok. thx. we are closing in on writing too fairly rapidly (13:07:18) WhiteBandit: cool! (13:07:29) WhiteBandit: the last week has been crazy as all hell, poly's server was down (13:07:37) WhiteBandit: but now we're back up and finally figuring out what is going on (13:07:46) History Buff: yah, I heard, something to do with the forum search? (13:08:03) History Buff: yah, we get writing next turn (13:08:16) WhiteBandit: nope, it was the whole damn thing the main website, all the forums, even the IRC server (13:08:28) WhiteBandit: oh man, ok (13:08:39) WhiteBandit: do you guys know what you'll be working towards next? (13:08:53) WhiteBandit: perhaps we can start to hammer out that next tech deal if you are interested? (13:09:12) History Buff: havent yet eorked it out, waiting for polls to close. But I think things are leaning towards the Monarchy route (13:09:28) WhiteBandit: ok (13:10:06) WhiteBandit: i'm not sure we've really decided yet. i guess we are waiting around to see what you and CDG go for that way we can take a different route to maximize everyone's trade potential (13:10:59) History Buff: yah, I think we were gonna do the same thing with CDG. (13:11:21) History Buff: have you guys found anyone else yet? (13:12:22) WhiteBandit: eh we're still exploring westward, but it still looks like we pretty much have the top of our rock to ourselves (13:13:06) WhiteBandit: have you guys turned up anything interesting? (13:13:54) History Buff: not really. we just found a nice peninsula though, to our south. (13:14:08) WhiteBandit: nice! give you guys some expansion room (13:15:02) History Buff: yah, plus its got some specials on there. we might have a luxury ready to trade soon enough. gonna have you people racing to build a road. (13:15:15) WhiteBandit: oh man, nice! (13:16:07) WhiteBandit: are you guys connected to CDG by road? i forget (13:16:14) WhiteBandit: cause we'd have to connect to them first i think (13:18:03) History Buff: no, we arent connected yet (13:18:26) History Buff: but it looks like I'm gonna have to go here, my brother is preessuring me for a turn. cya (13:18:30) History Buff logged out.

	26-04-2003 02:45									#48
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Message sent to GF of CDG care of Apolyton's PM system on 25 April.

quote: GF, We are close to having the techs required for our trade. We should be finished on turn 47. CDG should offer IW on turn 46 so that we can offer WC and TW on the following turn(47). We are also talking with GCA about coordinating our next research goal, a three way exchange program seems to be the way to go. Let us know what path you'd like to take as well as what you'd suggest for us. You may have already finnished IW and are onto another goal; if so, Apolyton and GCA shouldn't choose that one, so please let us know what it is you're planning/working on already. BigFree Apolytonian Ambassador

	28-04-2003 12:34									#49
	CFC Contant! Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Contact with CFC!

After asking Togas if it was okay, I went onto their IRC chatroom and asked if anyone was around. The member Croxis replied, so I asked if I could speak to him via AIM. He is not an official ambassador or anything, but he is a member of their ISDG team and will pass on our info.

Things were friendly!

