13-12-2004 03:49									#121
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious This is acting stupid. You are admitting that the problem is demand for houses. So you know all about scarcity. But you don't want to admit that people buying houses to rent and not to live in contributes to the problem and raises rents. That's acting stupid. And now you are just acting stupid by saying that where Vel live is different, but you know it's not, otherwise Vel wouldn't be buying houses to rent there.

Of course he would, housing that is not being sold when there is a surplus of housing brings no money to anyone.

There are some people that contribute to the scarcity problem in California, but you can't contribute to a scarcity problem where one doesn't exist. Which is the case with Vel.

He already told you that buying a house there is cheaper than renting, because there are a lot of houses available.

The only way to look at it is that either:

1) The people renting from Vel don't want to own a home.

or,

2)The people renting the home don't have good enough credit to buy a house on there own. In which case, Vel's renting them a house serves them 2 purposes:

a) It gives them a place to live besides under a bridge or in a car.

b) It allows them to build up a better credit rating so that they can buy a house in the future.

It also gives them someone that may be willing to sell to them when they are ready.

ACK!

	13-12-2004 03:50									#122
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious Incoherent babbling.

Did kiddy-widdy fail math class?

quote: You aren't as stupid to think that I'm talking about people who want to rent so don't act like it.

What if there IS someone who wants to rent?

There are people who want to drink alcohol. There are people who want to do many things that you may think they shouldn't. Why won't you let them?

	13-12-2004 03:50									#123
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nice discussion, I'll be back tomorrow. good night everyone.

	13-12-2004 03:50									#124
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Vel,

It's very simple. There are people out there who want to own there own home. You have a home that they could own, but you don't sell it. You rent it instead. Now don't act like you are just helping yourself at no cost to other people.

	13-12-2004 03:52									#125
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quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker Did kiddy-widdy fail math class?

No. You did. Let me spell it out for you. There is x amount of houses to own to live in. Vel buys one of those to rent. Now there is x-1. Get it dummy?

	13-12-2004 03:53									#126
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Even if he did sell it, they couldn't afford it.

	13-12-2004 03:54									#127
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quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker Even if he did sell it, they couldn't afford it.

Dummy! If he sold it someone affords it. Jeez. Get your head out of your ass.

	13-12-2004 03:54									#128
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'zazel - agreed...but if a peaceful revolution occurs (communist party elected president, for example) I seriously doubt it'll be in my lifetime. If I keep goading Kid tho, he might come start the revolution at my house tonight!

Kid: Wasn't it you who called me out for "making the debate personal" last time? Interesting now, since the shoe is on the other foot. And I must say that I'm rather enjoying it. Again, different strokes for different folks I guess.

Incoherent babbling? I showed you mathematically what the price drop would be. Can you not multiply? I'm not sure I can MAKE iti any simpler. But, in typical Kid form, when you don't get the answer you wanted...the one that supports your (bizzare, to say the least!) world view, you pout and ignore that part.

I expect it from you any more.

As to the people who are renting from me....again, hate to dissapoint you but they DO fall into that category, which is why I keep coming back to that point.

Why is that so hard to grasp?

And I just read Tube's latest post...yes, yes yes!

All of those things create VALUE, by the way. All of those things (in addition to the maintenance, upkeep, taxes, etc, etc, etc) are worthy of compensation.

Aren't they?

-=Vel=-

	13-12-2004 03:54									#129
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious Vel, It's very simple. There are people out there who want to own there own home. You have a home that they could own, but you don't sell it. You rent it instead. Now don't act like you are just helping yourself at no cost to other people.

Kid,

It's very simple. There is a surplus of housing in Vel's area. He bought the houses because they were not in use.

ACK!

	13-12-2004 03:55									#130
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quote: Originally posted by Tuberski Kid, It's very simple. There is a surplus of housing in Vel's area. He bought the houses because they were not in use. ACK!

There is not a surplus. If there were Vel would not be able to rent.

	13-12-2004 03:56									#131
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quote: Originally posted by Velociryx 'zazel - agreed...but if a peaceful revolution occurs (communist party elected president, for example) I seriously doubt it'll be in my lifetime. If I keep goading Kid tho, he might come start the revolution at my house tonight! Kid: Wasn't it you who called me out for "making the debate personal" last time? Interesting now, since the shoe is on the other foot. And I must say that I'm rather enjoying it. Again, different strokes for different folks I guess. Incoherent babbling? I showed you mathematically what the price drop would be. Can you not multiply? I'm not sure I can MAKE iti any simpler. But, in typical Kid form, when you don't get the answer you wanted...the one that supports your (bizzare, to say the least!) world view, you pout and ignore that part. I expect it from you any more. As to the people who are renting from me....again, hate to dissapoint you but they DO fall into that category, which is why I keep coming back to that point. Why is that so hard to grasp? And I just read Tube's latest post...yes, yes yes! All of those things create VALUE, by the way. All of those things (in addition to the maintenance, upkeep, taxes, etc, etc, etc) are worthy of compensation. Aren't they? -=Vel=-

Bullshit. **** you, you ****ing ****er liar *****. I hate you. I wish you were dead.

