02-12-2004 22:31									#61
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Culture flip risks will not be too much of a problem, vmxa. At least at first, we've got to defend what we capture, meaning that there will be a larger garrison than needed. and in case of settler hopping our way, we're not going to keep many cities.

The reason we might need to keep a city, at least at first, is the availability of a barrakcs, and a harbor. The rest doesn't matter much.

DeepO

	02-12-2004 23:45									#62
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If I recall the mechanics of culture flipping well enough, I believe that with moderate garrison, a culture flip can be prevented entirely.
We'll have enough troops in all front cities at all times to nullify the risk of culture flips. The rest we simply cannot keep - with a small garrison (which we cannot commit anyway) we'll still be facing considerably high risks of culture flipping, and if the city flips, we lose that force.

Last edited by Shiber on 02-12-2004 at 23:57

	03-12-2004 01:07									#63
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Shiber, I worked on the culture formula many years ago... from memory, it was this:
chance = ((#foreignCitizens + #foreignTiles + #resistors) * TotalCultureRatio * 2IfHigherForeignCultureInCity * .5IfWLTKD * 2IfDisorder - #garrison)/DistanceFactor

I think that was it, but I'll check once we get so far. The DistanceFactor is somewhere between 500 and 8000, depending on closeness of the capitals.

So what we need to do, is to get the city in WLTKD, deal with all resistors, and get those foreign tiles out of our influence asap. The rest is out of our control right now, our culture is a bit less than Lego, but not much. razing a city, and rebuilding does not guarantee it won't ever flip, btw.

In our case, garrisons will be moderate, or without them chances will be relatively low. But I'll calculate precisely once we get there (although AFAIK nobody truely figured out how the distance factor was calculated)

DeepO

	03-12-2004 01:13									#64
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From memory? From, sodding, memory??


Aeson and DeepO

	03-12-2004 02:44									#65
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Just use a flip calculator, my memory is shot.

	03-12-2004 04:31									#66
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Ah, are there now flip calculators? Cool

DeepO

	03-12-2004 06:00									#67
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I also used to have a corruption calculator, and of course there's the myriad of online battle calculators, and a small number of stack calculators circling around.

	03-12-2004 06:16									#68
	Inflate your Upload Space

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showt...&threadid=53157

	03-12-2004 08:22									#69
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Bah... they stole Fitz and my work, without linking it properly That thread referenced in the first page was only one of a series, there was a culture formula thread which had the specifics. Oh, and as far as I can see, they just guess at the distance ratio (now, it is almost impossible to test this)

I didn't read through the whole thread, though, perhaps it's somewhere burried deeper.
Something else: it's quite easy to calculate the numer of garrison troops you need which would give you a chance of 0%. I would have included it if I was the programmer of that tool.

For the moment, still head calculus here. That stack calculator was most useful, this I don't like.

DeepO

	03-12-2004 09:39									#70
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Sorry I had not tried it. Here is one I have used. I had to rename it to sav.

Attachment: flipcalc.sav
This has been downloaded 1 time(s).

Last edited by vmxa1 on 03-12-2004 at 21:07

	03-12-2004 19:37									#71
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quote: Originally posted by Krill From memory? From, sodding, memory?? Aeson and DeepO

The original culture thread

They really ought to cap intelligence to prevent me from feeling so utterly stupid.

	03-12-2004 21:34									#72
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Thanks alva. As I expected, a year before the civfanatics one

And don't downplay your own intelligence, as you're wrong. It's just that culture flipping has always had a special meaning for me (I like it!), and formulas are something I'm used to for the past 25 years or so. It comes natural, a lot of the other things don't.

DeepO

	04-12-2004 01:44									#73
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quote: Originally posted by Krill From memory? From, sodding, memory??

	06-12-2004 21:28									#74
	Tired of ads?

I see that Lego mentioned a major artillery battle in the public forum. I wonder who/what they hit.

	07-12-2004 00:33									#75
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quote: 've just posted the battle log of a major military operation planned for this turn in our private forum.

That's the Vondrack quote (I think you are refering to the same one), major can just mean 'their biggest' battle involving 3 units.

