28-07-2004 20:40									#151
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat Why would you go out of your way to deliberately pick a loser, unless you're a communist?

Why don't you ask your buddies, the Democrats?

	28-07-2004 20:45									#152
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Why don't you ask your buddies, the Democrats?

	28-07-2004 22:07									#153
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat Hell, I'm pro-Kerry. even if he is a #$%*& yankee liberal

Bush isnt my candidate either but Kerry turns my stomach. Hell, I'd rather have that pantywaist Gore than Kerry.

	28-07-2004 22:23									#154
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quote: I wish I had seen Obama's speech but alas, I missed it.

Here it is:

rtsp://cspanrm.fplive.net/cspan/project/c04/c04_dnc072704_obama.rm

quote: What a BAM! I can counter with my own BAM then! Cuomo would have been painted as a traditional liberal and would have been trounced to the extent Mondale was.

You can BAM all you want. The fact is that Bush was a very weak incumbent facing a strong third party challenge. And he could've been beaten. The election might've been closer, but he still would've lost.

Besides, my point was that Cuomo chose not to run when the nomination was his dawg. Cuomo's speech was effective in getting him support. If Obama passes up opportunities like Cuomo's, he won't be President. But he's young enough to have a few such opportunities.

quote: I havent watched any but a few very very short snippets including 10 secs of Obama. After seeing the exerpts here I read his speech. If you ignore all the (understandable) pro-Kerry rubbish it's quite interesting. On one hand he appears moderate but then mentions Kerry in the same light. Something doesnt fit there. Either he supports Kerry, which means he's not really a moderate, or he is a moderate and just giving Kerry his due.

You've got it all mixed up. Obama's a liberal, Kerry's more moderate (despite the GOP's talking points to the contrary).

Anyways, that's the genius of the speech. He sells a liberal agenda in a way that appeals to conservatives. And it beautifully refutes the right wing charicature of the left.

quote: (I think it's better written than his presentation - which didnt grab me)

I'm guessing that the speech in soudbytes wouldn't be very effective due to his speaking style. And it took a while for him to gain his stride, and then he was on fire.

	28-07-2004 22:25									#155
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quote: my point was that Cuomo chose not to run when the nomination was his dawg.

I doubt that Cuomo would have won and then in the general, while Clinton could run to the middle and win, Cuomo would be painted as a liberal and get trounced.

	28-07-2004 22:34									#156
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Well, I think you're wrong, Bush was too weak and Perot too strong.

And remember, Clinton ran (in the general) closer to the left than how he governed.

	28-07-2004 22:38									#157
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Perot took equal number of Dems than he did Republicans. And Clinton descibed himself as a moderate left type. And it wasn't really a landslide. Clinton was just really good and made Bush and the economy seem weaker than they really were.

	28-07-2004 22:49									#158
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While Perot took a lot of Democrats, Cuomo could've stopped some of the hemorraging of Dems to Perot.

Anyways, we're not going to agree and this debate is getting boring.

	29-07-2004 00:04									#159
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1. Im very glad there has been no terr act so far (kenainahara)

2. Like Gepap, i missed when conventions mattered. They may not have been great deliberative bodies, but it was more fun. In particular 1976 GOP - Ford vs Reagan. 1980 dems - Carter vs Kennedy.

Of course Im too young to remember the multiballot conventions.

3. Ive been watching very little - the only speech Im really interested in is Kerry's - I really want some insight on Kerrys plans, esp on foreign policy - im not gonna get that from anyone other than Kerry (though a Holbrooke speech would be interesting, but not gonna happen)

Note to Imran - i met that Shundler (sp?) fellow from Jersey City - a nice guy, not sure what hes doing now.

	29-07-2004 00:07									#160
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quote: Note to Imran - i met that Shundler (sp?) fellow from Jersey City - a nice guy, not sure what hes doing now.

You know, I'm not sure myself. I think he said he may run again next year. McGreevey is HATED in Jersey at the moment and who knows, a Republican who was voted and reelected mayor of Jersey City sure has a chance .

	29-07-2004 00:08									#161
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I have gotten more excited about Kerry the past three weeks than I ever was before in the past.

	29-07-2004 00:52									#162
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Even with my studies, I'm going to try to make time to watch Edwards's speech tonight.

	29-07-2004 05:35									#163
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Sharpton is speaking now. He brought up that a few justices on the SCOTUS may be retiring during the next Administration. He said that we cannot allow Bush to pick their replacements. He brought up the recent anniversary of Brown vs. Board of Education.

He then dropped a bomb. He insinuated that African-Americans may not have had the rights to attend those schools had Bush chosen the Justices that decided Brown vs. Board.

