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Lawrence of Arabia is offline Lawrence of Arabia
King
of the Gulag Archipelago
Apr 2001
time: 06:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 21:38
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yeah, but everyone was laughing at Bush in the UN because he lied to them. everyone and their brother in europe laugh at Bush, and call him a stupid idiotic cowboy.

vote badnarik.

GePap is offline GePap
King
of the Big Apple
Nov 2001
time: 23:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 21:40
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quote:
Originally posted by The diplomat
Bush speech at the UN was far superior to Kerry meaningless drivel. Kerry's claim that he can build a better coalition is simply unrealistic. Why in the world would France or Germany send their soldiers to die in Iraq for no reason?


I thought you thought there was a reason to be in Iraq...

Stop flip-flopping!

MalevolentLight is offline MalevolentLight
King
High Above
Jul 1999
time: 00:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 21:43
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quote:
Monday, Sept. 20, 2004
Kerry Sets a Record: 14 Flip-Flops in One Speech

Sen. John Kerry set some kind of record today in a speech to his fellow leftists at New York University. The Republican National Committee counted 14 flip-flops on Iraq.



Among the more egregious of the tragicomic whoppers noted:

Story Continues Below




Kerry now claims the "most important task" is to win the "war on terrorism." Yet Kerry, speaking to his pets at the New York Times in March, refused to call the war on terror a war, RNC recalled.
Kerry then: "The final victory in the war on terror depends on a victory in the war of ideas, much more than the war on the battlefield. And the war - not the war, I don’t want to use that terminology."



Kerry now claims Iraq was a "diversion from" the war on terror. On Dec. 15 he said: "Iraq may not be the war on terror itself, but it is critical to the outcome of the war on terror."

Kerry now claims Saddam Hussein's evil was not enough to justify war. Here's what he said in a speech July 29, 2002:
"I agree completely with this administration’s goal of a regime change in Iraq – Saddam Hussein is a renegade and outlaw who turned his back on the tough conditions of his surrender put in place by the United Nations in 1991."



Kerry now claims Saddam’s "downfall ... has left America less secure." Oopsy: Here's his anti-Dean, anti-Saddam stand in December 2003, according to Newsday:
"Those who doubted whether Iraq or the world would be better off without Saddam Hussein, and those who believe we are not safer with his capture, don’t have the judgment to be president or the credibility to be elected president."


Kerry now claims the decision to go into Iraq was a "colossal" failure. Yet on Aug. 9, Kerry said that had he known then what he knew now, he would still have voted for the use-of-force resolution, according to CNN:
"Yes, I would have voted for the authority. I believe it's the right authority for a president to have. But I would have used that authority, as I have said throughout this campaign, effectively."


Kerry now claims Saddam was not a "threat to our security." Here's what he said in January 2003, according to the L.A. Times: "If you don't believe ... Saddam Hussein is a threat with nuclear weapons, then you shouldn't vote for me."


Kerry now claims Saddam's "capability to acquire weapons" was not reason enough for war. Yet according to the Congressional Record of Oct. 9, 2002, he called those who would leave the Iraqi dictator alone "naive to the point of grave danger."
And so on and so forth.

At least no one can say Kerry is two-faced. He has so many more faces than that.


All hail Teh Kerry.

MalevolentLight is offline MalevolentLight
King
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Jul 1999
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 21:45
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quote:
and call him a stupid idiotic cowboy.


Well that statement right there just proves European intellectual superiority.

Atahualpa is offline Atahualpa
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Hawthrone
Mar 1999
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 21:54 Visit Atahualpa's homepage!
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actually it proves that bush has lost all credibility on an international level

The diplomat is offline The diplomat
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Terre Haute, IN USA
Sep 1999
time: 23:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 21:56
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quote:
Originally posted by GePap


I thought you thought there was a reason to be in Iraq...

Stop flip-flopping!


Yes I believe there was a reason. But I was talking about France and Germany. From their perspective, they have no reason to send troops.

Kontiki is offline Kontiki
Settler
Canada
Aug 2001
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 21:56
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I'm just not getting any of this debate. If you think Iraq was handled even reasonably well, then vote for Bush and just not give a rat's ass what Kerry says or does or thinks. If you think it was handled poorly, then why would you reward the Bush admin for their incompetance?