	07-12-2004 07:08									#76
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

We'll see tomorrow. I've got to say, I'm curious what target they choose to hit. I'm even more curious if we've got a working chain or not. For them, it will be a decision between GoW and us, for us, it is the difference between either being the biggest threat to them this turn, or having to take it slowly, and let GoW do the work. But we'll see in a couple of hours, no need to get too excited about this.

BTW, I will be gone tomorrow for a couple of hours, as I've got an application interview to go to (not that I expect this to be the job I'm looking for, but after 2 months, it's getting time to do some interviews )

DeepO

	07-12-2004 20:26									#77
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Save's here!!

	07-12-2004 20:35									#78
	Tired of ads?

Please don't open it yet! (or keep quiet if you do)

DeepO

	07-12-2004 20:38									#79
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While waiting for the battle report, I'm going to make me some dinner. It's only 16h40 here, but at least that way I can be continously here for the next 10 hours or so.

A bit frustrating, to have the save, and still don't know what happened

DeepO

	07-12-2004 20:42									#80
	Remove this text

Pins ands needles.

	07-12-2004 20:50									#81
	Get a bigger avatar today!

They posted all they intend to for now and it is not much. They left off what occurred in the East.

	07-12-2004 20:59									#82
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quote: Originally posted by DeepO Please don't open it yet! (or keep quiet if you do) DeepO

No ( too late ) and I will.

No time to participate anyway, as I have an exam in the morning.

	07-12-2004 21:02									#83
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quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 They posted all they intend to for now and it is not much. They left off what occurred in the East.

For easier reference:

quote: 1265AD: Battle Report, Part 1 This is a partial battle report of what happened in the Western Theatre (against GS) this turn. The other part of our battle report for this turn will be posted after GS sends the save on. We believe that knowing what happened in the Eastern Theatre would grant GS too much of an advantage. - 5/5 Lego BB bombed 4/4 GS transport at Q.M. 477, 1hp off the transport - 2/4 Lego BB bombed 3/4 GS transport at Q.M. 477, 2hp off the transport - 1/4 Lego destroyer bombed 4/4 GS marine at Q.M. 77, 1 hp off the marine - 4/4 Lego BB attacked 1/4 GS transport at Q.M. 477; transport sunk, no hp lost - 1/5 Lego destroyer bombed 4/4 GS carrier at Abilene 441, 1hp off the carrier - 1/3 Lego destroyer bombed 3/4 GS destroyer at Abilene 441, 1hp off the destroyer - bomber bombed Abilene 87, 2hp off an MI - bomber bombed Abilene 87, 1hp off an MI - bomber bombed Abilene 87, 1hp off an MI - artillery bombed Abilene 87, 1hp off an MI - artillery bombed Abilene 87, 2hp off an MI - artillery bombed Abilene 87, 2hp off an MI - artillery bombed Abilene 87, missed - artillery bombed Abilene 87, 1hp off an MI - artillery bombed Abilene 87, 2hp off an MI - artillery bombed Abilene 87, 1hp off an MI - artillery bombed Abilene 87, 1hp off an MI Totals: 1 succesfull attack, GS lost a transport 16 bombing attacks, 15 successful, 1 failed

Thems got great bombers/arty.

	07-12-2004 21:58									#84
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If we still have a Spy with Lego we should be able to reasonably infer what happened by Lego's numbers.

Lucky on the bombardment but not terribly so... 37.7% on each shot, and they hit 13/21 including the second HP shots. But we do have almost all our Transports left, so it's better than we could have hoped for. In the city they soak up bombardments don't they? (Or is that just C3C where Ships/Planes are targetted first from units?) It's a free couple of improvements at the least.

	07-12-2004 22:13									#85
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One second, do I see this right? We still have a chain, and only 8 arts bombed us at A 78? (meaning that Quanto should be without arts) The 8 marines we landed weren't hit, and are possibly even retrievable? Wow.

