16-04-2003 21:16									#31
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The only people who are still buying French products are the vocal Hollywood anti-war types. As they drink their French wine and munch on their French cheeses, they bitterly complain of "censorship" as Americans stop watching their movies and TV shows, and stop buying their records.

	16-04-2003 21:18									#32
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quote: Originally posted by DanS There's a ton of good wine from other parts of the world, including the US. And very often it costs a lot less too.

For inexpensive wine, French stuff is pretty awful. Their "Vine de Pay" and stuff of that grade is pretty gross. US wine isn't all that good, at least I haven't found any at that price range. Aussie wine is rather good.

At the top though, you can't beat Fench wine.

	16-04-2003 21:20									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Spec Riiiiiiiiiiight! And why did they start doing that you think? Just the spur of the moment they said:" Hey! Let's boycott french products for no reason!" It's because of the war and because the americans cant take no for an answer so they HAVE to get revenge whatever way works. Like I said, spoiled little bratts. Spec.

You do understand the difference between the actions of a nation and those of its citizens acting as individuals? No one said there was no reason for individual americans choosing not to buy french goods. If the USA bombed France or set new tariffs on French goods then you might have an argument, but AFAIK neither has happened. Maybe the French government will understand that there are consequences for its actions.

	16-04-2003 21:20									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Ned The only people who are still buying French products are the vocal Hollywood anti-war types. As they drink their French wine and munch on their French cheeses, they bitterly complain of "censorship" as Americans stop watching their movies and TV shows, and stop buying their records.

What, and watch French movies instead?

	16-04-2003 21:23									#35
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quote: Originally posted by Spec Riiiiiiiiiiight! And why did they start doing that you think? Just the spur of the moment they said:" Hey! Let's boycott french products for no reason!" It's because of the war and because the americans cant take no for an answer so they HAVE to get revenge whatever way works. Like I said, spoiled little bratts. Spec.

No, just people FREE to make their own decisions. American consumers vote with their wallets all the time. Probably for more fickle reasons than this but whatever the reason, that's the right of the consumer. I agree that some of the 'NAME changing stuff" has been on the juvenille side, but there are probably more americans makeing fun of that then those that supported the name changing. But individual consumer choice is a different matter.

	16-04-2003 21:30									#36
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quote: Originally posted by Ned The only people who are still buying French products are the vocal Hollywood anti-war types. As they drink their French wine and munch on their French cheeses, they bitterly complain of "censorship" as Americans stop watching their movies and TV shows, and stop buying their records.

Yeah, they simply drink and eat what they want, how dare they!

	16-04-2003 21:31									#37
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Well boycott IS decided on a personal level. If it's on a state level it is on another level. level.

	16-04-2003 21:40									#38
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quote: Originally posted by DanS BeBro: I think Americans take politics personally when our troops are in harm's way and we're fighting a tyrrany.

But boycotting French stuff doesnīt help your troops. I can understand that the US isnīt happy about other countries taking different political positions, but thatīs life. Should we ruin our economies eachother because of such matters?

And there is a special thing that makes me unlucky about this: when there are people in Germany who demand such boycotts, I always have to think at the times in the 30ies, where Germans thought it is a great thing for the country to boycott Jewish products...

Donīt get me wrong, I donīt equate anything that happens now , in the US or here, with those times (after all the circumstances are totally different), however, I still fear that such boycotts could end in growing hysteria and irrational hate.

	16-04-2003 21:45									#39
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In the low to mid level price range French wines are overrated anyway. Go fo the New World wines (me personally am a big fan of south africa when it comes to wine), for a nicer and cheaper wine.

	16-04-2003 21:47									#40
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I've been going out of my way to buy French products when I can. I'm sorry, but anyone who boycotts France is stupid. Sure, we'll boycott an allie, a fellow Democracy, a country who helped us win our independence, a country who we spilled blood to liberate, and a global trading partner... but HELL NO WE WON'T BOYCOTT SAUDI OIL. A country that is just as oppressive as Iraq, funds terrorism, and would nuke the US if it had the chance.

	16-04-2003 21:55									#41
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quote: quote: quote: Originally posted by Spec Riiiiiiiiiiight! And why did they start doing that you think? Just the spur of the moment they said:" Hey! Let's boycott french products for no reason!" It's because of the war and because the americans cant take no for an answer so they HAVE to get revenge whatever way works. Like I said, spoiled little bratts. Spec. No, just people FREE to make their own decisions. American consumers vote with their wallets all the time. Probably for more fickle reasons than this but whatever the reason, that's the right of the consumer. I agree that some of the 'NAME changing stuff" has been on the juvenille side, but there are probably more americans makeing fun of that then those that supported the name changing. But individual consumer choice is a different matter.

And the difference is? May it be on a personnal level or on a state level, americans are still acting like spoiled bratts! My argument stays the same. They dont accept no for an answer so they get revenge in whatever way they can. You people act the sameway with eachother. For example, americans are ready to sue anyone they can for any mistake they make because they CANT be wrong, they are always better than the next person.
In general of course, not everyone is the same but the majority of americans are like that.

