26-07-2003 10:55									#91
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This is a goal for the winning team, take out one guy.
May get it over quicker.

	26-07-2003 10:59									#92
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i'd very much prefer a system with primary match points and secondary tie-breaker points, like it is used in most real world leagues.
a win is a win, a loss is a loss, everything else is everything else.

	26-07-2003 11:00									#93
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quote: Originally posted by checkMate This is a goal for the winning team, take out one guy. May get it over quicker.

but then it IS over according to your rule..

	26-07-2003 11:00									#94
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That is basically the two scoring options that we have.

	26-07-2003 11:00									#95
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OFFTOPIC:
@checkmate: your mailbox is full, so i cant send you our challenge game turn.

	26-07-2003 11:04									#96
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quote: Originally posted by Mathemagician but then it IS over according to your rule..

The 2nd place player may be on the team of the guy that is being annihlated. This may give pause to the winning team. They may want to whiddle down the 2nd place player first.

The 2nd place player could even take out his own partner or encourage him to resign to preserve a point.

Now you see it is a full bodied strategic story with this 1st guy out and its over method

	26-07-2003 11:28									#97
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Well I just don't have the pateince to completely explore the scoring system. If you suggest something I will probably just go for it. But the last system was quite good.

	26-07-2003 11:40									#98
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well, if its just convincing you, checkmate.

my suggestion was:
2 match points for the winning team in a 2x2 game
0 match points for the losing team in a 2x2 game
last man standing counts

1 match point for the winner in a 1x1 game
0 match points for the loser in a 1x1 game

anything else goes into game points, like how fast the win was, who was left when the game ended or *9 turns.

	26-07-2003 13:47									#99
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Ok then we should use that system for the game points part.

I think we should just keep the super league system though. The scoring system was really what gave it it's character I thought. It was biased somewhat toward helping get the games finished. If the start 9s are only for tie breaks. They essentially don't have much effect. In the last super league they were quite important. And I really think that made it better.

If the game points only (i.e. option 2 wins) we couls use the above scoring for the main part.

I guess the scoring system in the last super league put another layer of strategy that was somewhat outside the playing field. Maybe that doesn't sound good, but it was pretty interesting.

But the main thing is to get on with it....

	26-07-2003 14:03									#100
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i dont think the tie-breaking game points will be unimportant.
just less important than the primary match points.

at a total game number of 6-7 doubles and 12-14 singles matches, a tie occurs rather easily.
in the german "football" (=soccer) league, there are ... uh... 18 teams or so, who play each other TWICE and yet still tie-breakers decide every other season who becomes champion and almost every season tie-breakers decide over some other important issue, like qualification slots for european tournaments, promotion or (insert the opposite of promotion here).

'nuff said.

	27-07-2003 02:23									#101
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You just don't understand the purpose of the old scoring system.

Sorry

Yes the *9's might come into play to break a tie of course. But in the old super league *9's and the other scoring was paramount. Not secondary. This scoring system was a major part of what made the super league the super league.

Now the super league did have a few problems. This was mainly with the scheduling of a 2nd round that never occured.

What I think we want to do is play the super league with the same scoring as last time. But make an improvement on the game timing. Not re-invent the scoring.

But as you can see from the voting most are probably put off by the discussion and don't care anyway.

So.....

	27-07-2003 09:35									#102
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hey dont forget me

	27-07-2003 13:36									#103
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its all to confusing for me, ill just let you guys settle on scoring and ill do the playing part

	28-07-2003 01:19									#104
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quote: Originally posted by checkMate You just don't understand the purpose of the old scoring system. But in the old super league *9's and the other scoring was paramount. Not secondary. This scoring system was a major part of what made the super league the super league. .. Now the super league did have a few problems.

so i understand that the paramount importance of the 9* turns were not part of the problems of the last super league ?

well, anyway, i understand the purpose of my suggested scoring system, and i like that one.

	28-07-2003 09:10									#105
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Well then lets play it your way.

