11-03-2004 17:14									#151
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quote: Originally posted by GoPostal Sadly, Aussies contributed much more (several divisions) than the Irish (poor quality rebels, and 1 brigade to the British army)

There were 2 (?) all-Irish territorial divisions together with many regular battalions such as the Irish Guards who fought in other divisions, not to mention 'Pal's' battalions of Irish expatriots who were recruited into the London Irish and Liverpool Irish regiments. I think there were 300,000 - 400,000 Irishmen who served in the first War, most of whom were recruited prior to the Easter rising. There were a disproportionately high number of Anzac divisions as well, and I think the Australians suffered the worst per capita casualty rates of all Empire troops.

	11-03-2004 17:25									#152
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quote: Originally posted by fairline It did occur: Zeppelins and later Gothas bombed London.

I stand corrected.

	11-03-2004 20:32									#153
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There's a first for everything P.

Curt, the DVII you wanted.

Attachment: fokker dvii.gif
This has been downloaded 157 time(s).

	11-03-2004 20:38									#154
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Any F17's or Whippets in your inventory Fairline?

	11-03-2004 22:21									#155
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I've read in an Englishman's memoirs that Ausie troops didn't generally take prisoners. If the Germans so much as fired a shot before surrendering they would be given no mercy.

It seems a bit far fetched to me so i thought i'd better ask the experts.

	11-03-2004 22:50									#156
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quote: Originally posted by fairline There were 2 (?) all-Irish territorial divisions together with many regular battalions such as the Irish Guards who fought in other divisions, not to mention 'Pal's' battalions of Irish expatriots who were recruited into the London Irish and Liverpool Irish regiments. I think there were 300,000 - 400,000 Irishmen who served in the first War, most of whom were recruited prior to the Easter rising. There were a disproportionately high number of Anzac divisions as well, and I think the Australians suffered the worst per capita casualty rates of all Empire troops.

My bad.

	11-03-2004 23:31									#157
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Yes, there were a lot of troops from Ireland that fought in WW1. Again, I'm not sure of exact numbers, but I do know that John Redmond persuaded the majority of the Irish Volunteers (~100,000) to fight in the belief it would help Ireland acheive Home Rule more quickly. They became known as the National Volunteers, while the remainder (~2,000) who stayed kept the Irish Volunteers as their name. Almost all of the men that took part in the 1916 Rising were from the latter.

Incidentally, Ireland was the only part of the British Isles where conscription was never introduced during the war, as the government feared it would cause a revolution.

	12-03-2004 14:00									#158
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Chaps!
Sorry for being tardy!

Been doing loads of animations for my end semester project, my machine has been rendering for 3 days!

But this weekend I will make some serious headway with this sceanrio and I answer all posts tonight!

Cheers for keeping the comments coming!
And fairline - that DVIII looks tasty! Egads!

	12-03-2004 14:02									#159
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quote: Originally posted by rmsharpe Considering also it isn't just WWI, it's the period after that as well. Personally, I'd have even more armored units in there since it isn't really a WWI scenario, right?

Yep!

It's a global war scenario that happens to begin in August 1914!

Anything could happen, and probably will!

	12-03-2004 14:50									#160
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quote: Originally posted by fairline There were a disproportionately high number of Anzac divisions as well, and I think the Australians suffered the worst per capita casualty rates of all Empire troops.

Yep, I think only the French and Serbians(?) suffered higher per-capita casualty rates then the Australians.

It should be noted however that a reason for this is that Australian troops were proportionatly more likely to be infantrymen then members of the other armies were. The reason behind this is that Australian units generally used British supply and support services.

quote: Originally posted by Palaiologos I've read in an Englishman's memoirs that Ausie troops didn't generally take prisoners. If the Germans so much as fired a shot before surrendering they would be given no mercy.

Yeah, that's true. Remarkably, the Australian Official Histories describe in detail incidents where prisoners were killed in cold blood.

The scary thing is that the Canadians were worse: after a (false) rumor got spread that the Germans had crucified a Canadian POW, the Canadians almost never took prisoners.

	12-03-2004 21:54									#161
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quote: Originally posted by Case The scary thing is that the Canadians were worse: after a (false) rumor got spread that the Germans had crucified a Canadian POW, the Canadians almost never took prisoners.

