31-03-2005 02:24									#1
	Xbox being pulled from the marketplace, production halted... Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

...to clear the market for Xbox 2.

link

quote: SPOnG has received emails that indicate a complete withdrawal of Xbox hardware in the coming months, with claims surfacing today of a total end to generation one Xbox production. According to senior sources within publishing, retailers are being instructed not to list Xbox hardware in their next catalogue publications. “They are telling us that they have reached their targets and want to clear the way for the next machine,” we were told, with our source speaking under terms of anonymity. “It’s reached the point where the amount of money they lose per unit, combined with the fact that they might well eat into their own [Xbox 360] market share, means that continuing the run is just not feasible.” Of course the big question remains of exactly how many Xbox hardware units are still available. “There are only two million units left and no more will be produced,” continued our source. “There are 400,000 allocated for the whole of the European territory. After that there will be no more. It was confirmed to me that Microsoft has no plans to manufacture the original Xbox once the new console hits the market.” However, Microsoft has indicated to key retailers that it plans to having around a million Xbox 360 hardware units available in time for Christmas of 2005, as reported by MCV last week and recently confirmed to SPOnG. Microsoft’s official line on the matter is that the Xbox supply situation will improve, offering a six week wait-and-see window to retailers. Some cynics may argue that six weeks brings the welcome distraction of a 360-powered E3 show in Los Angeles. The Windows giant also claimed that manufacture of the original Xbox unit continues, although this end-of-cycle production run is likely to comprise the two million figure offered by our source today. We will bring you updates on this story if anything changes.

This makes sense given the recent news of Xbox "shortages" at some retail chains.

E3 this year is going to kick ass.

	31-03-2005 02:24									#2
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God I hope they don't call it Xbox 360

	31-03-2005 02:26									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Verto God I hope they don't call it Xbox 360

I hope not as well, and I don't think they will. I hope not...

	31-03-2005 02:26									#4
	Inflate your Upload Space

three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh three-six-oh

	31-03-2005 02:27									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

And why is this not in Other Games?

+ 0

	31-03-2005 02:27									#6
	Remove this text

I don't consider it a game, I consider it a piece of technology.

	31-03-2005 02:31									#7
	Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by Asher I don't consider it a game, I consider it a piece of technology.

software isnt technology?

	31-03-2005 02:33									#8
	Support Apolyton

I wonder if xbox will continue to get support(MS or third party)?

	31-03-2005 02:33									#9
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

E3 will be interesting, but because of many real (read: PC) games presented.

	31-03-2005 02:36									#10
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

standardLeoReply {
Once again, a corporation is unethically throttling supply in order to drive up demand to a frenzy. This is only possible because of the anti-innovation agenda of patent, copyright, and trademark laws. In a true free market, a competitor would start manufacturing XBoxen to fill the demand that Microsoft doesn't want to satisfy.
}

	31-03-2005 02:40									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

E3 will be interesting, but because of many real (read: PC) games presented.

	31-03-2005 02:41									#12
	Support Apolyton

standardLeoReply {
Once again, a corporation is unethically throttling supply in order to drive up demand to a frenzy. This is only possible because of the anti-innovation agenda of patent, copyright, and trademark laws. In a true free market, a competitor would start manufacturing XBoxen to fill the demand that Microsoft doesn't want to satisfy.
}

	31-03-2005 02:46									#13
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Solver E3 will be interesting, but because of many real (read: PC) games presented.

That spiel is neither humorous nor accurate, making it perfect for poly OT.

	31-03-2005 02:47									#14
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by St Leo standardLeoReply { Once again, a corporation is unethically throttling supply in order to drive up demand to a frenzy. This is only possible because of the anti-innovation agenda of patent, copyright, and trademark laws. In a true free market, a competitor would start manufacturing XBoxen to fill the demand that Microsoft doesn't want to satisfy. }

I very much doubt a competitor would sell Xboxes at a loss like MS does.

	31-03-2005 02:56									#15
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

What are the XBox 2s going to be selling for out of the gate? Also, 1 million units for the holidays seems rather paltry.

	31-03-2005 02:57									#16
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quote: Originally posted by DanS What are the XBox 2s going to be selling for out of the gate? Also, 1 million units for the holidays seems rather paltry.

The 1 million units is apparently for Europe alone, according to other articles.

Don't know the pricing. Some say PS3 and Xbox2 may be $399.

Sony tossed around the idea of $499...

It probably would be $499 without MS competing...

	31-03-2005 03:00									#17
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

$399 and $499 are way too much, IMO. They should have done a $299 or $250 price to steal a march on Sony.

The key is to get as many of the machines out there as soon as possible, not to dicker over price with early adopters.

	31-03-2005 03:04									#18
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by DanS $399 and $499 are way too much, IMO. They should have done a $299 or $250 price to steal a march on Sony.

People said $299 was way too much as well.

What exactly do you know about the console market?

Nintendo tried your brilliant strategy, it failed miserably. Gamers equate cheaper to...cheaper. Sub-par. It is in MS' best interest to pricematch Sony to position themselves as a direct competitor, and an alternative.

	31-03-2005 03:07									#19
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Well, if you don't use that strategy, you have a huge hole in your product lineup at around $150.

	31-03-2005 03:08									#20
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by DanS Well, if you don't use that strategy, you have a huge hole in your product lineup at around $150.