	28-07-2003 10:01									#106
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Are we there yet?! Are we there yet?! Are we there yet?!..........

	29-07-2003 05:53									#108
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So every body wants the random team except for rickety and math is that correct?

	29-07-2003 06:26									#109
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Fine with me.

	29-07-2003 08:05									#110
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dancemasseuse (ken) is going to sign up i will partner with him if there are no objections

	29-07-2003 08:47									#111
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Per Math's suggestion -

Scoring for the "main" match point scoring will be as
follows.

2 match points for the winning team in a 2x2 game
0 match points for the losing team in a 2x2 game
last man standing counts

1 match point for the winner in a 1x1 game
0 match points for the loser in a 1x1 game


For "tie breaker points" we will operate as follows

1x1:
each *9 = 1 point
win < 100 = 10 points
win < 150 = 5 points

2x2
each *9 1st = 2 points
each *9 2nd = 1 point
win < 100 = 10 points
win < 150 = 5 points

There is no penalty for resigning.
In fact the structure encourages resigning at either
100 or 150.

The player that wins a *9 should post it on the main league thread. The main super league thread will be started when the matches start.

Is this scoring objectionable to anyone?

I have added the following:

You may win a 1x1 by

anihlation of your opponent.
alien race
4xPG
or Your opponent resigns.

All of these give the same point value 1 point

All of these types of wins are also valid by 2x2
except that there is no 4xPG in the 2x2.

Last edited by checkMate on 29-07-2003 at 09:26

	29-07-2003 08:53									#112
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i got no problem with it

	29-07-2003 08:58									#113
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I posted a list of teams. Please don't post there, but if you want to request a team mate post in this thread until August 1. On Friday evening I will make random teams from the remaining players.

Currently there are sixteen players.

Each player is to play a 1:1 game with one of the team members of 1/2 of the teams. These parings will be assigned randomly.

Simultaneously, every 2x2 game will be played. So to begin with there will be seven 2x2 games and three 1x1 games for each player.

Is this too many games for anybody?
The 2x2's are usually pretty slow.

As soon as 1x1 players finish games, they will be assigned to pairings with one player in the other 1/2 of the teams. These pairings will be made as soon as possible. That is, players will be paired as soon as they players are available and have not played a 1:1 aginst each other, or against each others team mate.

	29-07-2003 09:27									#114
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Anyone looking for a teammate?

	29-07-2003 09:31									#115
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I'll play with you Nimrod -

	29-07-2003 10:18									#116
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Please forgive my ignorance. Just what does "*9" mean?

	29-07-2003 14:22									#117
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@gumpold
*9 means the power graph at every turn that ends with "9", so turn 9, 19, 29, ...
these have a special function for determining the points checkmate described above (the long post).

@checkmate
i hope i just didnt 'outtalk' you, but i really like the merger of our proposals that you posted above.
i'd add to use *0 turns instead of *9 turns, but i dont care that much.

	29-07-2003 15:56									#118
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*9!

I am willing to out-argue (spam? ) any of you on this.

	29-07-2003 16:46									#119
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*9

At turn 9, 19, 29, 39 ... etc each player must look at the
power graph. Whoever is ahead in the power graph gets one point for the tie break points.

So if you are ahead in the PG at turn 19 you post in the main thread something like.

Ricketyclik vs Gumpold -
Ricketyclik was ahead at Turn 19!

This will then be counted.

Sometimes folks have some confusion over what turn is a *9. When you look at the power graph there is a number in the bottom right corner of the graph. This is the turn number. For a given number, every player will see the same power graph, the power graph only changes at the beginning of the blue players turn.

	29-07-2003 16:54									#120
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As part of the random pairings, we will also randomize the turn order so that nobody is playing the 1st player all the time.

Now last season I think all 1x1 had 2 AI players.
Do we want to keep this?

Do we need any other standardization of settings?

I also thought about symmetrical maps, but I don't think this will be necessary. There are enough games in this league to even out the inequitable starting positions.