30-08-2003 13:34									#121
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

That maybe an acceptable way to solve this case.

	30-08-2003 13:34									#122
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Sure it's just a recipe for making food. It's a recipe that begins: "take one leg of italian pork and prepare it under the special and unique conditions that prevale in Parma..."

The point is, these are foodstuffs that only taste like the original creators intended them to taste if they're prepared by the original makers.

	30-08-2003 14:37									#123
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

yes, Yes, YES!!! Let that venom come out!


damn, that's some silly **** to argue about.

	30-08-2003 14:47									#124
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Oerdin Confuse people? I have yet to find a label more confusing then your average old world wine. A new world wine will have the verital and region of origin right on the lable while your average European wine will only have the region of origin. Therefor you know exactly what you are buying with a new world wine but with an old world wine you are gambling. You really don't know what you are buying and you're just hoping you guess right.

I dont have to investigate the label to know that a wine with the Origin Denomination from Jerez is an excellent Wine, or Rioja, or Ribera del Duero......... If a ham has the Origin Denomination from Jabugo (Huelva, Spain) you can be sure it is simply the best in the word.
In fact, you only have to taste it (and to pay his prize) to know where it comes from.

On the other hand, In Spain we drink "Cava", no Champagne made in Spain.

	30-08-2003 15:09									#125
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I can understand wines, because the region the grapes were grown in and the environment the wine matures in is distinctly regional. I can understand certain cheeses, because some are dependent on the concentratrations of local microbial life.

I cannot understand the regional defense for cured meat.

	30-08-2003 15:12									#126
	Support Apolyton

quote: Originally posted by HershOstropoler The real fun will be about "Budweiser".

Yes - that one will be interesting. Especially since the US Bud is deliberately trying to fool European shoppers into thinking it is the original. They have changed their labeling to be almost exactly the same as the original with just some tiny differences that you really have to look for.

Presumably this isn't a problem in Germany though, since US budweiser will be illegal to sell there. Or is it just illegal to call it 'beer'? Anyone know? (I certainly never noticed it for sale when I lived in Germany.)

	30-08-2003 15:16									#127
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Buck Birdseed Sure it's just a recipe for making food. It's a recipe that begins: "take one leg of italian pork and prepare it under the special and unique conditions that prevale in Parma..." The point is, these are foodstuffs that only taste like the original creators intended them to taste if they're prepared by the original makers.

The original makers are hundreds, if not thousands, of years dead.

	30-08-2003 16:09									#128
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Rogan Josh Presumably this isn't a problem in Germany though, since US budweiser will be illegal to sell there. Or is it just illegal to call it 'beer'? Anyone know? (I certainly never noticed it for sale when I lived in Germany.)

Unless it's brewed under the German purity law (made of water, hop and malt and nothing else) it can't be called beer hereabouts. I have never seen the American version in our stores, only the Czech original. Not that we wouldn't taste the difference... .

There are btw almost no US food products in our stores. Only some Californian vinegar among French, Italian and Spanish wine. A pity, since I love American tortilla chips and all the several dips. I have to go to the american stores, but they're getting rare. Not that this would be a bad thing, though.

	30-08-2003 16:18									#129
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by Sir Ralph There are btw almost no US food products in our stores. Only some Californian vinegar among French, Italian and Spanish wine.

Is that why our wine routinely beats European wines even in European contests?

	30-08-2003 16:20									#130
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I understand that you have similar laws for your sausages.

Will you be going after Frankfurters, Weiners, and Wursts next?

	30-08-2003 16:22									#131
	Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by The Mad Monk I cannot understand the regional defense for cured meat.

The difference can be huge, even in the same country, in relative near regions. Even with the same elaboration process (b.e. in Spain Guijuelo (Salamanca) vs Jabugo (Huelva)), . You only have to taste it to know the difference. Maybe it is the pig diet, some slighty variations in pig races, climate, altitude, water, some secret in the elaboration... I dont know, there are too many factors.

	30-08-2003 16:25									#132
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by The Mad Monk I understand that you have similar laws for your sausages. Will you be going after Frankfurters, Weiners, and Wursts next?

It's Wiener. And you'd better not give us ideas.

	30-08-2003 16:35									#133
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Wiener Whiner.

	30-08-2003 16:52									#134
	Increase the size of your Attachments

I completely agree with that measure.

As you know it, I'm a big Feta fan. But in today's supermarkets, it is nearly impossible to find real Feta (made of goat milk) as the supermarkets are full of fakes from cow milk. Cow milk feta tastes very differently (and very bland) in comparison to real Feta, and it is time the consumer doesn't get confused anymore.

While Champagne is way overrated, I understand why they defend such protection from usurping the name too. The taste of wines (at least, wines that aren't a mix from several grape species and several terrains, like they're done in France) heavily depends from the particular terrain where it comes from.
The Champagne region has a very different terrain and very different climatic conditions than Chile, and this particular Chilean wine is simply not the same product then (even if it uses the same methods after grapes are collected).
Many local products are dependent of local particular geographic features, and are not generic products. It is only normal the name of the locality gets protected to avoid confusion by the consumer.

I'm sure you Yanks would hate it if some local Cola brand was called "Coca Cola" while tasting different. And I'm sure you'd understand why your government will try to stop it.

	30-08-2003 16:58									#135
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Actually, most of us probably wouldn't care, and many would be displeased if the government stepped in on a matter where Coca-Cola could easily take care of itself.