All times are Pacific

quote: (23:34:43) whitebndit: hey there (23:34:47) croxis: hey (23:34:49) whitebndit: I'm from Apolyton (23:34:51) whitebndit: we have contact (23:34:53) croxis: ok (23:34:56) croxis: YAY! (23:35:06) croxis: Why am I always the first one contacted? (23:35:07) croxis: (23:35:09) whitebndit: haha (23:35:16) whitebndit: you're the only one online at the moment! (23:35:23) croxis: true (23:35:28) croxis: the joys of being in college (23:35:46) whitebndit: right on brother! i have class tomorrow and am up civing (23:35:51) croxis: you pass the save to us correct? (23:35:53) croxis: lol (23:35:55) croxis: yup (23:35:57) whitebndit: yeah (23:36:02) whitebndit: who should we get in contact with? (23:36:03) croxis: I'm doing hw that is due, oh in 8 hours lol (23:36:19) whitebndit: haha oh man (23:36:25) croxis: I will pass on the information to our FA (23:36:36) whitebndit: awesome! (23:36:43) whitebndit: it's great to finally be able to contact you guys (23:36:57) whitebndit: we hope to setup a chat between our two sites sometime (23:37:03) croxis: We plan on it (23:37:11) whitebndit: err sometime should = soon (23:37:14) whitebndit: brain fart there (23:37:16) croxis: I know (23:37:19) croxis: oh I have those (23:37:29) croxis: even my hair is starting to turn blonde (23:37:37) whitebndit: haha (23:37:47) whitebndit: i'm at a total disadvantage, i'm dirty blonde (23:37:48) whitebndit: (23:37:51) croxis: hehe (23:38:01) whitebndit: let me give you our contact info real quick so your FA knows who to contact on our side (23:38:04) croxis: that means we can tell dirty blonde jokes (23:38:09) croxis: ok (23:38:37) croxis: I don't have our FA info, I'm not even sure who it is at the moment (23:38:43) croxis: but ti will be taken care of no worries (23:39:01) whitebndit: Tom_Ogas@yahoo.com and you can also PM him at Togas on 'Poly (23:39:04) whitebndit: awesome! (23:39:09) whitebndit: yeah we are playing the turn right now (23:39:12) croxis: ok (23:39:16) whitebndit: and nye was like "WHOA! FOUND CFC!!!" (23:39:23) croxis: and for your information my IRC pager is (croxis) (23:39:31) whitebndit: ok! (23:39:35) whitebndit: i'm usually always on AIM (23:39:42) croxis: and my computer makes noises and I run to it (23:39:47) whitebndit: 6364668 on ICQ too if anyone does that (23:39:48) whitebndit: ok (23:39:59) croxis: I have ICQ (23:40:06) whitebndit: yeah, wb or whitebandit works for my pager (23:40:14) croxis: ok (23:40:36) croxis: I have trillian so I have a bit of everything (23:40:50) whitebndit: is anyone of proper authority up right now? i guess my guys are really anxious to setup a chat and get dialog going hehe (23:41:07) whitebndit: it's freaking 11:40PM PST OVER HERE. but i guess the job of us geeks never ends (23:41:09) croxis: no I am the only one of any authority (23:41:19) croxis: where are you from (23:41:20) whitebndit: yeah, i'm using gAIM which is kinda like trillian (23:41:24) whitebndit: california (23:41:25) croxis: I'm in PST too (23:41:26) croxis: cool (23:41:27) whitebndit: oh! (23:41:28) whitebndit: redlands (23:41:29) croxis: I'm from Oregon (23:41:31) whitebndit: ok (23:41:32) croxis: nice (23:41:42) croxis: I'm the only one up at this hour (23:41:55) croxis: and I have no offical position, yet, so I can't say anything (23:42:15) whitebndit: aww, hehe (23:42:20) whitebndit: yeah i understand that (23:42:28) whitebndit: it's good that we have contact though and someone can pass it on (23:42:37) croxis: I do however you request you keep our contact secrit from any other civ you have contacted so far (23:42:57) whitebndit: sure thing... likewise for you as well (23:43:03) croxis: but of cource (23:43:09) whitebndit: i think it would actually benefit us both if we did that, hehe (23:43:23) croxis: we need to have our meetings, as I am sure you will too (23:43:32) whitebndit: definitely (23:43:53) croxis: as we plot to take over.. I mean (23:44:14) whitebndit: haha, i'm sure we all have our own plans (23:44:18) croxis: lol (23:44:21) croxis: I'm kidding (23:44:29) croxis: I hope we get along very well for quite some time (23:44:33) whitebndit: oh definitely! (23:44:38) whitebndit: i do too (23:44:50) croxis: I mean, I am from poly myself (23:44:51) whitebndit: i do want to acknowledge that we both have contact with CDG (23:44:58) whitebndit: their warrior is blocking the way to you guys (23:45:05) whitebndit: but we saw you on the other side somehow (23:45:09) whitebndit: but we'll keep quite (23:45:10) croxis: I am going to refrain form comment (23:45:24) croxis: cuz I don't want to get my rear kicked! (23:45:28) whitebndit: haha (23:45:30) whitebndit: i understand! (23:45:51) croxis: Do you mind if I post the log of this conversation? (23:45:55) croxis: on our forums? (23:45:57) whitebndit: i imagine you'll send this log on, which is fine with me i just want to say we won't tell CDG if you guys don't! at least for as long as possible (23:45:59) whitebndit: go for it! (23:46:23) croxis: I am sure we will let you know what our plans are (23:46:51) whitebndit: cool! let your side know we look really forward to working with you guys (23:47:06) whitebndit: btw, our council NYE says he thinks Octavian might be on, do you know if he can be reached? (23:47:11) croxis: Tell everyone over there hello for me (23:47:23) croxis: he is in bed (23:47:24) whitebndit: of course! (23:47:33) whitebndit: oh man, i guess he isn't a hardcore college student (23:47:34) croxis: he waited for you guys to send the save, but it didn't happen soon enough (23:47:38) croxis: lol (23:47:39) whitebndit: hehe, where do you go btw? OSU? (23:47:47) croxis: Western Oregon (23:47:57) whitebndit: ah, ok. i know not of that college (23:48:02) croxis: Its about 20 miles north of OSU (23:48:03) whitebndit: i have a friend who goes to OSU though (23:48:11) croxis: Very cool (23:48:22) croxis: I'm in that area a lot (23:48:29) croxis: nothing