02-03-2004 23:29									#91
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I'd love to add some extra civs and I would if I could, Pericles...

If I can't implement a trooper,
I will give the Sun Tzu (Greek Military) wonder to Athens, representing Greece's fine army prestige.

And some hard defenders, to make the city tough to take...

How's that?

	03-03-2004 02:15									#92
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Extra civ?

that would be too much Curt my man.

Historically the Frenchies invaded Athen to force entry to the war at Venizelos's enticement but were repelled by the King's followers.

	03-03-2004 02:19									#93
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We did enter the war in the end after a long blockade of Peraieus that introduced hunger in Athens.

	03-03-2004 04:03									#94
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These shall be researched and added to events...

Cheers, old mate!

	03-03-2004 10:27									#95
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Care to give us a status report? I've been looking forward to this one for ages now.

	03-03-2004 17:00									#96
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Working on the map and icons - about 65% there!

War and Imerpialism takes time!

	04-03-2004 04:03									#97
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How about you use for Greece the same idea as jim panse?

Athens and Salonika as barbarian cities that give infantry units when captured by the allies.
It could also be extended to give units to either the germans or Allies as the posibility of entering the war on the German side was a propability. The Germans did in fact attack our fortifications in Macedonia breaking our neutrality only to be repelled. The division defending them later surrendered without a fight at our Pro-German King's orders. Primeminister Venizelos supported entry to the war on the side of Entente, while King Constantine(not being able to support entry to the war in the same camp with Turkey) supported neutrality.

But i truly think you should represent Serbia somehow.Not only they defeated the Austrians twice but they were the ones "responsible" for the breakout of the war.

	04-03-2004 04:18									#98
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This is probably going to ruffle some feathers, but I just have to step in.

Why is Greece being given such a high priority? The only reason why it seems like any attention at all is being paid to it is because Greeks on the forum have thrust this to the forefront of the scenario.

If we're going to do requests here, how about a special wonder for Minneapolis? How about the Minneapolis Ford auto plant?

	04-03-2004 04:22									#99
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quote: Originally posted by rmsharpe The only reason why it seems like any attention at all is being paid to it is because Greeks on the forum have thrust this to the forefront of the scenario.

exactly

	04-03-2004 04:25									#100
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Be careful what you say about Greece rmsharpe, MarkG has ears...

Ah well, Palaiologos' rabid jingoism is in keeping with the spirit of the scenario!

Says the guy who wanted a special 1916 event for Ireland...

	04-03-2004 20:51									#101
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Setting up an event for the 1916 revolt is good, since in general most events favor Britiain-this would be one of the few to hinder Britiain- of course, you could make such an event not tied to an actual date, but like the bolshevik one, tied to some british failure. Now, is it possible to star an event if a civ builds something? if so, the building of some building in Dublin, or of a wonder by the UK might spark the revolt.

	04-03-2004 21:08									#102
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quote: Originally posted by GePap Now, is it possible to star an event if a civ builds something? if so, the building of some building in Dublin, or of a wonder by the UK might spark the revolt.

This is possible under TOT, and not under MPGE (which I greatly regret, being a MPGE user...)

	04-03-2004 22:04									#103
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*Steps in to prevent nuke slug out between USA and Greece!*

@Pericles:
Whatever happens, Greece will not be ignored.

@rmsharpe:
Actually I want to put some tempting wonders in the USA part of the map - apart from the obvious NYC trade booster.

Any suggestions from the era, old chap?

@Our_Man:
The revolt in 1916 is relevant, and I will most likely give it coverage.

No-one civ will have an easy ride in Kaiser!

@Cyrion:
Yep...sadly this is true.

	04-03-2004 22:05									#104
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Latest look at the icons...

Attachment: kaiser-icons1.gif
This has been downloaded 133 time(s).