Plan for the moment: build 2 more settlers (one will finish anyway, the other one in Cyclone). Build 1 sub in WoC, and MI where ever this is best. Start building airports in all other cities. This means we can't chain tanks, but we've got 68 4/4 tanks at Legoland already. Chaining should be 4 settlers and 4 MI (because in all likelyhood this is the last turn we can chain)

If nobody objects, I'll open the save, and play the first part (through production), and post screenshots with our current situation. I wonder if they pillaged their roads...

DeepO

	07-12-2004 22:15									#86
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quote: Originally posted by DeepO only 8 arts bombed us at A 78? (meaning that Quanto should be without arts)

Actually, I mean that in Abilene and Quanto combined, only 8 arts are present.

As to bombers hitting transports first: I've never seen it, but I never have seen otherwise either. It would be important to know...

DeepO

	07-12-2004 22:28									#87
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Standing Info

2 forest remains, D-ville 99 and WoC 23.

Defense Plan
Aeson's comments
GoW war plans
Invasion plan

Start

- GoW sends WM. accept. Sending WM in return. I was hoping GoW would have send us a bit of cash, even if they weren't required. Oh well, we'll manage.

Damn. I wanted to be smart, and check the active deals screen... checking is fine, but when trying to scroll, Civ crashed on me. I can't see if we still have rubber or not. I do see that we've got 2 deals for gems, though, one ending never, the other ending in 7 turns. Diplomacy in this game is not all fixed!


I've got to restart, and will update the rest when I get back.

Done. The remainder of this post is edited.


-------------------

- RP sends WM + 100g. Sending WM in return.

- EotS builds T. (couldn't prevent this).
- Enter city view.
- As I thought, airports are only 160 shields, not 200. But they shouldn't get the mobilization bonus either, which more or less balances out.

Due to the update bug, EotS does give the mob bonus for airports... doesn't matter, we are not gaining from this. We should be at >80 spt without mob.

- Hurricane has to finish its TR.
- Bolderberg changed to airport. (might be needed to change it back to MI)
- D-ville changed to airport
- Elipolis changed to airport
- Tempest changed to airport
- Tornado changed to settler (!) (only 1 worker needed to get back to normal, even without worker possible as the extra worker would only create extra commerce.)
- Typhoon stays on settler
- Arashi stays on MI
- Monsoon changed to airport
- Blizzard changed to DD
- WoC stays on sub (airport next?)
- the rest stays on MIs. Normally, all of the other cities can still be changed next turn, in case we decide we need over 8 airports. Changing to MIs is only possible in certain cases, and after we accept a rubber deal from GoW


- Hurricane builds TR. starts airport (DD not ideal, is better from Blizzard)

- Cyclone builds worker, starts worker.

- Tornado builds settler, starts rifle. needs worker action to work around demob bug

- Typhoon builds settler, starts rifle also needs worker action

- Blizzard builds DD, starts DD (no airport, but can be changed)

- WoC builds sub, starts sub (can be changed to airport, but I'd prefer one more sub first)

- SA builds MI, starts airport. (can be changed to MI in case we don't need >8 airports)


- 793 gold, 0%, 0bpt, +332 gpt. (minituarisation scheduled) 0/? beakers collected.

Modern Era Tech Cost

DeepO

Last edited by DeepO on 07-12-2004 at 23:17

	07-12-2004 22:52									#88
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urgent question: I made a mistake in updating the build info, it seems. Only 1 settler will finish normally. Do we want another one? (will cost us 2 extra workers, and half a tank or MI or so)

We still have 2 others on Stormia, so will get to 3, but the question is whether we want a 4th or not. I'm inclined to do this, we can always build more workers, but this might be the last turn for settlers.

It's urgent, as I'm in the middle of the build phase, and shouldn't decide this after we see if the roads are pillaged or not. If those are intact, we most definately could use another settler.

DeepO

	07-12-2004 22:55									#89
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

BTW, we lost our rubber. And as we didn't accept a new deal from GoW, we most certainly are going to be rubberless this turn. So no new tank or MI builds...

DeepO

	07-12-2004 23:06									#90
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Nobody comments on the settler? Ok. An extra settler it is...

DeepO