12-01-2003 20:56									#151
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

che
i really wonder on what information you base your opinions.
nigeria (10th largest) and philipines (13th) happen to be very large nations. iraq is just 44th.
and anyway, noone is claiming to give the philipines and paraguay an own civilisation in the game.

and how do you define "important role". are you talking about who's in the news today? well... then why don't we add simbabwe, east timor, venezuela, tadjikistan, kirgistan, chechnia (how do you write that in english?), ivory coast.

it's good if you try to look for different criteria for the scenario, but you must always think first, if it
a) makes sence
b) is not biased by sympathy or nationalism
c) is possible to include in the game
d) is based on facts
etc.

but anyway: welcome to the forum

	12-01-2003 22:08									#152
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What I wanted to say is that not the size of the country is the deciding parameter, the real independes of the civilization in the real world.
take Israel for example, Those people surrvived more than 2000 years outside their own country, while all greatest civilizations felt apart on their own territory(Rome,Persia,Babylon and even USSR).
And now after more than 5 wars in 53 years,
while fighting againts a supirior enemy.
And you are comparing it to east timur or any other third world country?!
What about Nigeria? It's another african country, nothing special(Economicy,Military,Science).
and take Iraq for example, The whole world is living in fear because of them, why? because they can make a diffrence! and maybe, just maybe if all the S.American will be together, they might just be equal to the iraqis.
It's just an example of course.
Except great nations has great leaders, can you say that about east timur or venezuela?
I can't understand why are you making it so hard,
It's pretty obvious that the civilizations that I mentioned are the top nations.
Just Look at their leaders and you will understand everything, I hope

	13-01-2003 21:25									#153
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quote: Originally posted by Che Guevara It's pretty obvious that not all the countries can have their own goverments. for example, i'm sorry if anybody offended, but there is no sence in making Nigiria,philipins or paraguay independet civilizations so you can group them into one alliance that will be much stronger. and about the selection, you should pick countries that have an important role in the world of these days, so, countries like Israel and Iraq, should be under their own goverments. while countries like greece that have no effection on world's history shouldn't. so countries, even like S.Arabia in second thought should be under thier own goverment, Even they have a very weak Military, they are affecting the worlds financial situation. And one final thing, about the list that I wrote, I just wrote the countries that I could remember at the moment, and i didn't tried to rank them.

Hey, wait a minute. Nigeria is a major oil exporter and arguably the most stable government on the West African coast. It deserves far more to be included in the game than some others on your list.

Besides, even "big powerful" countries like Australia and Canada don't necessarily have too much control over their own destinies... they should be linked to the trade groups to which they belong, who have courts higher than their respective member's national courts. (This is true of NAFTA, believe it or not - a NAFTA court can strike down a Canadian, American or Mexican legal ruling! )

As for Korea, it would be well represented in the American "sphere"... just make the people there several unhappy, as in real life! In my opinion, this should be the case throughout much of the world.

Israel, I do agree, should be independent, but don't malign Nigeria if you support Israel. That's ignorance.

	13-01-2003 21:33									#154
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quote: Originally posted by Che Guevara Except great nations has great leaders, can you say that about east timur or venezuela? I can't understand why are you making it so hard, It's pretty obvious that the civilizations that I mentioned are the top nations. Just Look at their leaders and you will understand everything, I hope

You can DEFINITELY say that about Venezuela. They have a more politically apt leader than most countries in the world! He's survived a coup attempt and an incredibly long strike... he's a good speaker, fanatical, very powerful and is changing the whole country... his name is Hugo Chavez and whether you like him or think he's the devil incarnate, it's hard to argue that he's NOT having a large influence on the world.

As for Israel being independent for 2000 years, WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?!?!?

And all of South American joining together might be EQUAL to the Iraqis?!?

IGNORANT CIV PLAYERS MAKE ME SO ANGRY!!!

	14-01-2003 02:15									#155
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by sabrewolf jaguar warrior: will you consider extending the tech tree? because it's a "modern world" scenario, most civs will have most technologies (except e.g. smart weapons and integrated defense). you could have very expensive techs (move the tech rate down a lot) which enable improved cruise missiles (more firepower), stronger modern armours, better bombers, etc.

