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Cruddy
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quote:
Originally posted by MrFun
If killing unarmed enemies is not a big deal, then I suppose you don't think the beheadings of American and English civilians is a big deal, either? |
Not such a big deal as ensuring our side's behaviour is above board.
We cannot prevent civilians being beheaded. But we can act to make sure that atrocities on both sides are recorded and punished.
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Arrian
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Kneel before Grog!
Jul 2001
time: 00:18
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quote:
FALLUJA, Iraq (Reuters) - U.S. Marines rallied round a comrade under investigation for killing a wounded Iraqi during the offensive in Falluja, saying he was probably under combat stress in unpredictable, hair-trigger circumstances.
Marines interviewed on Tuesday said they didn't see the shooting as a scandal, rather the act of a comrade who faced intense pressure during the effort to quell the insurgency in the city.
"I can see why he would do it. He was probably running around being shot at for days on end in Falluja. There should be an investigation but they should look into the circumstances," said Lance Corporal Christopher Hanson.
"I would have shot the insurgent too. Two shots to the head," said Sergeant Nicholas Graham, 24, of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. "You can't trust these people. He should not be investigated. He did nothing wrong."
The military command launched an investigation after video footage showed a U.S. Marine shooting a wounded and unarmed man in a mosque in the city on Saturday. The man was one of five wounded and left in the mosque after Marines fought their way through the area.
A pool report by NBC correspondent Kevin Sites said the mosque had been used by insurgents to attack U.S. forces, who stormed it, killing 10 militants and wounding the five. Sites said the wounded had been left for others to pick up.
A second group of Marines entered the mosque on Saturday after reports it had been reoccupied. Footage from the embedded television crew showed the five still in the mosque, although several appeared to be close to death, Sites said.
He said a Marine noticed one prisoner was still breathing.
A Marine can be heard saying on the pool footage provided to Reuters Television: "He's f***ing faking he's dead."
"The Marine then raises his rifle and fires into the man's head," Sites said.
NBC said the Marine, who had reportedly been shot in the face himself the previous day, said immediately after the shooting: "Well, he's dead now."
THOROUGH PROBE PROMISED
The Marine commander in Falluja, Lieutenant General John Sattler, said his men followed the law of conflict and held themselves to a high standard of accountability.
"The facts of this case will be thoroughly pursued to make an informed decision and to protect the rights of all persons involved," he said.
Marines have repeatedly described the rebels they fought against in Falluja as ruthless fighters who didn't play by the rules. They say the investigation is politically motivated.
"It's all political. This Marine has been under attack for days. It has nothing to do with what he did," said Corporal Keith Hoy, 23.
Rights group Amnesty International said on Monday both sides in the Falluja fighting had broken the rules of war governing the protection of civilians and wounded combatants.
Gunnery Sergeant Christopher Garza, 30, favored an investigation but like other Marines said the Pentagon (news - web sites) should weigh its decision carefully.
"He should have captured him. Maybe the insurgent had some valuable information. There may have been mitigating circumstances. Maybe his two buddies died in Falluja," he said.
Sites said: "I have witnessed the Marines behaving as a disciplined and professional force throughout this offensive. In this particular case, it certainly was a confusing situation to say the least."
The U.S. military has been embarrassed by scandals in Iraq (news - web sites), most prominently the Abu Ghraib affair in which at least eight U.S. soldiers have been tried or face courts-martial over the abuse of prisoners at the jail outside Baghdad.
There have also been several cases in which soldiers have been charged with wrongfully killing Iraqis during operations. |
The parts I find interesting:
1) The soldier who confidently asserted he did nothing wrong. Nick of Philly, dude, you worry me. The others said investigate, but consider the circumstances (natural for a soldier to say, I feel).
2) The Marines went into to Mosque "after reports that it had been reoccupied." That has to be considered a mitigating factor.
-Arrian
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Sprayber
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Dixie
Oct 2000
time: 23:18
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http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...iraq_hostage_15
quote:
BAGHDAD, Iraq - Kidnapped aid worker Margaret Hassan was believed to be dead Tuesday after a video received by Al-Jazeera television showed a hooded figure shooting a blindfolded woman in the head.
The British government and Hassan's family in London said they believed the longtime director of CARE in Iraq (news - web sites) was the victim. CARE said it was in mourning for the 59-year-old Briton who worked for decades providing food, medicine and humanitarian aid to Iraqis.
