23-05-2002 05:22									#91
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Show me one comment from me that is homophobic in this thread.

You with your "all gays would prefer to be straight" line are much more homophobic, you are just dressing it up in pretty words.

	23-05-2002 05:26									#92
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I did thankyou MrFun. That is all I meant, it must be a difficult thing to come to terms with. I suppose once the dust has settled, it is the worst of it out of the way, you can just get on with being yourself and living. But Stew likes to twist my words.

	23-05-2002 05:29									#93
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Provost, you might have stated it the wrong way, but I did not think your intention was to promote homophobic beliefs.

As for Boddington -- there are two types of homophobics -- the violent type, and the non-violent type.
Maybe Boddington is the non-violent type of homophobic.

	23-05-2002 05:32									#94
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"But Stew likes to twist my words."

They didn't need any twisting.

	23-05-2002 05:35									#95
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Oh come on, there was no grounds to misinterpret what I was trying to say. I said that coming out must be very difficult, and if given the choice, would want to be just like everyone else, to begin with. Note I am not referring to the 'fully outed' homosexual who has learned to know himself and who he is. And in a very specific context too, referring to Stew's accusations that 'it's cool to be bi' when really, he has no idea how hard coming out must be...just think about having to make a declaration like that to your friends and family, not knowing what kind of reaction to expect...anywhere from supportive to outright hostile. And someone would do this in the name of 'fashion'? Bull.

	23-05-2002 08:33									#96
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I was going to say something (actually had it posted).

But no matter what you say on the subject of sexuality, you are bound to offend someone, or something.

So off with the lot of ya'!

Last edited by Anun Ik Oba on 23-05-2002 at 08:51

	23-05-2002 10:00									#97
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun Provost, you might have stated it the wrong way, but I did not think your intention was to promote homophobic beliefs. As for Boddington -- there are two types of homophobics -- the violent type, and the non-violent type. Maybe Boddington is the non-violent type of homophobic.

What is with the term homophobe? I think that it is inaccurate. Do all people who disagree with homosexuals fear them? Do the opposites (homophiles would be the opposites of homophobes) all love homosexuals? It seems to me that the term itself is biased.

	23-05-2002 10:41									#98
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quote: Originally posted by nationalist What is with the term homophobe? I think that it is inaccurate. Do all people who disagree with homosexuals fear them? Do the opposites (homophiles would be the opposites of homophobes) all love homosexuals? It seems to me that the term itself is biased.

Actually, maybe the term heterosexist is better than homophobic.
Or, you can use one or the other -- which ever is more appropriate for a particular situation or discussion.

	23-05-2002 20:53									#99
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Whenever a heterosexual declares that "Homosexuality is a choice!" I'm assuming that they are using their own preference as a reference. In other words, they can switch back and forth between sleeping with one gender and the other (something that I couldn't do). In other words, they must be a bisexual who chooses to only sleep with the opposite gender, and are transferring that bisexuality on the general population.

	23-05-2002 21:01									#100
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quote: Originally posted by Provost Harrison Family Values? You've got to be joking, right? You sound like John Major's puppet.

Yes, I bet Bodds would love John Majors hand up his ass

Edit: Typo

	23-05-2002 22:19									#102
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I prefer the term heterosexist. Homophobia implies a fear of homosexuality, while heterosexism is more accurate a term. Anti-gayism is about people being in their "proper" gender roles. Heterosexism isn't just about keeping gay people in their place, it's also about keeping straight people in their places.

Heterosexism is just as much about keeping the woman barefoot and pregnant as it is about ensuring that men are manly and in charge. Remember, one of the biggest insults to straight men is to call them a punk (in Black slang a punk is someone who takes it up the ass) or faggot. It implies you aren't acting like a real man. It's about conformity.

	23-05-2002 22:59									#103
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yes, from the perspective of seeing the 'penetrator' as dominant in some way, I'd say you're probably correct,che . But thinking of the 'penetrator' in terms of dominance is thinking that is rather gone, mostly , at the middle of the previous century in countries with european cultures.

or at least I think so.

	23-05-2002 23:01									#104
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I think that penetration dominance thing has lost its main importance when the Roman empire fell....

...where it was pretty significant, especially amongst men

	23-05-2002 23:06									#105
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Dalgetti, perhaps you aren't away of the religous right. There was, not to long ago, a very large flash-in-the-pan movement called the Promise Keepers. One of their primary goals was for men to retake their "rightful" place at the head of the family. Heterosexism.