I will use the dyp modern tech tree for the ptw version. Not for vanilla civ3 because it will **** everyones' regular games up.

I can move the modern age to be 3rd and add a future age. But there aren't enough future navy and air units to go into the future yet.

	14-01-2003 02:30									#156
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quote: Originally posted by Jaguar Warrior I can move the modern age to be 3rd and add a future age. But there aren't enough future navy and air units to go into the future yet.

"Future Army, March Into the Future!"

Maybe a deLorean?

	14-01-2003 02:38									#157
	Increase Your PM Length

JW, you always surprise me with pretty avatars .. but the last one was cuter

dyp modern tech tree? hmm... i'll check it out, but don't remember seeing it. here? or at CFC?

	14-01-2003 03:05									#158
	Put an end to popups!

BTW, balance of power can always be fixed. Japan, for example, is just given a lot of a resource that adds huge amounts of trade. Hence they can earn a lot of gold despite their size.

The real reason Europe will be lumped together for Civ3 version is because if I split them, then I'll have to find a set of civs to group. And a lot of them don't like each other. It is difficult to group civs like Iran, which does not border any friends. (Pakistan in the East, Iraq in the west. Both Cold War enemies)

	14-01-2003 03:09									#159
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by sabrewolf JW, you always surprise me with pretty avatars .. but the last one was cuter dyp modern tech tree? hmm... i'll check it out, but don't remember seeing it. here? or at CFC?

Here's a low-res screenshot. I wish poly would allow bigger images.

Btw which do you mean was the last one? Beyonce (the black one) or Jessica (the one had for the last six months before this)

	14-01-2003 03:10									#160
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Bah

	14-01-2003 03:11									#161
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ok got it this time

Attachment: modern2.jpg
This has been downloaded 88 time(s).

	14-01-2003 03:17									#162
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Jaguar Warrior Here's a low-res screenshot. I wish poly would allow bigger images.

kal-el gets to have bigger pictures. i guess you can ask for it after this mod

quote: Btw which do you mean was the last one? Beyonce (the black one) or Jessica (the one had for the last six months before this)

hmm... dark longish hair, caucasian, slim... probably jessica in that case

	14-01-2003 03:18									#163
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quote: Originally posted by Jaguar Warrior The real reason Europe will be lumped together for Civ3 version is because if I split them, then I'll have to find a set of civs to group. And a lot of them don't like each other. It is difficult to group civs like Iran, which does not border any friends. (Pakistan in the East, Iraq in the west. Both Cold War enemies)

At last someone who understands this very significant divide!

It is totally ridiculous to create a huge "muslim bloc" as many people urge to do. One simply doesn't exist.

Saudi Arabi and the states bordering it huge perhaps be lumped together. Otherwise, forget it!

	14-01-2003 03:19									#164
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

And Pakistan could rightly be lumped with the Saudi bloc... both are throughly in the American camp, and both export "radical Islam" (i.e., militant Wahabbism)

	14-01-2003 03:19									#165
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Ok here's the latter half of it. (All civs will have the techs leading up to these, so these are the techs that might still need to be researched. Obviously some civs are much further than others.)

	14-01-2003 03:21									#166
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wow, neat tech screen. i wonder how long it took to place all of them and draw the arrows

the icons could use some adapting. a symbol of an atom doesn't fit to "advanced flight" and that monotheistic icon isn't very representative for synthetic fibers

btw: i reckon this is a merge of late industrial and all of the modern age together with a few other things (fiber optics, etc.)

	14-01-2003 03:21									#167
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Rrg! something about posting images today (and yes I know how to, poly just is being mean)

Attachment: modern2.jpg
This has been downloaded 87 time(s).

	14-01-2003 03:24									#168
	Tired of ads?

oh... only because most countries don't have a space flight program, doesn't mean they don't have space flight technology.
it's just way too expensive and there is no short term benefit

	14-01-2003 03:27									#169
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how did you post that size? nothing about it in the apolyton/community forum

	14-01-2003 03:28									#170
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Well you could say that some people from Bhutan do know what eCommerce is and how it works, but you can't really say that Bhutan "knows" the tech. IMO, having a tech means that you have the resources to make it somewhat available in your country, not just that you know what it is cause you have seen it somewhere else.

