28-07-2004 13:32									#181
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Nah, the sealurk became a landworm-with-progenitor-head (dune-style) in that scenario with some speed-and-invisibility adjustments. I sended that lurk to Smacksim already.

The problem in my scenario is that I tried to make two planets on the same map, and adjusted ocean trenches to be labeled as deep space, so the invasion of another planet/moon becomes a must at some part of the game. But the AI would never use the converted 'space transport' (Unity graph) I created for that.

Made for a weird game screen though. The map is at size 24x128 (nearly normal size), but the small planet map on the right bottom is nearly unusable by the extorded view.

My Planetoids (mindbusters) took the place of sealurks since those occur less offen randomly.

The factional -and game setup is still sound, just need to rethink the map -and starting positions. And then implement it off course. ATM I'm more inclined to give the Spartans (ACDG-ones ) a little field-exercise on our very own Luna , rework my Mars-scenario and then move on to this. A little trilogy in essence.

	28-07-2004 13:42									#182
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

No Hurry Geo. I'm holding back on 2.1.0 for a little while while I do some playtesting. If you want to send me those bases as a .pcx, I could put it as is into the 2.1 release. It looks pretty good to me!

Darsnan, I've actually had to do a lot of tinkering with the Universality. They are really too powerful, but a bit frustrating to play from the research point of view, until the mid-game.

+ 50% research from Ascetic's Retreat, but 200% research penalty = ~150% to general time to research something. One key is to research something not likely to be recieved via the datalinks. Getting the first tech completed is critical to ending the 'recalculate labs every turn' feature of the first tech.

+1 support = 3 units free of mineral support
+1 planet = free army

and the big one:
-1 drone from the Ascetic's retreat, +50% to psyche allocation.

That means you don't need garrisons at size 2 on Transcend. Size 3 without rec commons. It also permits rampant ICS to the second b-drone limit.

The hardest thing from the research end is that you keep getting free techs via the fungus. This slows down your own research and makes other factions hate you for being so smart

But in the mid-game, when you start researching things the AI doesn't care about, and at a faster pace via ICS, the human tendency to create lots of lab points starts to pay off, and you actually get to do some targetted research.

What I like most about the faction is their natural momentum-rush nature. While you accrue Mindworms, Spore Launchers and IoDs on your way to the enemy, you'll be gaining free military techs to upgrade your regular military via the datalinks/fungus net. You can focus all your energy production into ECs for rushbuilding, and still keep up with the other players. Then, when you take an enemy base, your free Ascetic's Retreat quells the Captured Base drone. Quite vicious.

Before 2.0.9, they were nigh unstoppable because of the further extra talent. Even the AI would ICS with that. I think they are closer to balanced now. I've also changed the Planetlovers (not sure if it's in 2.0.9 or not) to have a -1 industry penalty rather than the -1 Growth that the Uni has. The Planetlovers are more traditional Hybrids.

I think I will try to post a 2.1.0 before I head off for vacation this weekend. I'll be gone ~10-14 days, but may have net access some of the time.

-Smack

	28-07-2004 13:48									#183
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by GeoModder Nah, the sealurk became a landworm-with-progenitor-head (dune-style) in that scenario with some speed-and-invisibility adjustments. I sended that lurk to Smacksim already. The problem in my scenario is that I tried to make two planets on the same map, and adjusted ocean trenches to be labeled as deep space, so the invasion of another planet/moon becomes a must at some part of the game.

I'm definately going to use the 'old school' sealurk. I'd forgotten that unit after having seen it and wondered what it was in the first Aldebaran production.

Your deep-space analogy for the ocean reminds me: Have you ever tried to edit the terrain graphics for the ocean? Ugh! It's so frustrating because the game re-shades the ocean squares. If you never have tried, I reccomend not to try. It's painful. There is even some reshading of the regular terrain. The only things I've been sucessful with are changing the fungus, the jungle, the desert, and farms (I always dislike the regular Smac(x) farms).

	28-07-2004 14:55									#184
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

It also might be worthwhile writing in the world of Aldebaran as a planetary Manifold, which would explain the presence of bright pink semisentient fungus and mindworms. Or make the colonists have trapped fungal spores in their clothing or something.

	28-07-2004 14:58									#185
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I recently tried to change the farm graphics as farming domes on an inhospatible/airless world with the solar collectors (and changed those too off course with the little mirror from the Echelon Mirrors). It works pretty well, but I also spread those 'domes' to the outer edges of the tile, and they deform quite extensively when the terrain is 'dented'.
But keeping them centred is no option since the 'heavy' terraforming stuff makes them invisible later on...