MalevolentLight is offline MalevolentLight
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Jul 1999
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 21:59
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quote:
I'm just not getting any of this debate. If you think Iraq was handled even reasonably well, then vote for Bush and just not give a rat's ass what Kerry says or does or thinks. If you think it was handled poorly, then why would you reward the Bush admin for their incompetance?


Yep, you did an awesome job not getting into this debate. That last line, priceless. Lets ask everyone to stop attacking kerry and in the same breath attack Bush.

The diplomat is offline The diplomat
King
Terre Haute, IN USA
Sep 1999
time: 23:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 22:02
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quote:
Originally posted by Kontiki
I'm just not getting any of this debate. If you think Iraq was handled even reasonably well, then vote for Bush and just not give a rat's ass what Kerry says or does or thinks. If you think it was handled poorly, then why would you reward the Bush admin for their incompetance?


Because it is important to know whether Kerry's solutions will work or not. If you think Bush screwed up Iraq, you still need to know if Kerry as president can fix it. If he can't, then why vote for him?

Q Cubed is offline Q Cubed
Prince
t3h y3ll0w p3ril
Apr 1999
time: 23:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 22:15 Visit Q Cubed's homepage!
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Fez: You can't PWN somebody who is right, Imran.
Drake: You tell him, Fezzie.
Imran: Exactly, so I can't be PWNED. Thanks Fez!
Imran: Haha, Fez is on your side... you automatically loooose
Drake: I thought he was on your side...

Summary: Fez says you can't PWN somebody who's right. Drake claims that first it refers to him (You tell him, Fezzie!), and then tries to pin Fez onto Imran. Imran claims that it refers to him, and then tries to pin Fez on Drake.

God, I hate flip-floppers. You disgust me.

BTW, I can think of two things that Bush flip-flopped on: Global Warming and NKorea.

Kontiki is offline Kontiki
Settler
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Aug 2001
time: 00:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 22:18
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quote:
Originally posted by MalevolentLight


Yep, you did an awesome job not getting into this debate. That last line, priceless. Lets ask everyone to stop attacking kerry and in the same breath attack Bush.


Where are you getting that from? If you're not happy with the way someone's performed, why would you validate that performance? And conversely if you're happy with their performance, then why would you care if someone said it wasn't good?

MalevolentLight is offline MalevolentLight
King
High Above
Jul 1999
time: 00:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 22:23
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How about the fact that your first sentence
quote:
If you think Iraq was handled even reasonably well, then vote for Bush and just not give a rat's ass what Kerry says or does or thinks.
shows an obviously liberal bias. Key words there being "even reasonably well" and you then go on to say not to gives a rat's ass which basically amounts to "don't attack kerry anymore". Then in your fiinal sentences you say
quote:
If you think it was handled poorly, then why would you reward the Bush admin for their incompetance?
which again shows your liberal bias. You are ineffect calling the Bush adminstration incompetent. You then go on to say that you are being fair when it is obvious that you are leaning to the left. Do you work for network news?

Kontiki is offline Kontiki
Settler
Canada
Aug 2001
time: 00:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 22:27
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quote:
Originally posted by The diplomat


Because it is important to know whether Kerry's solutions will work or not. If you think Bush screwed up Iraq, you still need to know if Kerry as president can fix it. If he can't, then why vote for him?


Maybe because he didn't break it in the first place?

Q Cubed is offline Q Cubed
Prince
t3h y3ll0w p3ril
Apr 1999
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 22:28 Visit Q Cubed's homepage!
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@ml

* Q Cubed gives ML a tinfoil hat

Kontiki is offline Kontiki
Settler
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Aug 2001
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 22:38
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quote:
Originally posted by MalevolentLight
How about the fact that your first sentence shows an obviously liberal bias. Key words there being "even reasonably well" and you then go on to say not to gives a rat's ass which basically amounts to "don't attack kerry anymore". Then in your fiinal sentences you say which again shows your liberal bias. You are ineffect calling the Bush adminstration incompetent. You then go on to say that you are being fair when it is obvious that you are leaning to the left. Do you work for network news?