much to do in a town of 2000 (23:48:44) whitebndit: oh man i can imagine (23:49:01) whitebndit: i'm dave by the way (23:49:07) croxis: oh no! (23:49:11) croxis: I'm David (23:49:16) whitebndit: lol! (23:49:36) whitebndit: are you 21 and majoring in geology? (23:49:42) croxis: Nono (23:49:49) croxis: 19 Science Education (23:49:56) croxis: I'm a baby (23:49:57) whitebndit: haha, ok (23:50:27) whitebndit: yeah our foreign affairs department covers everything (23:50:35) croxis: oh? (23:50:43) croxis: what position do you hold if I may ask? (23:50:53) whitebndit: we have 21 year olds, 29 yr olds, 34 yr olds and a 23 yr old who acts 12. he goes by the name of MasterZen, watch out (23:51:24) croxis: Oh I have my middle school moments too (23:52:14) whitebndit: haha, oh we all do! (23:52:16) croxis: I think one of our team is 12 (23:52:21) croxis: anywhos (23:52:24) whitebndit: oh (23:52:41) croxis: so hwo is life over at poly? I haven't been there in a long time (23:52:51) whitebndit: i'm kinda just a throw around guy in our FAM... they just kind throw me where they need me (23:52:58) croxis: hehe (23:53:00) whitebndit: mainly assistant ambassador though (23:53:05) croxis: thast cool (23:53:16) whitebndit: our server was out for the last week (23:53:20) croxis: I heard (23:53:22) whitebndit: that was kinda a crappy deal (23:53:27) whitebndit: looks like things are getting back to normal (23:53:40) whitebndit: though our IRC server is still out, so a lot of us are holed up over at Dalnet (23:53:52) croxis: hey it could be worse (23:53:59) croxis: we had our share of problems today (23:54:17) croxis: until we found out one of the admins was archiving the forums (23:54:24) whitebndit: oh no (23:54:30) croxis: so its all good (23:54:31) croxis: I think (23:54:54) whitebndit: yeah, hopefully! (23:55:00) whitebndit: it isn't fun losing a freaking server (23:55:07) whitebndit: especially in the midst of a huge game life this (23:55:10) croxis: oh I know (23:55:11) whitebndit: like (23:55:22) croxis: I have a site on another server, and I am running a site on my system (23:55:29) whitebndit: oh man! (23:55:38) whitebndit: using apache? (23:55:43) croxis: oh but of cource! (23:55:47) whitebndit: haha nice! (23:55:56) croxis: php, mysql, no perl but thats ok (23:56:02) whitebndit: i'm not a perl fan (23:56:10) whitebndit: i really dig php though (23:56:17) whitebndit: not great at it, but it's fun to play around (23:56:23) croxis: yah I have looked at both ikonboard (perl) and phpBB, and I must say I liek pbp much more (23:56:36) croxis: me too (23:56:49) croxis: I'm still trying to catch up with HTML (23:56:58) croxis: the most advanced thing I can do is tables (23:57:01) whitebndit: hehe i have html down for the most part (23:57:10) whitebndit: yeah, even then they are a freaking pain (23:57:20) croxis: yah (23:57:24) whitebndit: sometimes i give in and use a WYSIWYG program to finish stuff (23:57:48) croxis: usually for a couple more complex pages I run a WYSIWYG editor and my html editor side by side (23:58:16) croxis: but most pages I do are so simple anyways (23:58:17) croxis: anywhos (23:59:03) whitebndit: do you run that off linux or win btw? (23:59:15) croxis: I run of windows, I still want to play my games (23:59:18) whitebndit: hehe, i used to run mandrake 9, but i built a new computer recently and no longer dualboot (23:59:19) whitebndit: haha yes! (23:59:36) croxis: no i am too poor to build another system (23:59:41) whitebndit: yeah, i have apache/php/mysql on this winxp box now since my old PC isn't hooked up anymore (23:59:47) croxis: cool (23:59:59) croxis: damn drum corps taking all my money hehehe (00:00:07) whitebndit: hehe (00:00:16) whitebndit: yeah, i'm split between computers and guitars (00:00:21) whitebndit: i got my tax return (00:00:23) whitebndit: bought a guitar (00:00:25) whitebndit: (00:00:29) whitebndit: i need to stop doing that (00:00:30) croxis: right on (00:00:35) croxis: I played bass for a long time (00:01:03) whitebndit: oh awesome! (00:01:11) whitebndit: i've played guitar for 7 years (00:01:13) croxis: the joys of being a band geek =Þ (00:01:15) whitebndit: and have... 7 guitars (00:01:17) croxis: right on (00:01:26) croxis: I have my moms bass (she played it first) (00:01:32) croxis: and i have played for like 6 years (00:01:32) whitebndit: haha nice! (00:01:46) whitebndit: we can form an internet civ band! (00:01:52) whitebndit: we'll write songs about taking over the world (00:02:04) whitebndit: have trying to get techs like military tradition (00:02:05) whitebndit: hehe (00:02:10) whitebndit: have = and (00:02:11) croxis: lol (00:02:29) croxis: well I should be in california in mid July (00:02:49) whitebndit: do you live down here? (00:02:59) croxis: No I am going on tour (00:03:03) croxis: I love saying that (00:03:04) croxis: hehe (00:03:09) whitebndit: haha (00:03:19) whitebndit: that is awesome! (00:04:02) whitebndit: hehe, man i should let you get back to your paper (00:04:10) whitebndit: i should go to bed too (00:04:18) whitebndit: midterms tomorrow and tuesday (00:04:25) croxis: actually I'm doing drafting (00:04:28) croxis: oh that is suckage (00:04:43) whitebndit: haha, i remember doing that in woodshop years ago! i thought it was fun (00:04:49) whitebndit: i guess we didn't do anything complicated (00:04:49) croxis: I lvoe it (00:05:00) croxis: I plan on doing my own house someday (00:05:40) croxis: good another MSDG is up (00:05:46) whitebndit: oh really? (00:05:51) whitebndit: anyone official? (00:05:51) whitebndit: hehe (00:05:58) croxis: umm (00:06:03) croxis: he is running for something (00:06:07) croxis: or a few thing (00:06:09) croxis: like me (00:06:09) croxis: hehe (00:06:10) whitebndit: hehe (00:06:13) whitebndit: i wish you luck! (00:06:28) croxis logged in. (00:06:43) croxis: well I am uncontested hehe (00:06:58) whitebndit: haha, oh (00:07:02) whitebndit: well congratulations