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GePap
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of the Big Apple
Nov 2001
time: 23:36
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quote:
Originally posted by The Mad Monk
Soviet Premier Gorbachev's three predecessors Brezhnev, Andropov and Chernenko had all died during Reagan's first four years in office. Whenever Reagan was asked why he had waited so long for a summit with the Soviets, he would reply, "They kept dying on me." |
Well, certainly Reagan got lucky with this-
Brezhnev presided over the beginning of the internal collapse of the SU. He let corruption get out of hand and did nothing to stop it. I think Andropov would have matched Reagan's belliegerance and postponned any real reforms-that would have continued the internal collapse and corruption, but the Soviet Military Complex would have continued to hum. BUt he drops dead fast, then comes Chernenko, another old guard (obviously too old), he drops dead, and thus comes Gorbachev-thinking of reforming the USSR to save it, but coming too late, unable due to rampant corruption to open up the economy, yet also carrying out political reforms, which brought him down- a lesson, as always, that the Chinese learnt, which is why as the USSR abandoned the East European regimes to their own, they let the tanks roll onto Tianemen.
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GePap
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of the Big Apple
Nov 2001
time: 23:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Verto
Yes, a small feint that drew away German manpower from the Eastern Front, thus allowing the Soviets to take the offensive in the first place. |
Actually, the great offensives by the Soviets begun in the winter of '42, with a german counter in summer of '43, followed by Soviet counterattacks for the next 2 years.
To compare-on june 6th, the spearhead of 250,000 men invaded normandy along a front of a few dozen miles. On June 30th, over a million soviet troops attacked 900,000k German soldiers along a front of hundreds of miles.
Even Churchill resognized that in Europe, it was the USSR that gutted the wehrmacht.
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Verto
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quote:
Originally posted by GePap
Actually, the great offensives by the Soviets begun in the winter of '42, with a german counter in summer of '43, followed by Soviet counterattacks for the next 2 years.
To compare-on june 6th, the spearhead of 250,000 men invaded normandy along a front of a few dozen miles. On June 30th, over a million soviet troops attacked 900,000k German soldiers along a front of hundreds of miles.
Even Churchill resognized that in Europe, it was the USSR that gutted the wehrmacht. |
Germany was having to divide it's troops between multiple fronts opened up in Africa, in Italy, and finally Western Europe. They had to send hundreds of thousands to fight against possible invasions, against spectres like Patton's imaginary army force.
Both sides were critical in achieving Allied victory.
And regarding the USSR gutting the Wehrmacht:
The US intentionally allowed the Soviets to take the brunt of Germany's attack, to suffer higher casualty rates, despite the warnings by persons such as Patton.
The US also was key to destroying the German war machine at home, thus giving the Soviets the necessary advantage to advance into Europe.
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Dis
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Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:36
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quote:
Originally posted by GePap
Actually, the great offensives by the Soviets begun in the winter of '42, with a german counter in summer of '43, followed by Soviet counterattacks for the next 2 years.
To compare-on june 6th, the spearhead of 250,000 men invaded normandy along a front of a few dozen miles. On June 30th, over a million soviet troops attacked 900,000k German soldiers along a front of hundreds of miles.
Even Churchill resognized that in Europe, it was the USSR that gutted the wehrmacht. |
hint: attacks on Germany were ongoing before June 6, 1944 by the allies. By allies I don't include the Soviet Union 
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molly bloom
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Lundenwic
Oct 2001
time: 15:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Verto
FDR supported Stalin, who murdered millions.
Roosevelt = Reagan = teh evil |
I seem to recall that was in a war against a joint enemy that was turning its own citizens (and a a good many civilians in Occupied Europe) into soap, gold bullion and lampshades.
Is it your assertion that Daniel Ortega was about to turn Nicaragua into a replay of the Third Reich, or that perhaps Grenada was going to turn into the Killing Fields of the Caribbean? Perhaps the mighty terror of the Grenadan fishing fleet was going to be unleashed against the shrimp boats of Texas....