That's where the "crippled" Xbox2 will come in, without the harddrive, backwards compatibility, etc.

	31-03-2005 03:09									#21
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

as always, I ask: can it play games? Oh wait, it can.

But can it play games as good as PC games?

	31-03-2005 03:11									#22
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

When it comes out, I anticipate it will own PC games for at least two years.

	31-03-2005 03:12									#23
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

This is as strong an indicator as any that MS plans at leaast one version of Xbox2 to be backwards-compatible with Xbox. The first was the purchase of VirtualPC software, that emulates x86 on PowerPC...

And now the stop-ship order for new Xboxes, while they still keep planning to release Xbox games and will still likely keep selling them for years to come.

	31-03-2005 03:12									#24
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by Asher That's where the "crippled" Xbox2 will come in, without the harddrive, backwards compatibility, etc.

I've never been a fan of that approach. Differentiation within a product line has always seemed to fail in this business.

	31-03-2005 03:14									#25
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Consoles will never be as good as PCs. Not for most games. Not until consoles can have real mod capabilities. When games are released that have huge modding potential, why lose all that by being stuck on a console? Many top-of-the-line shooters, like Doom3 or HL2, are extremely moddable, and that's lost on consoles. This year's biggest upcoming RPG, TES IV, will be extremely moddable, and that will be lost, too. What's the purpose of running those games on a console then?

	31-03-2005 03:15									#26
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by Solver Consoles will never be as good as PCs. Not for most games. Not until consoles can have real mod capabilities. When games are released that have huge modding potential, why lose all that by being stuck on a console? Many top-of-the-line shooters, like Doom3 or HL2, are extremely moddable, and that's lost on consoles. This year's biggest upcoming RPG, TES IV, will be extremely moddable, and that will be lost, too. What's the purpose of running those games on a console then?

Most games don't give a sh*t about user-created mods, and I'm one of them.

The good ones will break off into games on their own.

I've never, ever, downloaded a DOOM3 mod or HL2 mod.

PC gaming is on the rapid decline, console gaming is always on the up.

It's time to realize most people just don't game like you do.

Consoles are "better" at gaming than PCs because:
1) You can "write to the metal", far more efficient code
2) Standardized platform
3) Static hardware for 4-5 years means saved money...

	31-03-2005 03:25									#27
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Asher Most games don't give a sh*t about user-created mods, and I'm one of them. The good ones will break off into games on their own. I've never, ever, downloaded a DOOM3 mod or HL2 mod. PC gaming is on the rapid decline, console gaming is always on the up. It's time to realize most people just don't game like you do. Consoles are "better" at gaming than PCs because: 1) You can "write to the metal", far more efficient code 2) Standardized platform 3) Static hardware for 4-5 years means saved money...

Need I mention Counterstrike? It's a user-created mod, and is one of the most popular games ever. I know that many XBOX players of Morrowind regret that, because there are mods that give much more replayability/playtime to the game. Essentialy, you buy the game, and get all the quests/cities/feautures for free that come later from mods. I've not downloaded any HL2 mods yet either, but I've played a custom D3 map shortly after release of D3, and it gave me an hour of enjoyment. That I wouldn't get on the XBOX.

That saved money argument is a fun one... the XBOX itself costs. If I buy a new computer, I am pretty assured that all games releases in the next 2 years will run very well. Alright, I assume XBOX is better for people who want many games, and often the newest ones, right?

	31-03-2005 03:26									#28
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quote: Consoles are "better" at gaming than PCs because: 1) You can "write to the metal", far more efficient code 2) Standardized platform 3) Static hardware for 4-5 years means saved money...

Consoles may be better for "gaming" for those reasons, but they aren't better for games for those exact reasons.

On a console games are only allowed to evolve as much as the origional programmers allow and as much as the original hardware allow. 5 year old hardware and source code being overhauled by the same old programmers to make Splinter Cell 8, which really just a mod, but we won't call it that.

The gaming fans, the mods, etc. permit for the creativity that allows for the evolution of games. Their mods and additions, while free, and sometime bug ridden are awesome in that they give developer ideas for the next version of the game, not just the next remake.

These same fans and mod makers also do so with evolving technology platforms, pushing the envolope of the hardware to software (and back) exchange. Do games lead the evolution of memory allocation, hardware design, etc...? Probably not, but it's fun to consider that we tend to put a lot of thought into AI, maybe more so than certain Toyota Robot builders.

If you are happy with static run of the mill games that never change only gain new graphics, fresh faces, and "2005" added to the same title from last year than by all means stick with your console. I prefer games that "evolve" and mature with the fans and players of that game. I for one have never downloaded a mod, and while I find Sn00py's graphics much better for civ3, I still haven't downloaded it. However I have much respect for those who go to lengths to change the look of a game, create more units and maps, and scenerios... It is these people who push the programmers of the games, and give testers more things to consider than just a bug free game (which has never been made, IMO).

Anyway, that's my 2-cents.

	31-03-2005 03:26									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Solver Need I mention Counterstrike?

This game?



I rest my case.

	31-03-2005 03:30									#30
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Out of curiosity, how long did it take for CS to come out for the XBOX? Outstanding mod, being sold separately in so many ways. But my point stands that CS is excellent proof that gamers do care about mods.