	13-12-2004 03:56									#132
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quote: Originally posted by Azazel nice discussion, I'll be back tomorrow. good night everyone.

Nity Night Az.

	13-12-2004 03:57									#133
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@ Jaguar

	13-12-2004 03:58									#134
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I enjoyed it too, 'zazel...see you tomorrow!

Kid, you stopped making sense about two pages ago...need a cooling off period?

There is a shortage of housing in California. There is a surplus of houses in Columbia, SC. LOTS of houses.

This drives the price down.

It makes renting fairly unattractive, save for those who CAN'T buy (bad credit) or don't want to buy (personal preference).

Get over yourself and this silly desire to dictate other people's lives. Try instead, to get a firm handle on your own, maybe? Make a success there before you go tellin' everyone else how to live? Maybe lead by example?

-=Vel=-

PS to Tubes: You are on a ROLL tonight!

	13-12-2004 03:59									#135
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quote: Originally posted by Velociryx Kid: Wasn't it you who called me out for "making the debate personal" last time? Interesting now, since the shoe is on the other foot. And I must say that I'm rather enjoying it. Again, different strokes for different folks I guess.

Renting to people, and acting like you are deserving of riches, and other people deserve poverty is personal to me. It always will be. You can't change that. And I can't make you a communist, because you are a capitalist. It's that simple.

	13-12-2004 04:00									#136
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Jag!

Kid...yes, there is. And I already explained that the housing rental market is soft because of that. So you gotta be willing to deal.

There's not much incentive to rent a place for 550-750 when you can buy one and pay a mortgage of 300-800 (60k to 110k price range).

But still, despite this, and despite the derth of houses on the market here, there ARE people who prefer to rent.

Mayhaps that will sink into that marvellously thick skull at some point...

-=Vel=-

	13-12-2004 04:00									#137
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious No. You did. Let me spell it out for you. There is x amount of houses to own to live in. Vel buys one of those to rent. Now there is x-1. Get it dummy?

Some more math for you:

There are x amounts of houses to sell, there are y amount of people looking to buy houses. There are z amount of people that want to rent a home

x>y

Therefore, if y=0 (everyone that wants to buy a house has one) x still doesn't equal zero.

Now, because Vel bought some of those houses, they become available to the people that want to, or have to, rent.

now they can because Vel has bought those homes, if he didn't those people wouldn't have a home.

ACK!

	13-12-2004 04:01									#138
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quote: Originally posted by Velociryx There is a shortage of housing in California. There is a surplus of houses in Columbia, SC. LOTS of houses.

Surplus too you obviously, because you would like to see higher rents. Actually there is no surplus. If there is you are an idiot for making those investments.

	13-12-2004 04:05									#139
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quote: Originally posted by Tuberski Some more math for you: There are x amounts of houses to sell, there are y amount of people looking to buy houses. There are z amount of people that want to rent a home x>y Therefore, if y=0 (everyone that wants to buy a house has one) x still doesn't equal zero. Now, because Vel bought some of those houses, they become available to the people that want to, or have to, rent. now they can because Vel has bought those homes, if he didn't those people wouldn't have a home. ACK!

This really doesn't make any sense.

	13-12-2004 04:05									#140
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious Surplus too you obviously, because you would like to see higher rents. Actually there is no surplus. If there is you are an idiot for making those investments.

Not really, housing appreciates in value, waiting even a year and he would get some return on his investments.

Don't you watch Dave Del Dotto?



ACK!

	13-12-2004 04:07									#141
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'k....

Renting to people, and acting like you are deserving of riches, and other people deserve poverty is personal to me.

I am helping people.

The military family does not WANT to buy a house here, cos they don't know how long they'll be here and don't want to get stuck holding a house that might be on the market for a year or longer when they move. I'll go slow this time..

THEY

WANT

TO

RENT

Get it?

It just so happens that I didn't spend my spare money on beer and smokes, and had enough left over to buy a couple of places that needed some TLC. So we fixed them up. Me and Christina.

Labor.