Otherwise I fail to see why America under Reagan would invade a member of the British Commonwealth (without even bothering to have the courtesy to inform either Margaret Thatcher or the Queen) or sponsor the kind of people in Central America who raped and murdered not just the brown people, who are so easily forgotten about, but even, shock shock, horror horror, Catholic American nuns, those well known Commie agents of subversion.
'Soon the new secretary of state, Al “I’m in Charge Now” Haig was testifying before Congress that those bothersome nuns might have been trying to run a legitimate roadblock and were shot in the act. (He never explained how or why they also might have raped themselves).'
and:
'...on November 16, 1989, in the midst of another guerrilla offensive — an elite detachment of the Salvadoran army’s First Infantry Brigade staged a pre-dawn break-in into the residential quarters of San Salvador’s private Catholic university. They forced the much-loved and respected Jesuit rector, Father Ignacio Ellacuria, and five other priests — Juan Ramon Medrano, Armando Lopez, Segundo Montes, Ignacio Martin Baro and Joaquin Lopez y Lopez —onto the floor, and then they blew out their brains with automatic rifles. Also murdered were a housekeeper and her daughter.'
http://www.laweekly.com/ink/04/03/25th-cooper.php
I'm not quite sure how the activities of Central American death squads killing Jesuits and housekeepers furthered either the creation of democracy or an ethical foreign policy, but then I wouldn't have backed the murderers of Unita in Angola, or described someone who disembowelled his predecessor as being like one of the Founding Fathers. Although, I can't actually recall much disembowelling going on amongst the Founding Fathers, so perhaps Reagan had some other atrocities in mind...
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Sava
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GO GO GO!
Mar 2001
time: 23:36
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quote:
Originally posted by johncmcleod
Yeah, I actually have concern for human life and I care about that sort of things. What Reagan did in Africa and Central America was completely unexcusable and atrocious, and it did no good. There was no 'ends.' All it resulted in was better American business and millions of lives ruined. |
You see... the thing with the right is, they don't give a **** about human life. They don't care about freedom, or human rights, or stopping oppressive dictators. It's all about what's good for corporations. How fitting that their idol is an alzheimers patient who had a truly evil foreign policy. America's idolatry of Reagan almost makes me think we deserve to be attacked by terrorists. Is this what happened to Rome in the last days? Evil Roman emperors fiddling like idiots, living like Gods while the city burned? It's really a shame that America propagates freedom and all those warm fuzzy things... but in the end, we're lead by evil men. I'm so sick to my stomach. Every time I see Reagan's stupid face, I want to throw up.
America started out with such good intentions. Lip service was paid about freedom, and all men being created equal while America remained a slave-owning nation. And it took a war to stop that evil practice. I think one word can sum up America. Hypocrisy. It's all bullshit and I'm sick of it. It's sad to say that evil pieces of **** like Osama bin Laden have just cause to hate America. It was so sad on 9-11 to see all those innocent people dying... not because a bunch of psychoes "hated freedom"... it's because America has commited great evils upon the world and now evil was being commited upon us because of the actions of evil men like Ronald Reagan. **** you mr reagan. **** you mr bush. God, I hope there's a hell. Because if there is, men like reagan and bush will surely be burning in it.
That's reagan's legacy. And hopefully, Satan's sticking a hot poker in his ****ing ass right now.
I'm done with this thread.
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Dis
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Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Sava
You see... the thing with the right is, they don't give a **** about human life. They don't care about freedom, or human rights, or stopping oppressive dictators. It's all about what's good for corporations. How fitting that their idol is an alzheimers patient who had a truly evil foreign policy. America's idolatry of Reagan almost makes me think we deserve to be attacked by terrorists. Is this what happened to Rome in the last days? Evil Roman emperors fiddling like idiots, living like Gods while the city burned? It's really a shame that America propagates freedom and all those warm fuzzy things... but in the end, we're lead by evil men. I'm so sick to my stomach. Every time I see Reagan's stupid face, I want to throw up.