Most, but I'm not gonna say all countries will have space flight.

	14-01-2003 03:29									#171
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E-commerce!

That's phat!!!



How about "Adjustable Currencies"?

	14-01-2003 03:30									#172
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by sabrewolf how did you post that size? nothing about it in the apolyton/community forum

What do you mean?

	14-01-2003 03:39									#173
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quote: Originally posted by Jaguar Warrior Well you could say that some people from Bhutan do know what eCommerce is and how it works, but you can't really say that Bhutan "knows" the tech. IMO, having a tech means that you have the resources to make it somewhat available in your country, not just that you know what it is cause you have seen it somewhere else. Most, but I'm not gonna say all countries will have space flight.

well, if you make a bhutan civ i'll agree with you that eCommerce shouldn't be known yet *lol*

quote: What do you mean?

uhm, you were saying "something about posting images today" a few posts ago. then you posted this large screenshot... i wanted to know how you did that

btw: sagacious dolphin's avatar (e.g. http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...321#post1601321) isn't bad either

	14-01-2003 03:43									#174
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oh, and one more thing:

i suggest you put up the costs for the newer units like MA, MI and bombers. it's way too cheap and easy to build it presently (in a powerhouse with extra resources you can do it in 1-2 turns).
same for techs. tech rate should be slow, otherwise bhutan will have eCommerce after 4 turns
and upkeep for army should be more than 1 per unit. makes you think first, before you create a superarmy without enough trade

	15-01-2003 07:19									#175
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Hello, I thought I would chip in with some information on the relative power of various countries. The countries are ranked in order of their power in that particular area from strongest to weakest.




Number of Nuclear Warheads:-

1. Russia: 21,000
2. USA: 12,000
3. China: 500+
4. France: 500
5. UK: 200
6. Israel: 100-200
7. India: 25-100
8. Pakistan: 25-100
9. North Korea: ?2



GDP (Purchasing Power Parity) (in billions of $ [US]):-

1. USA: 10,000
2. China: 5,720
3. Japan: 3,450
4. India: 2,500
5. Germany: 2,170
6. France: 1,510
7. UK: 1,470
8. Italy: 1,400
9. Brazil: 1,340
10. Russia: 1,200



Population (millions of people):

1. China: 1,300
2. India: 1,070
3. USA: 291
4. Indonesia: 232
5. Brazil: 176
6. Pakistan: 148
7. Russia: 143 (Russian population is shrinking by about 1 million people per year. This could be represented by modifying the terrain around their cities, so that they starve.)
8. Bangladesh: 133
9. Nigeria: 130
10. Japan: 127



Land Area (km squared):
1. Russia: 17,000
2. Canada: 10,000
3. China: 9,600
4. USA: 9,600
5. Brazil: 8,500
6. Australia: 7,600
7. India: 3,000
8. Argentine: 2,800
9. Kazachstan: 2,700
10. Sudan: 2,500



I may write out more later if these are of any help.

	15-01-2003 10:05									#176
	Remove this text

Roman, that is very helpful. Post more, please.

	15-01-2003 19:34									#177
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Yes, it's always nice to have concrete numbers instead of ranting! But what about Ukraine, Byelorussia, Khazahkstan, Uzbekistan? I know they're not declared nuclear powers, but they do possess arsenals, or at least a good deal of nuclear materiel...

	15-01-2003 22:06									#178
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why on earth does any nation need more than 50 nukes?

	15-01-2003 22:21									#179
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quote: Originally posted by sabrewolf why on earth does any nation need more than 50 nukes?

How else are you going to defeat your foe 50 times?

	15-01-2003 22:27									#180
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quote: Originally posted by Yahweh Sabaoth How else are you going to defeat your foe 50 times?

exactly... and you don't want him to come out of the bunker after only 2 years. 100 years at least

i no the USSR and USA out-built each other to demonstrate power and absolut insanity. but i can't understand why newer nuclear powers (israel, india, pakistan) do the same?