	04-03-2004 23:07									#105
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I had an idea for the WW1 scenerio I want to finish but perhaps you may like as well:

I say: have a tech named Total War,, which makes available Manufacturing plants-which you can make very cheap to build (like 60 shields or so-but keep factories still expesive so that colonial cities can't make them anyway) but expensive to upkeep (maybe 20-30 gold or so if possible)- this allows player at some point to grealty boost the amount of units they can gear out (to replicate the mobalization of Total War and increasing army sizes) while needing lots of money to keep up with this, placing great demands on their treasury to keep going. Maybe then they have to cut back on luxuries, and start feeling the brunt of popular disenchantment.

I also though of a tech called "War Bonds" that would give the ability to build renamed Stock exchanges-another way to fund the evr increasing costs of war (like the costs of new arms plants, aerodromes, so forth). And perhaps rename Adam's Smith's as "War Loan", to cut the costs to one of the combatants.

And then a tech called propaganda-which makes cathedrals available (renamed of course, making temples cathedrals), perhaps as well as coliseums.

All in all, think of way to, as the game goes on, allow the players not only to make more powerfull units but a lot more of them, but also make this whole enterprise cost more and more and more, wearing down the bank accounts of these states.

	05-03-2004 00:29									#106
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GePap: I love your total war concept...I'll use it if you give me persmission.

This is what I have planned for the three major Civ2 forces in the scenario...

War Funds (TAX) will come from these improvements:
Banks (marketplace) > Small Industries (bank) > War Bonds (stockmarket)

A bonus will come from building National Railroads (superhighways)

War loyalty (LUX) will come from these improvements:

Newspapers (temple) > Brewery (cathedral) > Footbal Stadium (colliseum)

Intelligence (SCI) will come from these improvements:
Post Office (library) > Picture House (university) > Officer Academy (research lab)

I want to make the improvements all war-orientated, to show a world that has became totally militarised!

	05-03-2004 00:33									#107
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

One problem with the first suggestion is that you'd have to play around with it a bit to make sure it makes sense economically. After all, it might just be cheaper for the player to rush-buy the required item than devote resources to building the manufacturing plant, maintaining its upkeep and then building whatever is needed.

Also, the computer player would not understand the subtleties with regard to this. It would end up building these manufacturing plants regardless, yet despite the great cost you can bet the AI won't go bankrupt.

It would be great if the MGE events were flexible enough to allow the 1916 Rising to happen only if certain conditions were fulfilled. What I would like to see is that the Rising is destined to occur in 1916, unless the British research the 'Home Rule' technology, in effect granting Ireland limited independence and diffusing the situation. Beyond the scope of MGE unfortunately.


What could be done however is to have an event whereby if the rebels succeed in capturing Dublin, they receive a new unit each turn in order to represent the swaying of public opinion to their side.

	05-03-2004 01:02									#108
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I was joking about wonders in Minneapolis (that being my hometown.)

Love the Kaiser icons, by the way!

Must... fight back... temptation... to do ahistorical WWI scenario

	05-03-2004 01:08									#109
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quote: Originally posted by our_man One problem with the first suggestion is that you'd have to play around with it a bit to make sure it makes sense economically. After all, it might just be cheaper for the player to rush-buy the required item than devote resources to building the manufacturing plant, maintaining its upkeep and then building whatever is needed. Also, the computer player would not understand the subtleties with regard to this. It would end up building these manufacturing plants regardless, yet despite the great cost you can bet the AI won't go bankrupt.

Well at 60 shields it would not be significantly more expesnive than most units and yet increase total shield output by at least 25%, which no only makes building further units faster but also very vitally, it allows more units to upkeep. As for the AI-well, the human player still ahs various advantages vs the AI, so the AI having one should not be a problem.

quote: GePap: I love your total war concept...I'll use it if you give me persmission.

Certainly, that is why I offered it.

	05-03-2004 01:42									#110
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I know I'm very late to contribute was a interesting thing I'd always lacked in many Civ2 WWI, even in the better scens (like, for instance kindal's or jim's scens) is the lack of a correct simulation of the first phase of the war, that was not a war of trenches but a very similar war to 1870-1871.

I know it's very difficult, but what do you think about making a two-phases scenario?

The first phase would be played only in Europe in a very big detailed map, with units at the offensive. The second phase will be played in a worlwide map, after "trenche units" are discovered. I'll do a program to take the cities conquest from phase one to phase two if necessary.