	29-07-2004 05:39									#164
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His speech, like always is INSANELY racially charged...but he said the following:

"You think we'd have more leverage if we voted equally for both parties. But the ones who got our vote earned our vote. We got our Civil Rights under a democrat. We got the right to vote under a democrat. We got the right to organize under a democrat."

Is he wrong?

	29-07-2004 05:41									#165
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Say what you will about Sharpton, but he's a fine damn speaker.

I did appreciate that segregation line: "If George Bush had selected the court in 1954, Clarence Thomas would have never gotten to law school!"

	29-07-2004 05:47									#166
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I hate, I hate, I hate American politics.

Judy Woodruff and Wolf Blitzer are going on about "oh, this isn't what the Democrats want, and this isn't what the Kerry campaign wants"

If this isn't what the Democrats want, the delegates wouldn't have been fired up as much as they were.

I really wish that Americans would learn to accept fiery politicians...it's like you can't show emotion on stage these days. It's truly pathetic.

	29-07-2004 05:54									#167
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Don't bother with CNN. The Newshour cast are the pundits on PBS.

Graham is a snoozer, as expected.

	29-07-2004 05:57									#168
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun I have gotten more excited about Kerry the past three weeks than I ever was before in the past.

You slut

	29-07-2004 06:00									#169
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@ Spencer



Anyway, I just saw Sharpton's speech live -- I was disappointed by how he seemed to have shot from the hip more recklessly than the other speakers -- only other one that came close to such recklessness was Dean.



Also, seems like some Republicans are whining that some more moderate barbs about Bush were given by others. I am so glad that the Republicans intend to do as they say, by not having any of their speakers attack Kerry and Edwards in their own convention.

	29-07-2004 06:00									#170
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo Say what you will about Sharpton, but he's a fine damn speaker.

I like Sharpton (not that I agree with him) but when I flipped by he looked like a deer in the headlights. I cant imagine why he used the teleprompter.

quote: I did appreciate that segregation line: "If George Bush had selected the court in 1954, Clarence Thomas would have never gotten to law school!"

Pure Sharpton showbiz.

	29-07-2004 06:06									#171
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Didn't notice the teleprompter. Sharpton usually seems to look that way, as far as I can tell.

quote: Anyway, I just saw Sharpton's speech live -- I was disappointed by how he seemed to have shot from the hip more recklessly than the other speakers -- only other one that came close to such recklessness was Dean.

In what way was Dean's speech "reckless?"

	29-07-2004 06:06									#172
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quote: I like Sharpton (not that I agree with him) but when I flipped by he looked like a deer in the headlights. I cant imagine why he used the teleprompter.

He didn't use the prompter after like 3 minutes. He was supposed to speak for 6 minutes, he spoke 20. CNN even said the prompter operator was trying to find where the hell he was.

	29-07-2004 06:11									#173
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From Opinions You Should Have:

quote: Immediately After Obama Speech, Kerry Develops Laryngitis Opinions You Should Have has learned that John Kerry will be unable to deliver his acceptance speech on Thursday night as planned. Just moments after Barack Obama delivered what some, even Republicans, are calling "one of the best convention speeches of the past twenty-five years," Kerry developed "a bad case of laryngitis." "He really can't speak," said a spokesman. When Kerry accepts the nomination, the DNC is considering rebroadcasting Clinton's Monday night speech, which many called "masterful," Obama's speech, or simply allowing Obama to deliver the acceptance speech for John Kerry. Earlier yesterday, John Kerry gave a speech to the United Association Of Caffeine Processors, none of whom fell asleep.

	29-07-2004 06:17									#174
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo Opinions You Should Have:

	29-07-2004 06:18									#175
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Onion-clone.

	29-07-2004 06:33									#176
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Granholm (Michigan Governor) isn't a bad speaker. And she isn't bad looking (hittable if she were younger ).

	29-07-2004 08:19									#177
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo In what way was Dean's speech "reckless?"

I never saw Dean's speech, but when I listened to one of the CNN commentators compare Dean's speech with Sharpton's in the way they attacked Bush, I presumed they were both similarly reckless.

	29-07-2004 08:32									#178
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Did your spine become gelatinous through some freak accident, or were you born that way?

Anyways Edwards was fine tonight, but he essentially covered the same themes as Obama in a less eloquent and less effective way.

	29-07-2004 08:34									#179
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quote: Originally posted by The Emperor Fabulous His speech, like always is INSANELY racially charged...but he said the following: "You think we'd have more leverage if we voted equally for both parties. But the ones who got our vote earned our vote. We got our Civil Rights under a democrat. We got the right to vote under a democrat. We got the right to organize under a democrat." Is he wrong?

Personally, the Democrats haven't even earned anything, but the idea that the Republicans have earned the black vote is laughable.

	29-07-2004 08:46									#180
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Edwards had a 'meh' speech. I can only hope Kerry's is better.