A better example would be the Bourbon / Scotch trade-off mentioned earlier.

ANY AMERICANS READING THIS WHO CARE IF SOMEBODY MADE A EUROPEAN "BOURBON", POST!

	30-08-2003 17:03									#136
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Bourbon is just a whiskey made atleast 50% out of sour corn mash. The place it is made doesn't matter any more then if I make a "Greek Salad" in Greece or not.

	30-08-2003 17:04									#137
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Spiffor As you know it, I'm a big Feta fan. But in today's supermarkets, it is nearly impossible to find real Feta (made of goat milk) as the supermarkets are full of fakes from cow milk. Cow milk feta tastes very differently (and very bland) in comparison to real Feta, and it is time the consumer doesn't get confused anymore.

Don't you have ethnic markets in France? Or specialty stores where you can buy feta?

	30-08-2003 17:09									#138
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Oerdin The place it is made doesn't matter any more then if I make a "Greek Salad" in Greece or not.

Indeed. "Greek Salad" can be made anywhere with the right contents.

Feta is different than that. Feta is a specific recipe with specific ingredients whose quality depends of the place of extraction. Actually, I couldn't care less if Feta was made in Turkey, Corsica or Spain, as long as it really took goat milk that has been processed in the real Feta way (Actually, I am not for the localization protection for feta... I think regional protection should only happen to regional products made of plants, or made of wild animals). As of today, the Feta name is taintened by the despicable cow-milk feta, and that's the real problem.

	30-08-2003 17:12									#139
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Okay then...what about Port, or Sherry wine?
Their production is much more about the method than the locale, I believe.

	30-08-2003 17:13									#140
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Oerdin Don't you have ethnic markets in France? Or specialty stores where you can buy feta?

You can buy plenty of goat-milk Feta in about any marketplace in France (not necessarily Greek though... Often it is Italian). But to go there requires some knowledge of taste and some financial well-being already. For the many poeple who shop exclusively in supermarkets, there is only one brand of Feta that I know of which sells goat milk.

Things are even worse in Germany. The goat-milk Feta company is hardly known (no advertisement campaign unlike in France), and I could find its products in only one supermarket. All the other consumers are fooled into believing Feta is the pure crap from cow milk

	30-08-2003 17:13									#141
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by The Mad Monk A better example would be the Bourbon / Scotch trade-off mentioned earlier. ANY AMERICANS READING THIS WHO CARE IF SOMEBODY MADE A EUROPEAN "BOURBON", POST!

We don't drink Bourbon. If at all, we drink Scotch. Needless to say where it comes from.

	30-08-2003 17:13									#142
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Oerdin Is that why our wine routinely beats European wines even in European contests?

It may be that your wine growers just don't export their best wines and save them for the domestic markets, because the US wine on sale here are pretty uniformly shite.

	30-08-2003 17:13									#143
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by The Mad Monk Okay then...what about Port, or Sherry wine? Their production is much more about the method than the locale, I believe.

I don't know these products... With "Port", do you mean Porto wine ?

	30-08-2003 17:15									#144
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Rogan Josh It may be that your wine growers just don't export their best wines and save them for the domestic markets, because the US wine on sale here are pretty uniformly shite.

Yet, I have never tasted any Württemberg wine that was better than the few Californian wines I've tasted. Granted, I quit buying Württemberg fairly quickly

	30-08-2003 17:15									#145
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Spiffor Indeed. "Greek Salad" can be made anywhere with the right contents. Feta is different than that. Feta is a specific recipe with specific ingredients whose quality depends of the place of extraction. Actually, I couldn't care less if Feta was made in Turkey, Corsica or Spain, as long as it really took goat milk that has been processed in the real Feta way (Actually, I am not for the localization protection for feta... I think regional protection should only happen to regional products made of plants, or made of wild animals). As of today, the Feta name is taintened by the despicable cow-milk feta, and that's the real problem.

I don't deny there are differences in taste but they are "like items". Feta simply describes a type of cheese and not where the cheese is from. It's up to individual makers to establish reputable brand names instead of trying to squat on common English worlds.

	30-08-2003 17:15									#146
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

What you're saying about Feta makes sense -- a definiton based on the ingredients and how they're processed. That's what you find for a lot of foods and liquors in the United States (such as bourbon, or mayonaise).

	30-08-2003 17:16									#147
	Increase Your PM Length

I say let the market decide which cheese is better. Are you afraid there really isn't that much of a difference?

(edit: I'm talking about between different types of salted goat's milk cheese from countries other then Greece)

Last edited by Oerdin on 30-08-2003 at 17:21

	30-08-2003 17:16									#148
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Spiffor Yet, I have never tasted any Württemberg wine that was better than the few Californian wines I've tasted. Granted, I quit buying Württemberg fairly quickly

That's true. German wines aren't my cup of tea either.

	30-08-2003 17:19									#149
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Oerdin I say let the market decide which cheese is better. Are you afraid there really isn't that much of a difference?

Would you be happy if lamb was packaged as beef? That wouldn't break any copyright laws, but would be very misleading, even if it did say somewhere on the package in small print '100% lamb'.

Or should we let the market decide?

	30-08-2003 17:21									#150
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Spiffor I don't know these products... With "Port", do you mean Porto wine ?

Yes.

Sherry wines are another type of fortified wine, produced in the Jerez region of spain.