What's so bad about the regular SMAC(X) farms?

No, I didn't try to alter the deep trenches color, was black enough IMO.

Tell me, to be sure, on Aldebaran the Fungal Towers still have the same graphics as the vanilla version? Otherwise I prefer to make some habitation around that. If you use the seamonster graph of the pic I posted for sealife, I use that one for the waterbases and adapt the habitation in it. Are the Planetlovers alien or human (for the perimeter)?

O yes, and by working slow, I mean weeks, not days. So don't expect it to be ready before your vacation.

	28-07-2004 15:08									#186
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by #endgame It also might be worthwhile writing in the world of Aldebaran as a planetary Manifold, which would explain the presence of bright pink semisentient fungus and mindworms. Or make the colonists have trapped fungal spores in their clothing or something.

That part of the backstory is written. Actually, I should say, it is waiting to be written I wrote the plot outline before learning much of anything about Smax, but it still works, though it's strange how I came up with some real similarities to part of the Progenitor fiction. In short, the Progenitors are not the true masters of the fungus, nor of the manifolds. They are a means to a greater end. The Galactics are part of a consortium of aliens known as the Alliance. The galactics were human, until thousands of years of space exploration and genetic engineering have made them a distinct subspecies. Some true aliens are coming in the various scenarios and are a big part of the plot. The Chironians are pretty surprised to find Fungus on Aldebaran, though some of them had fore-knowledge of this that they kept to themselves. The Outlaws are from the Galactic empire, so they are quite a shock for the Chironians, yet they all pretty much hate the Galactic Empire.

	28-07-2004 15:12									#187
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

And the Planetlovers are... ? Need to know that for their (future) base graphics. See my above post.

	28-07-2004 15:12									#188
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by GeoModder What's so bad about the regular SMAC(X) farms? Tell me, to be sure, on Aldebaran the Fungal Towers still have the same graphics as the vanilla version? Otherwise I prefer to make some habitation around that. If you use the seamonster graph of the pic I posted for sealife, I use that one for the waterbases and adapt the habitation in it. Are the Planetlovers alien or human (for the perimeter)?

I just think the farms look too big and sterotypical. They contrast too sharply with the background as well. But it's a small opinion.

Yeah, all the graphics are currently the same I believe. I havn't uploaded a Units.txt or Texture.txt yet with the packages. I just keep playing with variations and hoping to one day be able to edit the cvr files for the basic units. I do plan on using the seamonster for the sealurks and 'Great Worms'

	28-07-2004 15:13									#189
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The Planetlovers, smacksim...

	28-07-2004 15:14									#190
	Put an end to popups!

The Planetlovers are Human.

The three 'aliens' are 'Galactics, Colonists, Outlaws', in terms of being homo sapiens galacticus

All the rest are human. The Planetlovers are lead by Lady Deirdre's lover, Sir Lindley.

	28-07-2004 15:18									#191
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Ok, thanks. I know enough now. Perhaps I incorporate a bit of the Gaian base graphs in it, not sure yet. I see how much can be cramped in the base tile.

Thus Fungal Towers for the land bases, the green monster graph for the seabases. And additional human habitation -and perimeter around it.

	28-07-2004 15:40									#192
	Remove this text

Like I said. No rush. Adding graphics is easy anytime. I'll release 2.1 soonish and the finished graphics can come later. That way I can do a bit of work on them during vacation too. I have to teach photoshop to someone anyways.

	31-07-2004 10:47									#193
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I downloaded this mod a week ago and finally got around to playing a game with it. The AI was doing very well in the first 100 years or so, but now seems to be having some problems. The map is huge and is a lil over half water and I have know noticed the AI has no sea bases. I'm talking between all 6 AI's they have zero sea bases. This really has hurt their progress.

This really does seem to be a nicely developed mod and congratz on that, but possibly the AI could be looked at to utilize the sea since it is such a big part of the game.

	02-08-2004 21:50									#194
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Boy I see a lot of work has been underway on Aldabaran, I will have to play around with it.

I am hopeing to restart work on my own Mod the IMPACX mod which focuses on Alphax text editing and keeping the original storyline intact. I am hopeing to get permision to use (with credit given) some of the work you have done here in my own moding. I am hopeing some cross-polination can get started, I can see already that I have taken radicaly differnt directions on many issues. Good luck with the rest of your project, I will try to drop in here often, oh and your all invited to drop by my thread as well (once I get it up).