Spec.

	16-04-2003 22:06									#42
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France today annouced it was 300,000 people short of it's usual tourist compliment, and it's not just US tourists, but European as well.

Spain is the prefered alternative.

Sounds like France's attempt to act like a spolied brat in the UN backfired, to use that lovly catch-all I saw earlier in the thread.

	16-04-2003 22:12									#43
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Chris, do you have a link? I'm not attacking you, its just an interesting story if its true. I'd like to read more.

	16-04-2003 22:19									#44
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I'll see if I can find one, they said it on CNN this morning.

	16-04-2003 22:24									#45
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I wonder if US tourism has taken a big hit, I remember people were biting their fingernails over what the repercussions of a war would be but mostly because of terrorism concerns. Think any people have since decided not to travel here because of anti-war feelings?

	16-04-2003 22:26									#46
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quote: Originally posted by Sava I've been going out of my way to buy French products when I can. I'm sorry, but anyone who boycotts France is stupid. Sure, we'll boycott an allie, a fellow Democracy, a country who helped us win our independence, a country who we spilled blood to liberate, and a global trading partner... but HELL NO WE WON'T BOYCOTT SAUDI OIL. A country that is just as oppressive as Iraq, funds terrorism, and would nuke the US if it had the chance.

Sava, I'm relly impressed! I'm proud of you boy. I could not have said it better!

2 thumbs up!

	16-04-2003 22:28									#47
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quote: France hit by tourist boycott JIM MCBETH JACQUES Chirac’s opposition to the war in Iraq and the desecration of Allied graves by anti-British vandals have ended France’s reign as the UK’s favourite holiday destination. A loss of 300,000 visitors and a 25 per cent drop in bookings in a month mean Spain is now officially Britain’s top tourist venue after 14 years in second place. The French president’s anti-war stance and the "cheese-eating surrender monkeys" factor in the United States has also caused a decline in the number of US tourists. Tension between the UK and France increased two weeks ago when protesters desecrated a cemetery in northern France, daubing memorials with graffiti. Holidaymakers are actively boycotting France, according to Holidaylets.net, which has 2,000 homes to rent. Internet searches for France have dropped significantly, according to Ross Hugo, the managing director, who said his sales teams have indicated French attitudes, and the unsavoury incident involving Second World War graves had hardened attitudes. "Our understanding is that this [drop[ is due to political tensions," he added. Around 12.6 million Britons have visited Spain in the last year while visits to France fell to 11.7 million from more than 12 million. Owen Davies, the marketing director of the Individual Travellers’ Company, said: "Spain has held up well but France is down." A spokeswoman for the French tourist office in London admitted UK bookings were "sluggish" and that there had been a downturn in US visitors. But some British companies are describing the "downturn" as a drastic decline. And Chez Nous, a leading seller of French accommodation, has had cancellations since the war began, where customers said Mr Chirac’s "obstruction" was the reason. Another French firm - Bonnes Vacances Direct - said anti-French media coverage had noticeably affected inquiries. Marcelle Spell, of Holiday-rentals.com, added: "If a third of French people - as reports have suggested - wanted Saddam to win, and they go on desecrating war graves, then there may be a bad reaction." By the time the war started, the major tour operators had reduced the number of international holidays on offer by 15 per cent. Some smaller companies took the same defensive tactic, but inevitably it has led to special deals aimed at enticing holidaymakers. One holiday, an activity break in the Dordogne, which includes archery, sailing, abseiling and windsurfing, has been discounted by nearly Ģ1,000. The Ģ1,500 holiday is on offer to a family of five for Ģ500 for a week on full board. As well as philosophical reasons not to travel to France, the industry worldwide has been badly affected, especially on long-haul holidays, which may need to fly over trouble spots. Many British holidaymakers have taken a decision not to travel or at least delay their foreign holiday this year because they perceive going abroad in the present climate of global uncertainty may not be safe. George Ellis, the chairman of Canvas holidays in Scotland, one of the major tour operators to France, said: "Short breaks and camping holidays to France are 17 per cent down and self catering is between 8 per cent and 14 per cent down. Mr Ellis, who is also chairman of the Association of British Tour Operators to France, which has 180 member companies offering holidays, added: "There’s no doubt the Iraq war has affected the holiday trade in general. "But, in the case of France, there are two other factors, which may help the situation. The first is that, when the events in Iraq settle, France may be viewed as a safe place to holiday because of its anti-war stand. "Second, there are a lot of Britons who did not agree with the war against Iraq and they well be will be sympathetic to France’s attitude and decide to go there. "That combination may produce a comeback later in the season, but as to the strength of that comeback, that is anyone’s guess. "And there isn’t anything to indicate that 2004 is going to be a bumper year even though things tend to settle down eventually." A spokesperson for the French tourist office said she "was confident that France will hold its own", but she admitted her organisation had delayed a major family holiday marketing campaign for at least another month

http://www.thescotsman.co.uk/index.cfm?id=440022003

	16-04-2003 22:32									#48
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I've always prefered Spain to France as a holiday spot anyway.