America started out with such good intentions. Lip service was paid about freedom, and all men being created equal while America remained a slave-owning nation. And it took a war to stop that evil practice. I think one word can sum up America. Hypocrisy. It's all bullshit and I'm sick of it. It's sad to say that evil pieces of **** like Osama bin Laden have just cause to hate America. It was so sad on 9-11 to see all those innocent people dying... not because a bunch of psychoes "hated freedom"... it's because America has commited great evils upon the world and now evil was being commited upon us because of the actions of evil men like Ronald Reagan. **** you mr reagan. **** you mr bush. God, I hope there's a hell. Because if there is, men like reagan and bush will surely be burning in it.
That's reagan's legacy. And hopefully, Satan's sticking a hot poker in his ****ing ass right now.
I'm done with this thread. |
you already admitted to trolling. I don't see why you should continue. you lose more credibility.
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The Mad Monk
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of Ice Cream
Mar 2000
time: 23:36
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quote:
Cuba lambasts says former President Ronald Reagan should ``never have been born''
By Associated Press
Monday, June 7, 2004
HAVANA - Cuba harshly criticized former President Ronald Reagan and his policies on Monday, saying he should ``never have been born.''
In the first reaction to Reagan's death from the communist government, Radio Reloj said:
``As forgetful and irresponsible as he was, he forgot to take his worst works to the grave,'' the government radio station said.
``He, who never should have been born, has died,'' the radio said.
The statement did not mention Cuba's relationship with the United States under Reagan, a staunch foe of communism.
It also did not mention Reagan's decision to order U.S. forces to invade the tiny Caribbean country of Grenada on Oct. 25, 1983, because Washington feared the island had grown too close to Cuba.
Since the early 1960s, Cuba and the United States have been without diplomatic relations, and Cuba has been under a U.S. trade embargo. But relations between the two countries were especially tense when Reagan was in office from 1981-1989.
Radio Reloj lambasted Reagan's military policies, especially the ``Star Wars'' anti-missile program. The initiative, launched when the Soviet Union still existed, rejected a long-standing doctrine built on the idea that neither superpower would start a nuclear war out of fear of annihilation by the other.
The radio also criticized Reagan's policies in Central America, where Washington backed a counterrevolutionary rebel army that fought against the leftist Sandinista government in Nicaragua. The United States also supported a conservative government that battled Marxist guerrillas during El Salvador's civil war.
``His apologists characterize him as the victor of the Cold War,'' the radio said. ``Those in the know knew that the reality was not so, but rather (he was) the destroyer of policies of detente in the overall quest for peace.''
( © Copyright 2004 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed |
http://news.bostonherald.com/nation...971&format=text
you are in such good company.
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The Mad Monk
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of Ice Cream
Mar 2000
time: 23:36
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quote:
Gorbachev Remembers Reagan
Created: 07.06.2004 13:14 MSK (GMT +3), Updated: 15:01 MSK
MosNews
Former Soviet president Mikhail Gorbachev commented Monday on the death of his “honest rival,” former U.S. President Ronald Reagan, who died Saturday in his California home of Alzheimer’s disease.
“He has already entered history as a man who was instrumental in bringing about the end of the Cold War,” Gorbachev told journalists at his Moscow office of the Gorbachev Foundation.
“I take the death of Ronald Reagan very hard,” Gorbachev was quoted by Associated Press as saying. “He was a man whom fate set by me in perhaps the most difficult years at the end of the 20th century.”
“I deem Ronald Reagan a great president,” Gorbachev told Ekho Moskvy radio. “Reagan turned out to be a leader who, despite all our differences… was far-sighted and decisive enough to work together with us and change our relations for the better, stopping the nuclear race…” the ex-president told radio station.
Those were years, Gorbachev said, “when everyone felt that we lived under the threat of nuclear conflict, and it felt as if the arms race was spiraling out of control, that we couldn’t control the military machine properly.”
Ronald Reagan issued his historic “evil empire” remark in 1983, before Gorbachev took power from the obscurity of the backbenches of the ruling Soviet politburo where he held the agriculture portfolio. Now, over 20 years later, the former Soviet president calls his rival “sincere”.
Gorbachev also addressed Americans with an opinion column in The New York Times Monday, recalling his dialogues with the former president up to the demise of the Soviet Union in 1991.
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http://www.mosnews.com/news/2004/06/07/gorbachev.shtml
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08-06-2004 01:34
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