11-01-2005 23:59									#1
	An epic MAFIA scenario Inflate your Upload Space

Hi guys!

I've been fondling with the idea of making an empire building style scenario about the rise of the Sicilian Mafia (La Cosa Nostra) in New York/America in 20th century. It will have everything from ordinary hoods, made men to capos and dons. Assassinations and various illegal activities. And maybe a mob war or two (go to the mattresses). The goal - To expand your criminal empire

You'll be able to control one of the five New York families (the Bonanno family, the Colombo family, the Gambino family, the Genovese family, the Lucchese family). Eventually the feds will also play its role as an annoyance factor. The barbarians could maybe be various Labor Unions to be infiltrated. Smiley's city terrains should be perfect for a New York Map.

I havn't yet figured out how all the organized crime factors can be adopted into the civ engine, but that's why I post my ideas here. I would need help to work out cunning and innovative ideas. Gold Gulch by Harry Tuttle will of course be a major inspiration.

So tell me what you think and if it's feasable at all. Some Fairline mobsters units would obviously be fantastic

Cheers, guys!

	12-01-2005 00:45									#2
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you can use my cars and trucks i posted in the speculative graphics thread

	12-01-2005 01:10									#3
	Inflate your Upload Space

Will this be for SP or MP?

If it is for SP, the Gold Gulch approach can only be used up to a point. The problem is that in GG SP the AI can either be prevented from building additional saloons or it does not do it.

You may be able to do it if you have 7 civs, the 5 families, New York (at war with all 5) and a federal agency such as the FBI. The families start out with one stronghold each. New York has many . . . City Hall, Wall Street, Docks, shopping Districts, Police Stations, Boroughs, Suburbs etc. FBI units are generated by events (assume that they have to come from Washington).

Freights would be drug, booze, illegal alien etc shipments. You might even be able to work in a version of the Ju-52's in your Norwegian Campaign.

This looks like it has some interesting possibilities.

Last edited by AGRICOLA on 12-01-2005 at 01:15

	12-01-2005 03:40									#4
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what year will it take place in?

	12-01-2005 03:59									#5
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Great idea

My suggestion would be to make the map a large city scenescape with streets, buildings, skyscrapers, etc.

Plus, there was a gangster scenario done some time ago (in French) that had some pretty cool units and cars. It may be worth checking it out....

	12-01-2005 04:55									#6
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Sounds fun. You should be aware there are a couple of others out there. Darth Veda did one, based in a fictional city, using SimCity-type graphics. Cam Hills also did one, based on a map of the US, the idea being the control of Chicago. And of course, you should have a look at St. Leo's Roman Riots, just 'cause it's set in a city and it's pretty. All are still available on one or another of the main scenario sites.

	12-01-2005 04:58									#7
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Oh, and Mercator's site has a couple of NYC maps: http://www.civgaming.net/mercator/

	12-01-2005 05:25									#8
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@AGRICOLA:
I intend for it to work out in both SP and MP. Those ideas of yours were about what I've figured out as well up to now. I guess it's tre what they say, great minds do think alike

What was that about the air transporter?

Keep the suggestions coming. I need all the help I can get, beeing the lazy arse that I've become .

@Leonidas:
Thanks! I'd love to know which scenario that is and where it could be found

@Broken_Erica:
I was thinking something like the 30s, when the Commission was first founded.

@techumseh:
Thanks for that. I've had Gang Wars since it first came out and will look to this for inspiration from time to time. The other I've never heard of...Thanks for filling me in Would anyone know specifically where these can be found?

Those NYC maps should do the biz. If not, I'll make one myself.

@Fairline if you're lurking!
If you like the idea I would love to get in a "marriage" with you for this one

...or anyone else that can contribute or that matter. The way I reckon it, I'd need some mafiosos and some 30s styled drive by cars or something (inf and cavalry). Same with the Feds, "inf" and "cav". Some civilians maybe. And some (barbarian controlled?) NYC cops? Which could be bribed by some special diplo units. I don't know, what would I need?


Maybe smiley would like to custom make some of those city terrains of his as well

I know I ask much, but everything that can ease up my work is extremely apreciated. I don't want this to be an idea that gets shoveled in the end.

