07-12-2004 23:20									#91
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okay, first part played, see edited post for info

Further, I'll get to the screenshots asap. In a nutshell:
- our chain is still present
- Abilene is blocked from the sea
- Tiperrary has been razed
- we still have a spy
- all roads around our stack are pillaged.
- we can retrieve our 8 stranded marines (well, at least if there are no subs blocking)

DeepO

	07-12-2004 23:24									#92
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wow... am I seeing ghosts, or did we make a capital mistake last turn? Our stack can't threaten Quanto!!! And as it is blocked from the see, Quanto could be completely empty!

DeepO

	07-12-2004 23:31									#93
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quote: Our stack can't threaten Quanto!!!

Was kinda confused by that when I opened the save. Let's hope it confused them too.

	07-12-2004 23:43									#94
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DeepO

	07-12-2004 23:46									#95
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quote: Originally posted by alva quote: Our stack can't threaten Quanto!!! Was kinda confused by that when I opened the save. Let's hope it confused them too.

Hmmm... I see the problem, but I didn't notice it last turn. They blocked the only fork on both cities with that fortress. Somehow, that registered, but not that Quanto was now essentially safe

I'll get to the troop numbers right away.

BTW, It seems their naval blockade isn't perfect, we could still get to Abilene if we use transports. Quanto is not possible, though.

DeepO

	07-12-2004 23:46									#96
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Do we have 8 Artillery we could chain across?

	07-12-2004 23:59									#97
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forces

(- 2 galley)
- 14 art
- 25 workers (+1/turn) (+1 B, -2 used)
- 9 settlers (+.20/turn) (+2 B)
- 20 rifle
- 25 inf (15 upgraded last turn)
- 55 Marines
- 69 tanks (+0/turn) (+1 B)
- 35 MI (+1/turn) (+1 B, +15 U)
- 8 DD (-4 LiB, +1 B)
- 22 transports (-1 LiB, +1 B)
- 2 carrier
- 1 sub (+1 B)
- 3 explorer (+ .14/turn)
- 2 fighter

- Strong in strength to GoW, to ND, and to Lego.

Legoland forces:

- 1 settler (one used for fort Stanwix, next to (former?) GoW stack)
- 17 worker (+3)
- 3 horsemen
- 2 explorer (+2 B)
- 6 Cavalry (-6)
- 94 infantry (+3)
- 62 artillery
- 27 Tanks (+0)
- 6 ironclad
- 15 transport
- 1 carrier
- 8 subs (-2)
- 8 DD (-1)
- 9 BB
- 2 fighter (+2 B)
- 3 bomber
- 1 army (!)

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:01									#98
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quote: Originally posted by Aeson Do we have 8 Artillery we could chain across?

Yes we have... any plans?

Ah, I see. unload them in the newly build city, and bombard those ships. For the Quanto blockade it won't be enough, though. And the other stack only needs 1 hp off the BB, and 3 off the TR, so we don't need the full 8 arts, we would probably manage with e.g. 6.

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:05									#99
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I was wondering why Lego has gone for the forest. Sure, it stops movement, but as the tile on Q21 is already pillaged, we wouldn't have any movement left anyway. We can't settlerblitz our way to that tile...

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:05									#100
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If we chained across 8 Artillery and bombarded Lego's BB blockade in front of Quanto we might get through. 2 of the BBs are elite and won't get promotions, only the 4/4 can promote.

If the BBs are redlined we have a 2/4 DD that should be able to take the 1/4 BB, which should be on top, leaving two 1/5 BB. With 11 4/4 Transports against 2 HP of BB we win 83% of the time. If the 1/4 BB survives, we'll almost certainly have to go through 3 HP of BB, which is 65% still for us to win. 45% against 4 HP.

We'd need some luck when bombarding to do it, but we wouldn't have to risk any units unless it has a good chance to work out. If Quanto is undefended or very sparcely defended, and Abilene has tons of units (as it should) this could be a good thing to try. We only risk units we would be disbanding most likely, give up some Settlers and MI to get across, but have Artillery support to help us out.

	08-12-2004 00:08									#101
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quote: Originally posted by DeepO I was wondering why Lego has gone for the forest. Sure, it stops movement, but as the tile on Q21 is already pillaged, we wouldn't have any movement left anyway. We can't settlerblitz our way to that tile... DeepO

They might not have a Spy. From their POV, we could have some Cavalry, if only built this turn, that they couldn't know about.

	08-12-2004 00:08									#102
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just a small note: 1 of the BBs has retreated, most likely into a city for healing. it won't return next turn, but the one thereafter. In case we could again threaten Lego with our transports so they have to block, instead of attack us, we could lure most of their BBs even farther away from our chain, and have a reasonable chance our chain will also survive next turn.

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:10									#103
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quote: Originally posted by DeepO Ah, I see. unload them in the newly build city, and bombard those ships. DeepO

??? What am I missing ???

	08-12-2004 00:11									#104
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No, they do have a spy, as they exposed us last turn. Spies do not disappear. But you're right, in case GoW would give us saltpeter and mil trad, we could build them.

Maybe we should ask GoW to provide that to us. Not that we build them, but it would cost Lego a couple of workers each turn, spent on forests.

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:13									#105
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quote: Originally posted by Aeson If we chained across 8 Artillery and bombarded Lego's BB blockade in front of Quanto we might get through. 2 of the BBs are elite and won't get promotions, only the 4/4 can promote. If the BBs are redlined we have a 2/4 DD that should be able to take the 1/4 BB, which should be on top, leaving two 1/5 BB. With 11 4/4 Transports against 2 HP of BB we win 83% of the time. If the 1/4 BB survives, we'll almost certainly have to go through 3 HP of BB, which is 65% still for us to win. 45% against 4 HP. We'd need some luck when bombarding to do it, but we wouldn't have to risk any units unless it has a good chance to work out. If Quanto is undefended or very sparcely defended, and Abilene has tons of units (as it should) this could be a good thing to try. We only risk units we would be disbanding most likely, give up some Settlers and MI to get across, but have Artillery support to help us out.

the problem is that 11 transports might get us there, but we wouldn't have any units left to defend the city. We can't use the transport twice, so only what is left of our transports can bring in defenders.