If you think the Bush admin screwed up Iraq, then what would you possibly think other than that they were incompetent? If you don't, then you probably wouldn't think them incompetent. So, if you don't think them incompetent, then why wouldn't you just say that instead of attacking Kerry? I don't see where Kerry has played any real role, good or bad, in what's going on in Iraq right now. The argument as it exists looks a hell of alot like "Hey, you f*cked up!" "Yeah, I f*cked up, but I don't like your ideas, so vote for me instead!"

You're last little jab has me curious though. What would you consider an unbiased opinion?

Ned is offline Ned
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of Aptos, CA
Oct 1999
time: 21:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 22:44
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I haven't read all the posts in this thread, but I have two comments:

1) Saddam was funding the Muslim Brotherhood and al Qaida through the oil-for-food program. A detailed breakdown on how this was done was reported Sunday by FOXNews.

2) Kerry's Iraq "plan" is virtually identical to what Bush is and has been doing. So much for Kerry's demand for a "change" in course.

3) Kerry has no idea on how to defeat terrorism. Bush does. Kerry will use America's power -- without much more. Bush will bring democracy and hope to the Muslim world.

Q Cubed is offline Q Cubed
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t3h y3ll0w p3ril
Apr 1999
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 22:47 Visit Q Cubed's homepage!
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quote:
3) Kerry has no idea on how to defeat terrorism. Bush does. Kerry will use America's power -- without much more. Bush will bring democracy and hope to the Muslim world.

he's doing a bang-up job of that, isn't he?

Ned is offline Ned
Prince
of Aptos, CA
Oct 1999
time: 21:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 22:54
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Q Cubed, what is the old saying about making an omlette?

The diplomat is offline The diplomat
King
Terre Haute, IN USA
Sep 1999
time: 23:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 22:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Kontiki
Maybe because he didn't break it in the first place?


He did vote for the war in Iraq so using your line of reasoning, he gave Bush permission to "break" Iraq. So he is partly to blame.

aaglo is offline aaglo
King
the contradiction is filled with holes...
Aug 2001
time: 07:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 23:11
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You can't make an omlette without ending up with some 20000 dead Iraqi's?

Now, Saddam Hussein is captured. Now what? USA tries to forcefeed 'democracy and hope' to the Iraqi people? The last year indicates, that they aren't doing very good job, so there must be something wrong. But what? Maybe they don't want democracy - at least the kind of democracy USA is offering them.

And what's this talk about "western world versus muslim world"? That does not compute: west is a word for direction, and muslim is a word for religious 'alignment'. The correct term should be 'christian world vs muslim world' (and perhaps the word world after the christians should be replaced with USA-and-it's-allies-minus-some-muslim-countries').

@Ned:
You mentioned the oil-for-food program & Iraq - Al-Qaeda connections in FoxNews. I think that's pretty far-fetched from Fox trying to link them together. USA&Iraq and USA&Al-Qaeda has considerable common history. There would be a much better link between Iraq and Al-Qaeda if you just put USA in between them.

Q Cubed is offline Q Cubed
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t3h y3ll0w p3ril
Apr 1999
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 23:14 Visit Q Cubed's homepage!
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quote:
Q Cubed, what is the old saying about making an omlette?

Saddam's one mighty rotten egg, wouldn't you say? He's b0rked, but the Bush's omlette isn't palatable, is it?

Ogie Oglethorpe is offline Ogie Oglethorpe
King
Marietta, GA
Dec 1999
time: 05:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 23:16
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quote:

BUSH HAS NEW AD FEATURING KERRY WINDSURFING [09/22 10:54 AM]

Boy, Kerry's windsurfing must poll terribly.

The Bush campaign is rolling out a new ad, featuring Kerry windsurfing, with the image of him surfing, changing from left to right and back and forth, as an announcer points out his rapidly-changing positions for and against the same bill or issue.

The closing line: "John Kerry: Whichever way the wind blows."




Lawrence of Arabia is offline Lawrence of Arabia
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Apr 2001
time: 06:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 23:17
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saddam was NOT funding al qaeda. any other truths from fox news?

quote:
Well that statement right there just proves European intellectual superiority.


actually, it proves that bush has lost all credibility on the international level. he wont be able to build global consensus and alliances with people who dont trust him. and since the war on terror is a global one, he wont be able to advance against al qaeda.

plus, im an american. hahahah.