The video shows a militant firing a pistol into the head of a blindfolded woman wearing an orange jumpsuit, Al-Jazeera spokesman Jihad Ballout said. "She was presumed to be Mrs. Hassan," he told The Associated Press.
The station initially said it would air parts of the video, but Ballout then said it would not.
Hassan was abducted in Baghdad on Oct. 19, the most prominent of more than 170 foreigners kidnapped in Iraq this year. Her captors later issued videos showing her pleading for Britain to withdraw its troops from Iraq and calling for the release of female Iraqi prisoners.
Ballout said the station received the tape a few days ago but had not been sure of its authenticity.
"We invited British diplomatic officials to come and view it ... with the aim of helping us ascertain whether it was Mrs. Hassan or not," he said. "It's now likely that the image depicts Mrs. Hassan."
In London, British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw said that based on the experts' examination of the video, "we have today had to inform Margaret Hassan's family that, sadly, we now believe that she has probably been murdered, although we cannot conclude this with complete certainty."
In an emotional plea on Al-Jazeera, Hassan's husband said he had heard of the video but did not know whether it was authentic. He asked the kidnappers to return his wife to him.
"I appeal to those who took my wife (to tell me) what they did with her," Tahsin Ali Hassan said, his voice choked with tears. "They can contact me or the Iraqi Peace Organization. I want my wife, dead or alive. If she is dead, please let me know of her whereabouts so I can bury her in peace."
British Prime Minister Tony Blair (news - web sites) expressed sympathy Tuesday with Hassan's family. His office said Blair "shares their abhorrence at the cruel treatment of someone who devoted so many years of their life to helping the people of Iraq."
Hassan's four brothers and sisters said they believe she was dead.
"Our hearts are broken," they said in a statement released by the British Foreign Office. "We have kept hoping for as long as we could, but we now have to accept that Margaret has probably gone and at last her suffering has ended."
The family did not indicate why they now believed Hassan was dead, but said: "Those who are guilty of this atrocious act, and those who support them, have no excuses."
"It is with profound sadness that we have learned of the existence of a video in which it appears that our colleague Margaret Hassan has been killed," CARE said in a statement. "The whole of CARE is in mourning."
On Sunday, U.S. Marines found the mutilated body of what they believe was a Western woman on a street in a Fallujah during the U.S. assault on the insurgent stronghold. The body's identity, if known, has not been made public. Besides Hassan, the only Western woman known held was Teresa Borcz Khalifa, 54, a Polish-born longtime resident of Iraq who was seized last month.
Al-Jazeera reported on Nov. 2 that Hassan's captors had threatened to turn her over to followers of Jordanian militant Abu Musab al-Zarqawi.
Al-Zarqawi and his men have been blamed for numerous deadly car bombings and the slayings of foreign hostages, including three Americans and a Briton. More than 170 foreigners have been kidnapped in Iraq this year; more than 30 of them have been slain.
Born in Ireland, Hassan also held British and Iraqi citizenship. She lived in Iraq for 30 years and married an Iraqi. She became well known among aid agencies for her work, helping distribute food and medicine to Iraqis during the more than a decade that Iraq was under U.N. sanctions.
Britain's Straw expressed his sympathy to Hassan's family and condemned the killing.
"To kidnap and kill anyone is inexcusable. But it is repugnant to commit such a crime against a woman who has spent most of her life working for the good of the people of Iraq," Straw said in a statement.
In its statement, her family said: "Nobody can justify this. Margaret was against sanctions and the war. To commit such a crime against anyone is unforgivable. But we cannot believe how anybody could do this to our kind, compassionate sister.
"The gap she leaves will never be filled." |
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Ned
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of Aptos, CA
Oct 1999
time: 21:18
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To be fair, Azazel to the other side in this argument, the woman hostage posed a grave risk to her kidnappers. She had been allowed to be by herself for a while. What did she do? Pick up an AK47 and start spraying the brave jihadist with bullets. When overpowered, she pretended to be dead to get the sons of Allah to drop their guard.
Her beheading, by Zarqawi, the commander in chief, was a simple act of self defense by rattled young men in the heat of combat.
Last edited by Ned on 17-11-2004 at 02:36
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16-11-2004 22:26
You're really having a hard time with this aren't you? It must be tough.
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