	02-08-2004 22:38									#195
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Stuntman, that's weird that they havn't yet gone to sea... I'll see if I can replicate that behavior in my own games. When they do go to sea(which is so far, always, in my own games), they do great.

Impaler, looking forward to hearing about your mod and comparing notes. Permission granted to use things from Aldebaran! It's not proprietary in any sense, other than thanks given to those who contributed....

As noted elsewhere, I'm on vacation currently, so no big updates to Aldebaran till mid August, I would expect...

	03-08-2004 11:15									#196
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Hi I've just started playing Alderbaran and I noticed both the peacemakers and Universality have tech cost changes rather than research rate changes.

Just interested to know your reseasoning for picking the tech cost change rather than a research rate change?

	03-08-2004 19:06									#197
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Edited: the whole line of Planetlover landbases is ready now.

Last edited by GeoModder on 03-08-2004 at 20:49

	03-08-2004 20:50									#198
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Well, how about this?

Attachment: largebasepl.jpg
This has been downloaded 75 time(s).

	03-08-2004 20:57									#199
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Nice - I like it! Good job GeoModder!


D

	03-08-2004 21:55									#200
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Heheh, the easy part is done... here are the seabases

If only someone had empty perimeter/tachyon pics...
Guess I have to make them myself.

Attachment: largebasepl.jpg
This has been downloaded 75 time(s).

	04-08-2004 05:06									#201
	Inflate your Upload Space

Awesome. Nice work GeoModder! Attach the file when you get a chance so we can incorporate them into the next update....2.1.0. Really nice!

As to the above poster r/e research rates vs. %penalties. The way I did it doesn't show up in the SE table as added clutter, is more analog (can be tweaked to variations smaller than 10%), and, well, cause, why not ?

	04-08-2004 05:17									#202
	About the Angels Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Smacksim I was wondering a few things about how the Data Angels act in the Alderbaran mod:

I remember somone on these forums once telling me that in SMAX the probe rating is bugged so if you get + 4 probe (as the angels easily can with their free covert ops centre and +2 probe original rating), their probe rating for new probes only acts as 0 or +1. This is untested by me but I was told by a reputable forum poster.

I would say that the Angels probe rating would need to be lowered to prevent the bug or the covert ops centre effect lowered but it seems the covert ops centre now has a new effect which seems to have little relation to the Angels faction agenda. Should they be given a more appropriate ability instead?

The Angels datalink entry also states they get free covert ops centre upon discovery of the seeker disturbance yet that tech doesn't even give access to covert ops centre normally, a different one does.

This mod is still in beta testing so perhaps these things are yet to be looked at or perhaps I've overlooked something, I admit I havn't played it in great detail yet.

	04-08-2004 07:59									#203
	Put an end to popups!

Thanks Kaboth, for the feedback. That's just the sort of thing that makes it faster to develop. I've kept all the original factions 'as is' except for their starting techs, which had to be changed to match the Aldebaran tech tree. The Covert Ops center being tied to a different tech than originally leads to the mis-blurb you noticed. I'll have to update that. The facility is the same. facility behaviour is unchangeable, for better or worse.

As to the Probe Team rollover bug. Yes, it's real. Yes, the Angels will be able to rollover in Aldebaran. They can in Smax as well. However, there are currently more ways to increase the probe rating in the Aldebaran SE table than in Smax, which has caused me a little concern anyways. I spread out the probe rating increases to make the various SE choices more attractive to the AI factions that think probe rating is 'what it's all about'. IE, they take SE choices that help them in other ways just because they 'think', 'Hey, I can improve my probe rating by taking the Controlled SE choice', etc.. But it does create various issues, as you've noted.

Currently, I've noticed that while my above SE nudging does help the AI make decent choices, it's not imperative. They will take choices that are not in their native preference, so I've been preparing to phase out the probe bonuses from the SE table, testing as I do so. In fact, much of my play testing currently focuses on balancing the SE table further, as well as making sure that the various factions (All 32 of them!) can navigate the SE table, are not crippled, and make decent tech choices as the game proceeds.

Again, thanks for the feedback, which is dead on. Any other suggestions, critique, or just observations are very welcome

-Smack

	05-08-2004 02:53									#204
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Smacksim,
I'm glad to have helped. I never actually played the Angels in SMAX; it always seemed pointless do to that probe rating rollover bug. Once you remove many of the probe ratings from the SE table perhaps the Angels should have 1 point of probe rating removed. It lowers their faction ideology strength but at least in the mid-lategame they won't be hampered with the rolllover bug. Give them some other ability to copensate for the loss probe rating.