Q Cubed is offline Q Cubed
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t3h y3ll0w p3ril
Apr 1999
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 23:18 Visit Q Cubed's homepage!
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quote:
plus, im an american. hahahah.

according to ML, all of us who don't support bush can't be real americans.

Ogie Oglethorpe is offline Ogie Oglethorpe
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Dec 1999
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 23:19
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quote:

Tuesday, September 21, 2004

Swift Votes for Kerry

Recently, dear reader, we here at “The Hatemonger’s Quarterly” got a ‘phone call from John Kerry for President Headquarters. It seems as if our humble “weblog” has grown in popularity in such leaps and bounds that it caught the eye of the Democratic contender for the President of the United States of America. (Hard to believe, isn’t it? Well, that’s the premise of today’s post, so you might as well start “suspending disbelief” now, or you aren’t going to enjoy what follows. Spoilsport.)

A member of Kerry’s campaign staff informed us that we could help assure John Kerry’s victory in November. To be honest, we, the crack young staff of “The Hatemonger’s Quarterly,” weren’t that enthusiastic about this prospect. We have a tough time rallying behind a candidate who makes Al Gore seem like Jim Carey. As such, this Kerry staffer decided to sweeten the deal: He offered us a fairly sizeable sum in order to help strategize for the Democrats’ campaign.

Although we, the crack young staff of “The Hatemonger’s Quarterly,” are already pulling in the big bucks (without any “Whammies”) from our new “blogspot.com” advertisements, we figured that a little extra cash wouldn’t hurt. Accordingly, we informed this humble Kerry staff member—let’s just call him “George Soros”—that we would be pleased as punch to help out. We, the crack young staff, were reporting for duty. Or something.

Immediately after agreeing to hop on board the Kerry Broken Rickshaw to Victory, we got our first assignment: Come up with a new way to ensure that undecided voters go to the polls and plump for Mr. Kerry.

Frankly, it seemed a rather daunting task. We figured that by this time in the campaign Mr. Kerry’s team would have come up with his own campaign to woo undecideds. After all, Mr. Kerry has voted both for and against pretty much every important piece of legislation of the last 19 years; surely the Kerry Camp can find some way to spin this?

Apparently not. As such, dear reader, we, the crack young staff of “The Hatemonger’s Quarterly,” had to think long and hard about a strategy for Mr. Kerry.

After much frettin’ and a-fussin’, we think we landed on just the thing.

“The Hatemonger’s Quarterly” Official Strategy for John Kerry: “With Your Help, I Can Be President of the United States—Just Tell Me What To Say!”

Our entreaty to the public takes the shape of a 60-second television spot featuring Mr. John Kerry himself. After offering a few photographs showing the candidate kissing hands and shaking babies, the ad gets down to brass tacks: Mr. Kerry, clad in a blue button-down shirt and a gray pair of slacks, sits atop John Edwards and delivers a direct appeal to the viewing audience:

My name is John Kerry, and I am running for the President of the United States of America. With your help, we can beat George W. Bush and his fellow draft-dodging chicken hawks—like Colin Powell.

This President has been reckless in his deployment of American troops. If I were Commander-in-Chief, I may or may not have liberated Iraq. I’m still ironing that out with a focus group. But I can promise to you that I would have second- and third-guessed myself at least fifty times by now.

Unlike George W. Bush, when I make a decision, I either stand behind it or I do not. Sometimes I do both.

And this gets me to the heart of my message: I really, really want to be President, but I have no idea how to get you to vote for me. So, just tell me what to say, and I’ll say it.

I don’t mean to sound desperate, but my campaign is starting to get that musty Michael Dukakis smell. And I’ve always wanted to be President. I swear. Honest to God. I figured I was pretty much bred and born for the job.

In fact, if it helps at all, the following people strongly support my candidacy: Saddam Hussein, Osama bin Laden, Yasir Arafat, and the Mad Mullahs of Iran. Jimmy Carter says those are some pretty nice folks. One of them even won the Nobel Piece of Israel Prize.

So, America, I urge you to tell me what to say. I’ll say it, I promise you.