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:15									#106
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alva, we're talking about Inchon (or whatever we're going to call our new city). The stack we landed last turn contains a settler, and whatever we do, we're going to build a new city at that spot, even if it is only for (un)loading units without losing movement points.

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:16									#107
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I think that no matter what kind of plan we'd be going for, we are going to investigate Abilene, right? I could do that right now. Investigating Quanto is only needed if we would go that option...

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:18									#108
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quote: Originally posted by DeepO - 1 settler (one used for fort Stanwix, next to (former?) GoW stack) - 17 worker (+3) - 3 horsemen - 2 explorer (+2 B) - 6 Cavalry (-6) - 94 infantry (+3) - 62 artillery - 27 Tanks (+0) - 6 ironclad - 15 transport - 1 carrier - 8 subs (-2) - 8 DD (-1) - 9 BB - 2 fighter (+2 B) - 3 bomber - 1 army (!)

Fort Stanwix must be where they left all their Blitzing Tanks that survived. They wouldn't have built it if GoW's stack was gone, no point.

That's very interesting though. Abilene has to be defended. Fort Stanwix defended. Dye Fields defended. Jackson defended. 94 Infantry to go around, probably the 27 Tanks and some Infantry... maybe the bulk of the Artillery in Fort Stanwix. So ~30 Infantry average in Abilene, Dye, and Jackson against Tanks. If they do that, GoW almost surely can take Fort Stanwix... which is still connected by roads right!?!?! How many Settlers does GoW have?

We can break through 30 Infantry in Abilene if we get our Marines a path there. There is a chink somewhere, even with Quanto empty!

	08-12-2004 00:19									#109
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Getting to Quanto, and holding onto that city for one turn would be a major achievement though. It's just that we need a decent chance to hold on. Lego can reach us with > 40 tanks, after shelling us with 62 arts and a couple of bombers. Just putting e.g. 16 MI in that city is not going to be enough.

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:21									#110
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quote: Originally posted by DeepO the problem is that 11 transports might get us there, but we wouldn't have any units left to defend the city. We can't use the transport twice, so only what is left of our transports can bring in defenders. DeepO

Well we'd be doing it if it were empty, so really we'd only need 1 Marine to do enough damage to make it worthwhile to have broken through.

I think there's probably a better use for our Artillery though. I think we need to investigate Abilene. Then maybe move one of our N Marines to check out Quanto.

	08-12-2004 00:22									#111
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quote: Originally posted by DeepO alva, we're talking about Inchon (or whatever we're going to call our new city). The stack we landed last turn contains a settler, and whatever we do, we're going to build a new city at that spot, even if it is only for (un)loading units without losing movement points. DeepO

Yeah, I get that. I just forgot arty has a two bombard range.

	08-12-2004 00:27									#112
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quote: Originally posted by Aeson Fort Stanwix must be where they left all their Blitzing Tanks that survived. They wouldn't have built it if GoW's stack was gone, no point.

GoW's stack couldn't be gone, there simply were too many units (40 inf, 40 T, 40 M?)

here's a pic:



The only difference I also see, is that another tile has been pillaged at Dye Fields 23.

quote: How many Settlers does GoW have?

I'm not sure... only a couple. Reinforcements were on the way, I thought, maybe they've got a chain present. We should ask...

quote: We can break through 30 Infantry in Abilene if we get our Marines a path there. There is a chink somewhere, even with Quanto empty!

Yes, it's not perfect this time, like it was last. But Lego is still playing extremely well, we are not getting any breaks here...

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:30									#113
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Yeah, that's what I said above (somewhere). We are always going to need to investigate Abilene, to see what's in that city.

Quanto: if we do not load our marines again, they would be best spread out, after a couple of them pillage some roads. Or, move all of them next to Quanto. 8 marines means a diversion for 4 tanks, which they simply can't risk... or they lose a city.

I'm investigating Abilene right now.

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:38									#114
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Cost of investigating Abilene: 209 gold.



troops:
- 1 army of 3 infs
- 50 infs
- 3 cavs
- 8 art
- 2 bombers.

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:39									#115
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So, basically, half Lego's forces are in that city. Size 14 metropolis, I doubt that even with bombardment we've got a decent chance of taking it.

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:41									#116
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GoW is before Vox in turn order, right? It could otherwise be a ruse, where Vox gets the fort city or one of the other two before GoW, and razes it.

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:45									#117
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BTW, here's GoW's report from last turn:
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...265#post3456265

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:47									#118
	Remove this text

Could be a ruse. It will cost them a city, and GoW may very well be able to roll next turn.

We don't have much chance against 50 Inf. Our Marines get through 10-11 Inf (or a like number of HPs). Our 68 Tanks get through 30-32. 40 is low single digit odds. So Abilene is out.

	08-12-2004 00:48									#119
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If Gow has any cav left (and we can ask them to change their build queue without any 'exploiting' problems), they can chain these over instead of the tanks, and take Legopolis if it's undefended, or only lightly defended. I simply don't see GoW's forces utterly destroyed, they simply must have that settler left.

DeepO

	08-12-2004 00:52									#120
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Wow... there is a problem on GoW's side as well. As long as that fort exists, GoW can't build a city! So, their 36 tanks, plus possible 8 chainers can't be used to take Stanwix.

Very clever strategic use of a city!

DeepO