	23-05-2002 23:08									#106
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Patriarchism

	23-05-2002 23:10									#107
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara I prefer the term heterosexist. Homophobia implies a fear of homosexuality, while heterosexism is more accurate a term. Anti-gayism is about people being in their "proper" gender roles. Heterosexism isn't just about keeping gay people in their place, it's also about keeping straight people in their places. Heterosexism is just as much about keeping the woman barefoot and pregnant as it is about ensuring that men are manly and in charge. Remember, one of the biggest insults to straight men is to call them a punk (in Black slang a punk is someone who takes it up the ass) or faggot. It implies you aren't acting like a real man. It's about conformity.

well said, Chegitz

	23-05-2002 23:47									#108
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Elequently put Che
Down with heterosexists

	24-05-2002 00:33									#109
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Well spoken, Che!

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Remember, one of the biggest insults to straight men is to call them a punk (in Black slang a punk is someone who takes it up the ass) or faggot. It implies you aren't acting like a real man. It's about conformity.

Oh, so that was what Lonestar meant... It just proves that the insultee must understand the insult

	24-05-2002 03:58									#110
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My goodness I went through several threads and it reminds me of watching a session of the Argentinian Congress on the news.... ugh.... they could on for six hours talking about a little issue. You people remind me of them... always arguing. Never actually doing anything productive.

Gays and bisexuals are humans too. And so are people who are black. And people who are jewish. And muslims. Their all humans and I think they deserve to be treated like humans. But there is absolutely nothing wrong with their being people who have pride in heterosexuality, not so when it gets extreme.

Well, this is my rare post, see you in about say a month.

	24-05-2002 04:07									#111
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Is it just me, or has Gian mellowed? Good points there.

	24-05-2002 04:07									#112
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bye

	24-05-2002 04:10									#113
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Yeah, but the only thing is, heterosexuals don't need 'heterosexual pride'. Heterosexual is defined as the 'norm' in society, is the majority of the population and thus society is based around it. There is no need for it.

	24-05-2002 04:41									#114
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Exactly, Provost -- but the original topic was bisexuality.

Who believes in the theory that we are all fundamentally bisexual? What are good sources to read about this theory?

	24-05-2002 05:07									#115
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Sources? You mean you want to read books that tell you what you already believe...?

	24-05-2002 10:00									#116
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quote: Originally posted by Provost Harrison Yeah, but the only thing is, heterosexuals don't need 'heterosexual pride'. Heterosexual is defined as the 'norm' in society, is the majority of the population and thus society is based around it. There is no need for it.

I think that that is a cop out. According to most of the posts, hetero sexuals are no longer defined as normal; homo-and bi sexuality is just as acceptable. Therefore, heteros should be allowed to show heterosexual pride. Saying that they shouldn't is discrimination. It implies that you should be proud to be gay but not proud (or ashamed) to be straight. I don't think that that is right.

	24-05-2002 10:17									#117
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quote: Originally posted by Boddington's Sources? You mean you want to read books that tell you what you already believe...?

troll rating: 0.05 out of 10


Oh and BTW Nationalist, homosexuality and bisexuality are increasing in social acceptance, but we still have a long ways to go in terms of equal housing, employment, safety in our high schools and colleges, and other issues on top of these.

	24-05-2002 15:16									#118
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nationalist, I feel no need whatsoever to be demonstrative about my sexuality (in this context). I don't feel threatened, like I need to make a point, like I need to make my presence known. Hence there is no need for 'straight pride'.

	25-05-2002 03:13									#119
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Hmm, I thought I was great at going off on a tangent with my essay writing...

First up, Infat seems on top form. As usual his brilliant insight into absolutely everything has shown me the way. I must go and tell all my bi friends to stop being so trendy.

Second, bisexuality seems to be a rather more unadressed issue and I know gay people who dislike bisexuals. I don't get it.

	25-05-2002 03:40									#120
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quote: Originally posted by red_jon Second, bisexuality seems to be a rather more unadressed issue and I know gay people who dislike bisexuals. I don't get it.

It's called being immature and juvenile, and hypocritical. They have the same challenges and problems, yet resort to the same tactics they have been the victim of. Sickening in fact.