then! (00:07:06) whitebndit: what'd you run for? (00:07:11) whitebndit: (if i may ask?) (00:07:15) croxis: no cuz then I'll jinks it (00:07:27) whitebndit: oh, haha (00:08:27) croxis: I seem to have bad luck with everything hehe (00:08:39) whitebndit: yeah i'm just a klutz (00:09:03) croxis: I hear ya (00:09:11) croxis: Its like the 11th commandment (00:09:22) croxis: "David shal injure himself at least once a day" (00:09:28) whitebndit: hehe (00:09:32) whitebndit: yeah, i have dumb luck like that (00:09:44) whitebndit: i was picking up stuff at home depot and had a bunch of 2 x 4's in my cart (00:09:49) croxis: and I am short too, so I don't have an excuse for being tall (00:09:58) whitebndit: i thought to myself "these are hanging off the end, i need to watch out when i turn a corner" (00:10:20) croxis: and what do you do (00:10:21) whitebndit: not a minute later, i turn a corner, feel a tap and then a CRASH! i knocked down and broke a lamp (00:10:22) croxis: BAM! (00:11:20) croxis: teh joys of life (00:11:41) whitebndit: yeah (00:12:31) croxis: hey smile! (00:12:38) whitebndit: hehe (00:13:07) croxis: you made contact with a really cool civ, and made contact with a really cool, hansome, sexy guy, so what more can you ask for? (00:13:16) whitebndit: haha (00:13:23) whitebndit: you know what is absolutely hilarious (00:13:27) croxis: what? (00:13:39) whitebndit: all of us in the FAM have renamed our little chat room as "FSGO" (00:13:42) whitebndit: for sexy guys only (00:13:43) whitebndit: hahaha (00:13:53) croxis: LOL (00:14:04) whitebndit: we even started a "sexy guy" succession game at: http://central.masterzen.net/index....&f=6&t=97&st=0& (00:14:10) croxis: not my fault the girls, and a few guys, want me (00:14:31) whitebndit: haha yeah! i was running at the beach onetime and this attractive girl comes up to me and she goes "hi! what's your name?" (00:14:35) whitebndit: i was like "SCOOOREEE!" (00:14:47) whitebndit: and she said "my friend wants to know if you are gay?" (00:15:01) whitebndit: and i said no and she walked back to her guy friend and shook her head! (00:15:02) whitebndit: haha (00:15:06) whitebndit: it was quite funny actually (00:15:08) croxis: awwww (00:15:10) croxis: sad! (00:16:08) croxis: but such is life (00:16:22) whitebndit: interesting parallels, haha (00:16:32) croxis: (00:17:13) croxis: I worked at a dance comp in HS (00:17:23) croxis: (head host my last time too, hehe) (00:17:40) croxis: and I would keep track of how many gay dancers (who are mostly gay) check me out (00:17:45) croxis: 12 (00:17:49) whitebndit: haha (00:18:03) croxis: I am just happy that there are at least some people in the world who can appriciate my good looks (00:18:18) whitebndit: MasterZen (another one of the FSGO bunch) just said "tell him all our official communication from now on will take place through hotornot.com" (00:18:20) whitebndit: hahaha (00:18:31) croxis: lol (00:18:42) croxis: no those dating things scare me (00:19:00) croxis: my best friend keeps getting stuff from 40 year old people (00:19:04) whitebndit: haha oh no (00:19:13) whitebndit: we have a little contest going to see who is the sexiest FAM member (00:19:27) whitebndit: so being funny (or LAME depending on how you look at it) we put our pics up (00:19:32) croxis: lol (00:19:36) croxis: ok (00:19:39) croxis: show me (00:19:43) whitebndit: lol! (00:20:15) croxis: bring it on fo! (00:20:19) whitebndit: let me see if i can find all the proper links :P (00:20:22) croxis: ok (00:20:30) croxis: Don't make me go to war over this! (00:20:43) whitebndit: haha oh great (00:22:05) whitebndit: 1.) http://www.hotornot.com/r/?eid=NRGLHMK&key=LAA 2.) http://www.hotornot.com/r/?eid=NRGQSZB&key=NKX 3.) http://www.hotornot.com/r/?eid=AYBSHQ&key=KRQ 4.) http://wwww.hotornot.com/r/?eid=NRGQSSB&key=TKK 5.) http://wwww.hotornot.com/r/?eid=NROMGSK&key=WTV (00:22:28) whitebndit: i'll leave it up to you guys to figure out who is who, hehe (00:23:19) croxis: I have to say, I'm cuter (00:23:24) croxis: number 5 is you (00:23:45) whitebndit: haha nope! (00:24:00) croxis: http://snow.prohosting.com/uslcs/davidisme.jpg (00:24:03) croxis: look at that! (00:24:05) croxis: WOOO! (00:24:13) whitebndit: haha oh yeah (00:24:24) whitebndit: man, we're going to have to start an interside FSGO club (00:24:26) whitebndit: intersite (00:24:39) croxis: LOL (00:24:42) croxis: yes we are (00:25:28) croxis: get babes by playing civ (00:25:53) whitebndit: haha, i don't think i've ever met a girl who likes civ (00:26:00) whitebndit: well, you guys have chieftess (00:26:05) whitebndit: but i mean a girl in real life (00:26:08) croxis: lol (00:26:09) croxis: yah (00:26:28) whitebndit: it must mainly be a male power trip thing... the whole "taking over the world" persona (00:26:49) croxis: oh trust me, girls have it too (00:26:57) croxis: the best Risk players I know are girls (00:28:01) whitebndit: haha whoa! (00:28:36) croxis: yah (00:30:52) croxis: I shoudl let you go huh? (00:32:35) whitebndit: replying to some posts on poly at the moment (00:32:41) whitebndit: but yeah, i am going to call it a night (00:32:45) whitebndit: nice meeting you david! (00:32:55) whitebndit: i look forward to cooperation between our two nations! (00:32:56) croxis: nice meeting you too dave! (00:33:00) croxis: yuppers (00:33:59) whitebndit: alright, have a goodnight! (00:34:04) croxis: you too (00:34:08) croxis: sleep well (00:34:14) whitebndit: you too! (00:34:18) croxis: don't let the barbarians bite (00:34:21) whitebndit: haha (00:34:23) whitebndit: or CDG! (00:34:24) whitebndit: =-O (00:34:31) croxis: oh? (00:34:40) whitebndit: well they have that warrior blocking you guys :P (00:34:46) whitebndit: hehe (00:34:47) croxis: hmmm (00:35:05) croxis: yah (00:35:14) croxis: well I wish you good night! (00:35:21) whitebndit: yup! bye (00:35:24) croxis: nwo go away I'm trying to do homework =Þ (00:35:48) croxis: night!