	16-04-2003 22:33									#49
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quote: Originally posted by gsmoove23 I wonder if US tourism has taken a big hit, I remember people were biting their fingernails over what the repercussions of a war would be but mostly because of terrorism concerns. Think any people have since decided not to travel here because of anti-war feelings?

The US just lowered the Terror alert level, so I don't think the government believes that the terrorists will be striking anytime soon.

But who can say?

It's not like they give warning.

	16-04-2003 22:37									#50
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Personally I haven't changed my buying habits, but I'll defend anybody's right to make that personal decision.

And I still don't understand why you think it's bratty. I'm sure some of the brats that you keep referring to have put some deep thought into what they choose to do.

What, regardless of their motivation, you consider them brats because you don't agree with them? Just who is the whining child here?

	16-04-2003 22:37									#51
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quote: May it be on a personnal level or on a state level, americans are still acting like spoiled bratts! My argument stays the same. They dont accept no for an answer so they get revenge in whatever way they can. You people act the sameway with eachother. For example, americans are ready to sue anyone they can for any mistake they make because they CANT be wrong, they are always better than the next person. In general of course, not everyone is the same but the majority of americans are like that.

You have a point there Spec. We do love to sue people who we feel screwed us over. Oh, by the way, France didn't just say "no" to the invitation to war they practically impeded us. There is a difference between not getting involved and getting in the way. France got in the way, and called us mean names while doing it... Thus, a retaliation is in order. That is childish, but it is the way of things, unfortunately.

Personnaly, I have not intentionaly boycotted any French products, not bothered to change the names of French labled products. Politics don't interfere with my tastes...

I wonder how French's mustard is doint?

	16-04-2003 22:40									#52
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French's took out ads mentioning they have ALWAYS been a US company.

I have never bought French products, so I suppose you could say I have always boycotted them.

What I think of the boycott is simply, you sow the wind, reap the whirlwind.
France wanted to make a statement, now comsumers are.

	16-04-2003 22:41									#53
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Don't you mean Freedom mustard?

	16-04-2003 22:48									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Shivik If German products has been affected, possibly is because their products has the best quality in the world.

You've got that right. If the U.S. ever boycotted German beer, I'd move to Germany.

	16-04-2003 22:48									#55
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quote: Originally posted by rah Personally I haven't changed my buying habits, but I'll defend anybody's right to make that personal decision.

Yes, I agree, as long as it REALLY IS a personnal decision and just not the "hey everybody is doing it, so will I!!!" decision. And the majority is just that. You know it and I know it.

quote: And I still don't understand why you think it's bratty. I'm sure some of the brats that you keep referring to have put some deep thought into what they choose to do.

Deep thought?? Like the ones we see on pictures that say:" GO U.S.A.!! MORANS!!" Pretty deep indeed. Face it, the majority who boycott french products are un-informed and follow what others say. I bet that if you ask them why they'll come up with an answer like:" Duh, because they are our enemies cuz they dont go to war with us!" Exactly why they are bratts, we dont agree so we are enemies.

quote: What, regardless of their motivation, you consider them brats because you don't agree with them? Just who is the whining child here?

I am not whinnig, I am fed up. If the average american would only care to take a look at what's happenning outside their border, the world would be a whole other place. 68% of american dont even know their continents or where france is!!! Talk about deep thought....


Spec.

	16-04-2003 22:52									#56
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quote: Originally posted by Chris 62 Sounds like France's attempt to act like a spolied brat in the UN backfired, to use that lovly catch-all I saw earlier in the thread.

I don't know, is US being the tyrannical father here?

	16-04-2003 22:53									#57
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You're assuming the majority are uniformed because you don't agree with them. Then throw around the normal generalizations of how stupid americans are.

I can see why you're fed up. It must happen often.

	16-04-2003 23:03									#58
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger I don't know, is US being the tyrannical father here?

Not at all.

I believe the French back-lash is for several sound reasons.

First, the French, as was there right, refused to agree with an ultimatum, BUT THEN went out of their way to ensure any vote would fail, even if they to veto it.
Considering that France has been circumventing UN snactions vs Iraq, that is quite damning.

Another reason was attempting to bully NATO, an organization they don't contribute too militarily, by sabotaging protection for Turkey.

A third reason is that many insiders say France applied presure to several key Turkish ministers, using the club of "no possibility of EU admintance" to get them to refuse US troops to be stationed in Turkey, making the war more difficult, and possibly more costly in lives lost.

If France had simply said we want inspections, and then allowed a vote, without strong-arming African nations on the SC and threatening Veto, I doubt people would have boycotted.

Quite simply, France went to far.

	16-04-2003 23:10									#59
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That's right. France gave Iraq billions in weapons, France gave the chemical weapons... Wait a minute, that was the Reagan admin.

Sure, France was looking out for it's own interests. But let's be honest about who contributed most to the problem with Iraq.

	16-04-2003 23:14									#60
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The US troops in Iraq must surely be heartened by the duty and sacrifice of the folks on the home front. The courage to boycott French products must surely stem from an inexhaustable reserve of bravery in the heart of every American.