We’re the crack young staff of “The Hatemonger’s Quarterly,” and we approve of this message.




Good stuff!

Kontiki is offline Kontiki
Settler
Canada
Aug 2001
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 23:25
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quote:
Originally posted by The diplomat


He did vote for the war in Iraq so using your line of reasoning, he gave Bush permission to "break" Iraq. So he is partly to blame.


So his vote to authorize the use of force came along with a rider as to how the whole operation would be run?

Q Cubed is offline Q Cubed
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t3h y3ll0w p3ril
Apr 1999
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 23:32 Visit Q Cubed's homepage!
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it's not that funny.

this is funny:

"You see the pictures in the paper today of John Kerry windsurfing? He's at his home in Nantucket this week, doing his favorite thing, windsurfing. Even his hobby depends on which way the wind blows." —Jay Leno

"Have you folks been following the controversy with John Kerry and his service in Vietnam and the Swift Boat campaign? It all took place in Vietnam and now it just won't go away. I was thinking about this — if John Kerry had just ducked the war like everybody else he wouldn't have this trouble." —David Letterman

"The latest issue of GQ magazine, John Kerry talks about what a man should look for in a woman. GQ? If John Kerry is going to talk about what he likes in a woman, shouldn't it be in Fortune or Money magazine?" --Jay Leno

"Vice President Dick Cheney attacked John Kerry. He said that John Kerry 'lacks deeply held convictions.' Today Kerry shot back, he said, 'That's not completely true.'" —Jay Leno

"There was an embarrassing moment at a recent Democratic fundraiser. When John Kerry was handed a $10 million dollar check, he said, 'I do.'" —Craig Kilborn

"John Kerry suspended his campaign for five days this week in honor of President Reagan. And right now, he's ahead in the polls. How's that make him feel? Disappears for a week and he's up in the polls. What else can he do now but go into hiding." —Jay Leno

"John Kerry met with Ralph Nader last week. Both sides of every issue were discussed. And then, Nader spoke." —Jay Leno

"The prisoner scandal is yet another election year problem for President Bush. And, with the economy still struggling, combat operations in Iraq dragging on, and the 9-11 hearings revealing damning information, even an opponent of limited political skill should be able to capitalize on those problems. The Democrats, however, chose to nominate John Kerry." —Jon Stewart

"Insiders have begun voicing serious concerns about how he's conducting his campaign. One aide told the New York Times that while Bush's message of 'steady leadership' has remained consistent, Kerry has gone through six different messages in the 18 months he's been running, including, at one particularly desperate juncture, 'Kerry: Health care jobs for the troops' environment.'" —Jon Stewart

"John Kerry's wife Teresa Heinz is on the cover of Newsweek magazine this week and they said that if he is elected president, she will be the oldest first lady in American history. But that doesn't bother John Kerry, he said, 'To me, she looks like a million bucks'" —Jay Leno

Ogie Oglethorpe is offline Ogie Oglethorpe
King
Marietta, GA
Dec 1999
time: 05:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 23:36
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Q^3

The windsurfing one will be a real ad. Thats what makes it funny.

Kuciwalker is offline Kuciwalker
Emperor
of Schmooism
Feb 2001
time: 00:22
  Old Post 22-09-2004 23:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
You mean the same weapons systems our military would be using if Cheney's recommendations while he was SefDef had carried as well? Obviously Cheney agreed with Kerry's votes back then. Why is it different now? The B-52 is antiquated, why shouldn't we modernize?


Because the B-52 is a perfectly good aircraft and works.

Velociryx is offline Velociryx
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Apr 1999
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  Old Post 22-09-2004 23:38 Visit Velociryx's homepage!
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Every conservative's favorite Chia pet summed it up beauitfully the other day....

paraphrase was that you should vote for bush because 47% of Americans trusted him to "do the right thing" vs 45% for Kerry.

2% difference in a poll with a 3% margin for error = "bush is the lesser of the two evils"

And this is the best the conservative maven can come up with!

That says a LOT for the abilities (or complete lack thereof) of either mainline candidate.

Both of these guys suck.

To argue about which one sucks more seems....rather a waste of effort, non?

-=Vel=-

 
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