	29-04-2003 01:03									#50
	Team chat with CFC Got spare money?

Logs posted of a team chat with CFC.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...636#post1947636

	01-05-2003 01:36									#51
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

PM sent to GF care of Apolyton's PM system just minutes ago.

quote: SUBJECT: Concerning CDG\Apolyton Trade GF I was wondering when you'd get to me concerning the tech trade deal that we have. I sent you a PM on the 25th of April about it. BigFree

	01-05-2003 09:46									#52
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

This is a PM I sent to Kentonio care of CDG's PM system on 28 April. Still no reponse as of 30 April from either GF or Kentonio.

quote: I sent this message to GF a while back. I'm sending you a copy in case he's been a little busy. Thanks. quote: GF, We are close to having the techs required for our trade. We should be finished on turn 47. CDG should offer IW on turn 46 so that we can offer WC and TW on the following turn(47). We are also talking with GCA about coordinating our next research goal, a three way exchange program seems to be the way to go. Let us know what path you'd like to take as well as what you'd suggest for us. You may have already finnished IW and are onto another goal; if so, Apolyton and GCA shouldn't choose that one, so please let us know what it is you're planning/working on already. BigFree Apolytonian Ambassador

I also sent this PM to GF on 30 April.

quote: GF I was wondering when you'd get to me concerning the tech trade deal that we have. I sent you a PM on the 25th of April about it. BigFree

	01-05-2003 16:45									#53
	Suffering from ads?