Sweat.

Good.

But we're not working for free.

No sir.

We want to keep the fruits of our labor cos that's a good thing.

So we charge for it.

Who do we charge?

The people who are using our stuff!

Rocket science, I know, but it gets better!

See...these houses that we bought had been sitting empty for a long time (soft housing market, lots for sale...a surplus). They had damage. Roof repair, new AC, new carpets, some rot that needed replacing. New paint.

More work. More sweat. You should be nodding your head in agreement at this point.

I spent THOUSANDS to acquire the property and make repairs.

I didn't do it to give my labor away.

I want something back for letting other folks use my stuff, and pay me for my labor in making it livable.

I also want payment for assuming the RISK of the mortgage, bearing the ultimate responsibility to the bank, keeping up with the paperwork, making continuous improvements and general repairs, etc.

To NOT compensate me for those things is to exploit ME, which you should be against, given your ideology.

Unless of course, you just want to see me exploited. Possible...

Tubes: You're gonna get accused of babbling incoherently, you know this, yes?

-=Vel=-

	13-12-2004 04:07									#142
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious This really doesn't make any sense.

The whole point is, there are more houses than buyers.

People with bad or no credit will find it hard to buy a house, renting is easier.

By renting they improve their credit and eventually will have good enough credit to buy a home.

ACK!

	13-12-2004 04:09									#143
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quote: Originally posted by Tuberski Of course he would, housing that is not being sold when there is a surplus of housing brings no money to anyone. There are some people that contribute to the scarcity problem in California, but you can't contribute to a scarcity problem where one doesn't exist. Which is the case with Vel. He already told you that buying a house there is cheaper than renting, because there are a lot of houses available. The only way to look at it is that either: 1) The people renting from Vel don't want to own a home. or, 2)The people renting the home don't have good enough credit to buy a house on there own. In which case, Vel's renting them a house serves them 2 purposes: a) It gives them a place to live besides under a bridge or in a car. b) It allows them to build up a better credit rating so that they can buy a house in the future. It also gives them someone that may be willing to sell to them when they are ready. ACK!

The fact that they have bad credit is only another reason why Vel can rent to them. It doesn't explain anything.

	13-12-2004 04:09									#144
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Tubes example makes no sense to you because you have your blinders on so tightly, and your view is so constricted, that all you can see are monsters.

It's like a knee-jerk reaction with you....capitalist = pigdog = bad!

BADBADBAD! ******ers, the lot of them.

We know this.

That's part of what makes it fun.

-=Vel=-

	13-12-2004 04:10									#145
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quote: Originally posted by Velociryx Tubes: You're gonna get accused of babbling incoherently, you know this, yes? -=Vel=-

As someone says here : My gives a **** is broken.



ACK!

	13-12-2004 04:11									#146
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quote: Originally posted by Tuberski The whole point is, there are more houses than buyers. People with bad or no credit will find it hard to buy a house, renting is easier. By renting they improve their credit and eventually will have good enough credit to buy a home. ACK!

No there is not too many houses.

	13-12-2004 04:11									#147
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious The fact that they have bad credit is only another reason why Vel can rent to them. It doesn't explain anything.

It explains why they can't buy one of the surplus houses.

ACK!

	13-12-2004 04:12									#148
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quote: Originally posted by Velociryx Tubes example makes no sense to you because you have your blinders on so tightly, and your view is so constricted, that all you can see are monsters. It's like a knee-jerk reaction with you....capitalist = pigdog = bad! BADBADBAD! ******ers, the lot of them. We know this. That's part of what makes it fun. -=Vel=-

No. I tried very hard. Unlike you. You don't try to understand people.

	13-12-2004 04:13									#149
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So how am I exploiting them?

Map it out for me...step by step?

Did I exploit anyone when I used the fruits of MY labor to buy a house that had been sitting empty for a year?

Did I exploit anyone when I spent my own money to fix the place up?

Did I exploit anyone when I rented charged a "usage fee" to compensate myself for the labor, time, and money spent, to say nothing of the risk?

Did I exploit anyone when I found two people who PREFER renting to home ownership and made a private arrangement with them that was agreeable to both parties?

At what point did this gross exploitation occur, precisely?

Show me.

-=Vel=-

PS to Tubes: Ohhh, actually you got "this really makes no sense" - must work harder to get to "incoherent"

	13-12-2004 04:13									#150
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quote: Originally posted by Tuberski It explains why they can't buy one of the surplus houses. ACK!

They can't buy a house becuase Vel bought it. If Vel didn't buy it then someone would have to sell it to them. There are no surplus houses.