Another idea I was thinking about was to program a new utility that allows you to select where to deploy your troops. All player will send their deployement to the first player to move, who will load this new utility and start the game. Suprise is garantized! (along with history lack of accuracy)

As you can see, I've though a little about WWI in the past, because I've always wanted to do two scens: the perfect WWI scen and the perfect Spanish-against-Napoleon scens. None of them have been more than projects, because I'm a mediocre programmer but a very bad scen-designer.

	05-03-2004 02:30									#111
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I think the best way to show how the war changed is with the units-Infantry units at the start of the game should be assault oriented (with stats like 6/3/1/1/3), and the ain defensive units should be machine guns, which sould be very few at the start. Also cavalry could have a minor role, but have no chance vs machineguns and advanced infantry. Advanced infantry should get tougher, higher defense, machineguns are more, forcing large static masses of inf and lots of artillery for attacks.

	05-03-2004 02:31									#112
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Wow!

I made an X-post, but GePap had the same notion as me!

The initial phase of the war will be a mental dash to Paris, ending in a Ypres-style bog-down in and around Oct-Nov.

If the Germans take Paris before winter 1914 (damned unlikely) the trench war in Europe will not happen.

Otherwise, after 1914 the quality units will give way to massed and less-capable troops. Trench war!

Strongpoints and MGs will halt most attacks...

Only weapons like tanks, gas and stormtroops might make the push...

I would like to keep everything in one package.
But once Kaiser is done fully, it might be cool to do an in-depth Eurocentric version!

The troop deployment idea sounds great!
Please tell us more of this concept, Yaroslav!

	05-03-2004 02:48									#113
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The idea is quite simple. You made the scen, and now creates a file with all the civs destroyed except france, another will all the civs destroyed excepts german, etc.

The french player load that file and move all their units and put them in the position he wants (very important is to note that we can enforce it to be IN france). Load the utility I can made, and generates a file...

All players do the same and send their files to the first player to move, who loads the utility and "mount" the game. The game can now start, and each player has choosen where their troops will start.

Is it too weird?

	05-03-2004 03:15									#114
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quote: Originally posted by curtsibling I would like to keep everything in one package. But once Kaiser is done fully, it might be cool to do an in-depth Eurocentric version!

I hope to make such a scenerio for myself-now that Fairline has pretty much made every unit I would need or want.

	05-03-2004 05:24									#115
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@yaroslav:

If this idea is aimed at PBEM games, then it might be revolutionary!

	05-03-2004 07:32									#116
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Here's a trick that worked in EA (stolen from Darthveda's Herbstnebel). Give one terrain a huge mining bonus. Make mining that terrain a lengthy process. Factories and plants built in cities containing such a mined terrain can churn out high-shield units. Then make virtually every buildable unit but perhaps landwehr/territorials very expensive. The high-shield cities can build them but others can't, even with factories and such. This will allow you to set up industrial regions for each civ. Of course you can rush-build, but if you set up your economic model well (one aspect is expensive maintenance of important improvements), funds for rush-building units should be hard to come by.

	05-03-2004 08:20									#117
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I agree with Boco. Also, make railroads few-that way it will take time to move armies even in Europe-gives a reason to use cavalry in more open spaces. It also makes more cities critical to hold due to the importance of rail hubs.

	05-03-2004 08:43									#118
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At the beginning, they should be have enough money, but not get a lot of new money. Maybe, make the techs hard to get. At first, you have lots of money, but later you have to achieve a balance between keeping the people happy, research, and money.

	05-03-2004 10:01									#119
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Anyone have an F17 or Whippet in a .jpeg or .gfi format?

	06-03-2004 11:20									#120
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You could use Invention, Flight, Navigation, Railroads to good effect. Each of these reduces the caravan payoff. Likewise Communism decreases the effect of Cathedrals. Tie these to desirable military benefits, and you could give the player a real quandary. Do I want bigger payoffs / happier citizens or better military units? Weigh the choice in favor of a better military, and you'll start to simulate the crippling effect that continued war had on trade and morale.