In the mean time, arrivideci!

Last edited by Eivind IV on 12-01-2005 at 05:43

	12-01-2005 06:42									#9
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Kobra:

The scenario I spoke about is called coincidentally "Mafia"

It's located here (scroll down - it's mislabelled as "Marfia")

http://www.civfanatics.com/civ2scenoth.shtml

Some of the city buildings look dated, but some of the units might be useful.

	12-01-2005 07:04									#10
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Cool! If you need any help, just holler.

What was the name of that Roman Riot scenario made a few years back? The one where you fought in city streets? Could be useful.

	12-01-2005 09:55									#11
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Ju-52 = subway, taxi ??? A way of moving units very quickly. Useful for hit squads, drug runs? Can you cram more than one unit into it? Alternately, the subway and elevated system could be represented by RR's.

I think that police have to be NYC units rather than Barbs. Otherwise, who will defend the city?

	12-01-2005 12:48									#12
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quote: Originally posted by Kobra @Fairline if you're lurking! If you like the idea I would love to get in a "marriage" with you for this one

Best offer I've had since I was divorced

I'll have a go as this sounds interesting. But.... I've got a lot of stuff I owe other people and I haven't drawn anything for some time. Prepare for a long wait before our marriage is consummated Eivind. Ahem, metaphorically speaking of course

	12-01-2005 19:25									#13
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I'm sure this union will be blessed with many fine looking offspring!

	12-01-2005 19:39									#14
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Just to show I mean the business, here's 3 hours worth of work: A 30s NYC Taxi

@Leonidas:
Then it shouldn't be a problem for me to name this "Mafia" That french scen is quite neat, although I don't understand a word

@Harry:
That Roman riot scen is marvellous looking. It looks almost the same as Caesar 3, where the graphics are ripped from. Truly an inspiration.

@Agricola:
Nice to have you around! Good point!

@Fairline:
Ah, your words are truly promising though How long a wait do you reckon it'll be? You know in Vegas you can be married in a matter of minutes

Attachment: eivind-nyc_30s_taxi.gif
This has been downloaded 175 time(s).

Last edited by Eivind IV on 12-01-2005 at 20:02

	12-01-2005 23:44									#15
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More NYC stuff. NYPD car

Now doesn't these works of art inspire you, Gareth, to make me some mobsters and feds as your dowry?

Attachment: eivind-nyc_30s_police.gif
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	13-01-2005 01:00									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Kobra @Leonidas: Then it shouldn't be a problem for me to name this "Mafia" That french scen is quite neat, although I don't understand a word

Hmmm... interesting question.

That other scenario is called "Mafia".

Perhaps you could call yours "Mafia Story" or "The Godfather" or "Mafia: The Rise of Organized Crime"
or...

Well, you get the idea - heheh

Just a few suggestions...

Cheers!

	13-01-2005 01:42									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Kobra this "Mafia" That french scen is quite neat, although I don't understand a word

If you need a translation, just shout!

	13-01-2005 19:33									#18
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@Patine

I took a quick look at Mafia.

Mafia certainly is different and not too difficult to follow in English if one replaces the GAME, LABELS and PEDIA files with the vanilla CIV2 versions. However, EVENTS doesn't work because, among other things, the English version of CIV2 keeps looking for a city called Aucun, not comprehending that AUCUN = NONE. Also, the author apparently had some difficulty in distinguishing the east side from the west side of a map.

The concept is pretty straightforward. Streets = ocean so that ground units have to be carried by cars or trucks (ships) to move from block to block (island). Beyond that, it is a straightforward shoot 'em up. There are none of the interesting subplot activities, cattle rustling and prospecting, that add much to the flavor of Gold Gulch.

The one disconcerting problem that you will also face is that improvements that make sense in Mafia strongholds (speakeasy, drug trade, bootlegging, counterfeiting, prostitution etc) make no sense at all if they are built in a Police Station or other city stronghold.

It might be best to let everyone build such things as an armory and reinforced doors/walls but use the tech tree to limit what the good guys can build. I would not let the city have a corruption free form of government, too many politicians, officials and policemen have an interest in building their own pension funds.

See if you can figure out some money-making sub-plot schemes for both the Mafia and the good guys to add flavor (and income) to the scen.