PM sent to Louis XXIV (CDG's apparent FA's guy) care of CDG's PM system.

quote: Subject: Communicating with CDG I've sent emails and PM's to Ghengisfarb that have gone unreplied to. I also sent many follows up to him as well. I've also sent a PM to Kentonio. I do not hear from either of those two; are they still a part of you team? Who am I suposed to contact? If more time to discuss a reply is needed, would you please have them send a courtesy note saying "We got your message and are working on it." I just want to be sure messages are getting to the right people. Thanks. BigFree Apolytonian Ambassador

	01-05-2003 18:58									#54
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Well I briefly spoke to History Buff last night via ICQ. I meant to actually log the conversation but I closed the damn window before I could save anything!

He was able to confirm that they are going the "Monarchy" route and upon further prodding, revealed that their next tech will be Polytheism. I instructed them to go ahead and offer us writing as soon as they get the save, that way they get the techs a turn early. We'll see if they follow through on that.

	02-05-2003 01:38									#55
	Lucky of GCA Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Well I saw Lucky pop on ICQ, so I thought I'd take the oppurtunity to talk to him. At some points he appears kind of standoffish. Hmmm... We are really going to need an ally somewhere guys.

I can't wait to tell them "We're going to kill CDG, if you interfere, you will die to." Nothing like respect by the sword! :P (Yes, I'm overreacting.)

All time Pacific

quote: WhiteBandit (12:54 AM) : hey lucky! WhiteBandit (12:54 AM) : you guys haven't played your turn yet have you? Lucky (12:55 AM) : I at it Lucky (12:55 AM) : I´m WhiteBandit (12:56 AM) : oh nice! if you guys can, can you go ahead and offer us writing? and as soon as we get the turn we can offer back WC and Wheel? WhiteBandit (12:56 AM) : that way we can get this done one turn early basically Lucky (12:57 AM) : very good Lucky (12:57 AM) : we hoped you´d be ready soon WhiteBandit (12:58 AM) : yup, finally got it WhiteBandit (01:01 PM) : i believe you guys are going for polytheism now right? WhiteBandit (01:01 PM) : i'll see if i can have my people work on part 2 of our deal that favors you so we can get that out of the way WhiteBandit (01:01 PM) : hopefully i can send you guys something within the next week or so? Lucky (01:01 PM) : that wouild be great Lucky (01:11 PM) : btw Lucky (01:11 PM) : still wandering around with your warrior? WhiteBandit (01:15 PM) : yup, checking out the scenery still WhiteBandit (01:15 PM) : heh, not sure what we're going to do with it in the meantime, perhaps try to work something out with CDG Lucky (01:15 PM) : how about you try to find a solution Lucky (01:15 PM) : yes WhiteBandit (01:15 PM) : you guys planning on settling that area soon? Lucky (01:15 PM) : try that Lucky (01:16 PM) : yep WhiteBandit (01:17 PM) : ok, i'll get our CDG crew on it and see what we come up with, i think our NAP with them expires in a few turns, so we might renegotiate the terms of BF's return with them then Lucky (01:17 PM) : our citizens are uneasy about foreign armed forces near our borders, so a solution to get your boys home would be well appreciated Lucky (01:17 PM) : very good WhiteBandit (01:18 PM) : were you guys able to explore north of CDG at all before they founded "OurGoatsRTrained2Kill"? Lucky (01:19 PM) : sorry, that information is classified WhiteBandit (01:20 PM) : no problem Lucky (01:20 PM) : why do you ask? WhiteBandit (01:20 PM) : just a general curious question really. i didn't know if you were able to send a warrior through the gap before they plugged it so to speak Lucky (01:22 PM) : umm, might have sent the Writing offer twice Lucky (01:22 PM) : stupid multi-tasking WhiteBandit (01:22 PM) : hehe, it's alright i don't think it will effect the actual tech treaty, we'll see Lucky (01:37 PM) : ok, gtg, ttyl WhiteBandit (01:38 PM) : alright, nice chatting! see ya

	02-05-2003 03:36									#56
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: From: Louis XXIV To: bigfree1 Posted: Thu May 01, 2003 8:16 am GMT-8 Subject: Re: Communicating with CDG Feel free to contact me GhengisFarb was called up for active duty, so he won't be able to be ambassador for some time. Kentonio is still our President I will fill in as ambassador until a perminant person can be found. You can contact me here at CDG, or at Apolyton.net (I'm more likely to read it quicker here) I will let you know when a more perminant ambassador is assigned Sincerely, Louis XXIV Foreign Minister of Elucidia

	02-05-2003 03:43									#57
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: From: bigfree1 To: Louis XXIV Posted: Thu May 01, 2003 2:36 pm GMT-8 Subject: Re: Communicating with CDG Louis XXIV We are close to having the techs required for our trade. We should be finished on turn 47. CDG should offer IW on turn 46 so that we can offer WC and TW on the following turn(47). We are also talking with GCA about coordinating our next research goal, a three way exchange program seems to be the way to go. Let us know what path you'd like to take as well as what you'd suggest for us. You may have already finnished IW and are onto another goal; if so, Apolyton and GCA shouldn't choose that one, so please let us know what it is you're planning/working on already. BigFree Apolytonian Ambassador

	02-05-2003 11:28									#58
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Recieved from GF of CDG about 2 hours ago. Duh, we already know.

quote: Your new ambassador will be Louis XXIV until I finish getting some current RL issues completed.