Alternatively leaving the probe ratings on SE choices that angels wouldn't find appealing or could even be unable to pick might be wise.

Recently I've been playing the Conciousness; the SE choice of paranoia and laiz faire seems to be very powerful in the early game. The negative police rating is cancelled out. A +1 economy rating is gained as is +4 efficiency (PARADIGM ECONOMY). Nor do they suffer the industry hit. Combined with +2 research makes really fast tech. Their only negative remains their natural slow growth.

	05-08-2004 04:42									#205
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Leaving the Probe ratings on non-Angel SE choices seems like the best of those choices, but it is a relatively small issue compared to the other motivations behind the SE table. I do not plan on changing any of the original factions at all (other than updating to match tech trees). This is so that players can play their favorite faction from Smax and try to do so without adjusting their basic strategies (good luck!). It brings a sense of familiarity to the wildly different world. A Morganite can say 'I know I'll have support issues, but all I need is a single Economy boosting SE choice ---> Aha, Lassaiz Faire will work', etc.. It's nice to know you are not playing a 'version' of a faction, but rather the beast itself.

	06-08-2004 02:06									#206
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Fair enough smacksim; the original factions are well known and reasonably balanced.

About the Angels I just want to clear this up:

If I avoid any SE choices that affect my probes but reach the tech that places covert op centres in alll bases (It gives a +2 probe effect to all new probes right?), will the new probes created from the ops centre bases experience the rollover bug? Could I sell the covert ops centre in bases?

Or is it only when SE probe rating adjustments combined with natural probe rating exceeds 3 that the rollover bug occurs? If so then altering the SE choices should work great. Do any other society effects suffer a similar rollover bug?

	06-08-2004 02:16									#207
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I don't know . I've hardly played the Angels that much. All I do know, from reading discussions, is that it's fairly easy for them to roll-over. I would think that it would also be easy for the Believers. I think the rollover is probe rating above 4.

AFAIK, the rollover effect doesn't occur with other SE categories. I know for sure that Efficiency doesn't roll over. I'm fairly sure of the rest.

The problem you suggest: +2 faction Probe, +2 free-fac Probe, makes it highly likely that you'll experience rollover with the Angels no matter what you do, or which game you play. Pretty silly of Firaxis. It's a glaring bug.

G'luck!

	09-08-2004 06:23									#208
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I guess i could be considered a beta tester...
My prior experience is that i also enjoy mucking around wiht the files, though nothing quite this ambitious has ever resulted

I'm just gonna state some format fixes for the various .txt s...

For the text for when opposing alien factions try to contact each other (I'm talking about the two new ones), there is still a line at the end that talks about tearing out mandibles.... which the homo galacticus are clearly lacking... (in the usual sense of the word, it would be tearing out a person's entire jaw bone )

For the following Techs, (in the datalinks commentary) the person the commentary is attributed to, can be separated from the last line; make's a more uniform format *shrug*
i.e.

quote: Commentary here. Blah. Blah. Blahblah. --The Name here

needs to be changed to

quote: Commentary here. Blah. Blah. Blahblah. --The Name here

Techs:
Antimatter Applications
Arboreal Beginnings
Collective Projections (i suggest changing the name to --Goethe - Faust to denote the fact that Faust is a work of fiction instead of a first name, as Goethe, Faust implies)
Gravitons Are
Planetweapons
Robotics
Sentient Algorithms (add an extra return)
Structural Frontiers
Tacit Controls
Telekinetic Defenses
The Planet Pill

The following names in commentaries should be edited for clarification of what is a name, and what is a work of writing
(Tech, then name correction)
Human Ecology -- Arthur C. Clarke - Childhood's End
Planetary Metaphysics same as previous
Social Controls same as previous

If you'd rather I just do this mundane work and upload the .txt or something, just tell me....

Also, do we still need a good icon for the game?
I could try making it (though i don't recommend myself....)
A good program for making Icons (ok it's really basic i guess) is Icon Edit Pro (google it)

*goes back to playing the game*

	09-08-2004 06:29									#209
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

One other suggestion:

Random faction selection (the third preset) causes the game to crash and keep crashing until you delete your Alpha Centauri.ini file. My guess it's to do with the number of alien factions there are now. Recomment replacing the option with a preset for the Aldebaran factions and changing the relevant .pcx file to update the menu.

	09-08-2004 07:53									#210
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

On a whim, I checked the Alpha.ini file for anything regarding Alien factions... nothing there...

but it might be worth it to compare a working Alpha.ini file with a crashing one...