	13-01-2005 20:15									#19
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I'm actually having a good time doing this. A fun unorthodox project after oh too many historical scens.

#1: How about this: You can rob civilians or hijack NYC supply trucks for money, rob banks (kill bankers inside banks), but when you kill them, more NYC police are deployed to the streets.

#2: Some of your units will be able to bribe units such as the police for a relatively big portion of money. You diplo units will also be able to kick other units' ass (sabotage). Or should the police/FBI civ have democracy so they can't be bribeable? Maybe only he NYC civs' police officers can be bribed?

#3: If you kill made men "without permission", you'll lose money and there will be a mob war. If you kill regular goons there will be war as well, because of the game engine, but you won't lose money. Hmm, maybe this wasn't such a good idea, to lose money everytime you kill wise guys.

More ideas to come...

I'll probably use the same concept as that French "Marfia"-dude, with streets as ocean, only I will have zebra crossings. I'm open to any kind of suggestion, such as these good ones of John here. Thanks! Don't be shy guys!

Here's more cars:
Luxery sports car (fast moving, but can only carry 1 or 2) and a generic "mafia" car (slow, but can carry 4)

Anyone got a pic of a 30s FBI car?
And when was alcohol legalized again in the US?

EDIT:
Made some changes to the units

Attachment: eivind-nyc_30s_lux-car_generic-car.gif
This has been downloaded 122 time(s).

Last edited by Eivind IV on 14-01-2005 at 20:43

	13-01-2005 21:53									#20
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Those cars are really nice.

"The Repeal Amendment was sent to the States in February of 1933. It wasn't ratified until December 5th, but Congress passed the 'Beer Bill' in April, declaring that 3.2 beer was not intoxicating, hence not illegal. So the date of the end of Alcohol Prohibition is generally considered to be April 4th, 1933."

http://www.dpft.org/history.html

	13-01-2005 22:09									#21
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3.2% eh? Is that why American beer is so weak?

Nice cars Eivind. I'll see what I can do about Mafia hoods and Dons and stuff.

	13-01-2005 22:09									#22
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Wasn´t there that one brewery that flew in some beer for FDR then stating 'Mr President, the first beer is for you' IIRC

	13-01-2005 22:20									#23
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Sorry to bang on about ToT Eivind, but there is the perfect device in ToT to ensure that your cars stick to the roads and don't end up driving into houses etc. Techumseh had an armoured train in his Russian Civil War scenario which was confined to railways as follows (IIRC!): Make all terrain other than that with railways/roads impassable and give all units other than trains/cars the 'ignore impassable terrain' flag.

	14-01-2005 02:06									#24
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And I'm sorry to bang on about that TOT is a bit out of my league

I know TOT is superior in many ways, but the best way here really, as I want cars to be able to carry units, is to make roads as ocean (Just as that "Marfia" scen), and the cars naval units. And that is perfectly feasable in MGE, which really is my domain, I'm afraid.

Still interested?

	14-01-2005 21:46									#25
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quote: Originally posted by techumseh Oh, and Mercator's site has a couple of NYC maps: http://www.civgaming.net/mercator/

Those maps are nice, but in a bit small scale for this scen. I'll probably make one myself

	15-01-2005 23:24									#26
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Presenting to you, an FBI armoured car

Attachment: eivind-fbi.gif
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	16-01-2005 04:36									#27
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So does the time go in half an hours or what?

	16-01-2005 04:37									#28
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Cause in a bank robbery it wouldnt take a day to go down a few blocks and you couldnt recruit assassins in one day

	16-01-2005 20:25									#29
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I havn't yet decided whether it will be played in the 30s-40s only or if should have it as a real epic rise and fall scenario going up to the 80s.

Anyone have any thouhts on that?

	16-01-2005 20:28									#30
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quote: Originally posted by Kobra And I'm sorry to bang on about that TOT is a bit out of my league I know TOT is superior in many ways, but the best way here really, as I want cars to be able to carry units, is to make roads as ocean (Just as that "Marfia" scen), and the cars naval units. And that is perfectly feasable in MGE, which really is my domain, I'm afraid. Still interested?

What happens when you want to cross the road?