	03-05-2003 02:44									#59
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Chat with CFC today:

Togas> anyhow, we wanted to try to talk some more about alphabet, see if we couldn't meet in the middle on a price or work out a future trade
Togas> you know, something where we give you alphabet and you guys give us another equal tech later.
Zarn1> I am thinking about it, but I cannot get the answer to you just yet.
* Goonie has joined #demogame_CFC_Embassy
Togas> what are your thoughts?
Goonie> Hi
Togas> hello
Goonie> Thoughts one what?
Togas> I was asking Zarn for his thoughts on a possible alphabet trade
Goonie> Are you from Poly?
Togas> Yes
Togas> I'm the Foreign Affairs Minister of Poly
Zarn1> One sec, please
Togas> Filling in because my ambassador, ZargonX, is away today and tomorrow.
Goonie> Ah, I used to be the FA minister here. I am ambassador to Poly now. Pleased to meet you
Togas> good to meet you.
Goonie> Please outline the trade
Goonie> I missed it.
Togas> No trade yet. I'm trying to start a dialogue as we don't even know is available for trade ... we don't have any idea what you guys have, you know?
Goonie> Ah, you want you to give us alphabet
Togas> sure
Togas> we could either sell it or work out a trade
Togas> anyhow, first time we talked we offered alphabet for 75, but you guys said it was too much, so we're willing to meet in the middle. Agree to a lower price OR perhaps give it to you now and have you guys give us something equal later on.
Goonie> Sorry, but we already have Alphabet
Togas> ??
Togas> serious?
Togas> that was fast.
Goonie> Sorry to disappoint, maybe we can work something else out.
Zarn1> Yeah, I think science needs to talk to Foreign affairs more often.
Togas> when we first met we were told to talk to you about it 2 turns later
Zarn1> Sorry, Togas. I wasn't wasn't aware, either.
Goonie> But since that time we have acquired the knowledge of the Alphabet A .. B...C ...D ...E
Togas> What are you working on now?
Goonie> Ceremonial buildinhg
Togas> that's an easy one
Togas> heck, we could probably get it for you One of our contacts has it.
Togas> Do you guys have both wheel and warrior code?
Goonie> Ah, which contact might that be?
Togas> We'll exchange contact info with you on a name for name basis.
Togas> Of course, CDG doesn't count as we both know we know them
Goonie> Yea of course
Togas> heck, we could even trade contacts in a few turns if you guys want.
Goonie> We could arrange something
Togas> well, then, let's arrange it
Zarn1> Good
Togas> I'll reveal who Apolyton has contact with if you guys will do the same, agreed?
Goonie> Agreed
Togas> We have contact with CDG & GCA (Gamecatchers)
Goonie> We know GCA as well
Goonie> Laugh Out Loud
Togas>
Togas> no way!
Zarn1> LOL
Goonie> Way!
Togas> damn...
Togas> there goes the contact trade idea!
Goonie> Yuppers
Togas> you guys ask them for CB?
Goonie> No we haven't
Zarn1> Well we will be looking for more nations. If we find one, we will let you know that we have a contact.
Goonie> Have you guys traded alot with them?
Togas> if not, I have an idea ... why don't we split the cost of CB between us: One of us ask them for a price ... and if the price is 40g, we each pay 1/2 of it.
Togas> then whoever buys it gives it to the other party
Togas> that way GCA only makes 1 sale and we each get it for 1/2 price
Togas> what do you think?
Goonie> I like it. We will buy the tech, copy the chat transaction, then sell it to you guys.
Togas> exactly
Goonie> For half the price
Goonie> Ok sounds good.
Togas> we'll pay 1/2 of whatever you guys paid for it
Goonie> Yeah!
Goonie> I will get the Ambassador to GC on that right away
Togas> good deal
Goonie> For half the price
Goonie> Ok sounds good.
Togas> we'll pay 1/2 of whatever you guys paid for it
Goonie> Yeah!
Goonie> I will get the Ambassador to GC on that right away
Togas> good deal
Zarn1> Well, at least something got done.
Goonie>
Togas> We can get a few more things done
Zarn1> Any suggestions?
Togas> We made peace agreements with GCA and CDG after we met them, and my team would like me to work out a peace agreement with you guys. A Non-Agression pact
Togas> the sort of thing were we agree to respect each others borders, not attack each other, etc
Togas> I'll draft something up and send you the draft. You guys can look it over and let us know what you think ... but do you want me to?
Goonie> Sure
Goonie> Draft one, then we can discuss the possibility in further detail
Togas> will do
Togas> also, we like to try to discuss tech trades before we get techs ... do all the negotiating beforehand and do the trades on the turn we get the tech
Togas> so that we can get techs traded faster, you know?
Goonie> That is a good idea, but we dont want to look to far into the future. Circumstances change and all
Togas> understood
Goonie> Who knows what could happen
Togas> we figure it's a good idea to just negotiate the tech we're workign on now ... since you rarely change techs mid-way
Togas> anyhow, we're working on Mapmaking
Goonie> Why type of agreements do you have with the other nations?
Togas> so I'm not sure what you guys will work on after CB, but we should try to work in the future to set up a trade so we can gvie you MM
Togas> only agreements we have right now are Non-agg pacts. Do you guys have any agreements with any other nations?
Goonie> We do not have any pacts with any nation
Togas> do you guys have contact with nations other than CDG & GCA?
Goonie> No
Togas> wow
Goonie> Oh wait, you guys
Togas> it's just the 4 of us on this continent
Goonie> Do you ?
Zarn1> We will tell you when we get one.
Togas> you 3 are it for us, too
Goonie> ok
Togas> so we're hoping to get MM soon to try to meet other civs
Goonie> yea
Zarn1> I see
Togas> but if we get other contacts, we'll let you know. They can be very useful to trade.
Goonie> Yes they can!
Togas> 'cause if you guys got a contact we didn't have, we'd trade one of ours, or give you tech for it
Togas> just to let you know, for tech trades, we try to go by the editor values of the techs
Togas> do you guys have that info available?
Togas> for example, the editor value of Mapmaking is 12, so we'll try to trade it for tech that is also a 12, or a combination of techs that = 12
Goonie> Yes we have the info. Its in the editor
Togas> cool
Togas> so if you'd like to trade us for mapmaking, hopefully we can work out a fair trade
Togas> anyhow, is there anything you guys would like to know?
Goonie> uh oh
Goonie> Afk for 10 minutes be back as soon as possiblr
Zarn1> Ok, I am going to eat, now. If you need to talk to me, contact me at either CFC or Apolyton. I have accounts at both.
Zarn1> I will be back shortly, anyway.
Togas> I'll be here

	03-05-2003 03:16									#60
	Remove this text

Some useful things OctavianX told us:

Togas> is there a massive body of water surrounded by land? A huge lake?
Octavian_X> We're stuck behind two landbridges other nations control...
Octavian_X> I believe so
Togas> this is THE strangest map I've ever seen!
Zarn1> I got the feeling too, and I don't even have PTW. Octavian, can you get screen shots for me?
Trip`> well, you probably have a lot of land then :P
Octavian_X> That's classified.
Trip`> :P
Togas>
Zarn1> right
Trip`> at least you don't have jungle ;P
Togas> We've scouted out a few of our neighbors, have you guys managed to get across those land bridges to see the land in the east?
Octavian_X> Laugh Out Loud
Octavian_X> nope
Togas> come mapmapking time, our two maps could match up very nicely!
Octavian_X> GC and CDG have traped us at two landbridges
Trip`> yes
Trip`> we should trade maps
Octavian_X>
Octavian_X> Than we agree somewhere.
Togas> Have you guys had any trouble with GC & CDG?
Trip`> them holding chokepoints is naturally not a good arrangement...
Octavian_X> GC had a close encounter with a warrior near our homeland
Togas> "close encounter"?
Zarn1> We have had no tension with CDG. GC...
Octavian_X> GC was coming unaccectable close to one of our many cities...
Zarn1> exactly
Zarn1> Octavian is the ambassador, if I am not mistaken.
Octavian_X> the warrior was disturbingly named 'CFCatcher, as well...
Togas> lovely
Trip`> LoL
Trip`> CDG has a city named "ourgoatsaretrained2kill"
Trip`> :P
Togas> Those guys are bizzare
Zarn1> nice name for a city
Octavian_X> Laugh Out Loud
Trip`> we have Mingapulco ;D
Octavian_X> and I though Zhi Gang was strange for a name...
Octavian_X> One of our cities, Chinese for Wisdom Harbor..
Trip`> sounds like "the gang" :P
Togas> I'll be idle a bit, need to make a phone call
Zarn1> now that you mention it... it does. i never really paid much attention to our cities' names before.
Trip`> where'd you guys get your capital name from?
Octavian_X> chinese for Sacred Forest
Octavian_X> What about your capital?
Trip`> :P
Trip`> what, you mean Apolyton?
Trip`> it's Greek for "Great City"
Octavian_X> (which, iirc, is rated #2 in the world, second to ours. )
Zarn1> not boasting, Oct.
Trip`> and it's not growing either
Octavian_X> not growing, but a big industrial capacity.
Octavian_X> My only fault is that I have too much fun in diplomatic talks...
Octavian_X> need to go. haircut time.