Im the last person to put faith in the veracity of claims made by TV documentaries, but by coincidence I watched a UK-History Channel programme on this very subject a couple of weeks ago. The Canadian Sergeant in question was identified by the researchers and enough 'eye-witness' accounts of the porported crucifiction (including a letter to the relatives of the poor bloke by the guy who found him) do seem to indicate there may have been a fair degree of truth in this story. It appears he was 'crucified' with bayonets against a barn door shortly after being captured. The programme indicated that the post-war investigation into his death may have been quashed in the interest of reconcilliation with the new democratic German government.

	12-03-2004 22:03									#162
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quote: Originally posted by GePap Any F17's or Whippets in your inventory Fairline?

Pablostuka made a nice FT-17 which you can find in his Spanish Civil War scenario at CDG. I may have a go at the Whippet......

	12-03-2004 23:18									#163
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I remember quite well my grade 10 history teacher recounting the story of the young Canadian man alledgedly crucified by the Germans. By the way he told the story the class could tell he believed every word of it himself, as it seemed to turn his stomach just to tell it. Of course he wasn't there, neither was I. But like the TV documentary you refered to fairline there does seem to be a great deal of evidence that it did indeed occur.

I was going to post a link to a webiste that discusses the incident, however the site has a very graphic image of the crucification that I thought might upset some people.

	13-03-2004 01:27									#164
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Curt; Count Me In for playtesting!

Finally a good WWI scneario again .

	13-03-2004 03:42									#165
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Count me in as well. GO OTTOMANS!!!

	13-03-2004 03:54									#166
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If you search for crucified canadian, you'll find links suggesting it was a propaganda hoax.

One link from the Liddell Hart archives:

quote: LIDDELL: 15/2/15-16 Papers dated 1931-1969 on historical and literary interpretations of World War One, 1914-1967 LIDDELL: 15/2/15 1931-1969 Papers relating to methods and styles of writing World War One history, particularly influence of contemporary propaganda and misinformation; problems of evidence and conflicting accounts; generalisation and lack of accuracy...; examples of British anti-German propaganda and atrocity stories notably the 'mutilated nurse', the 'crucified Canadian' and the 'Committee for the increase of the population'; ...

From Silent Battle: Canadian Prisoners of War in Germany, 1914-1919

quote: Canada's most famous prisoner of the First World War, writes Desmond Morton in Silent Battle, was the crucified soldier depicted in Derwent Wood's sculpture Canada's Golgotha. The bronze frieze was a great piece of showmanship, but when the tale of a Canadian soldier crucified on a barn door by his German captors was proven to be baseless, the work fell from favour and was eventually consigned to storage by the National Gallery.

Still I'd hesitate surrendering to Canadians if I were a German in the Great War.

	13-03-2004 05:16									#167
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quote: Originally posted by Boco If you search for crucified canadian, you'll find links suggesting it was a propaganda hoax. One link from the Liddell Hart archives: From Silent Battle: Canadian Prisoners of War in Germany, 1914-1919 Still I'd hesitate surrendering to Canadians if I were a German in the Great War.

It doesn't matter whether it was true or not, if the Canadians believed it.

	13-03-2004 08:12									#168
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quote: Originally posted by Boco Still I'd hesitate surrendering to Canadians if I were a German in the Great War.

...or if you were in the SS in WW2: after the SS killed a number of Canadian POWs on D-Day, the Canadians almost never accepted the surrender of members of the SS (come to think of it, I don't think anybody took SS prisoners).
Similarly, Australian infantrymen weren't inclined to take any Japanese POWs after the butchered bodies of Australian POWs were found on the Kokoda Trail.

	13-03-2004 09:19									#169
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Okay, i knew about the "mutilated nurse" and just learnt of the "Crusified Canadian", but what in the hell was the "Comitee for the increase of the population"?

Generally all such stories are bollocks. There is this story in Greece of the sergeant that wrapped himself with the Greek flag and jumped off the Acropolis when the Germans approached. Totally uncorfimed but sadly quite acceptable by the press and "self proclaimed patriots".

As for the SS while i think it was only human(...) to offer no mercy to their men if captured, i can not ethically accept the execution of POWs from that Hitlerjungen division(was it the tenth?) that fought in Normandy. I've read in a magazine that British troops enraged by the tenacious defence those 16-17 year olds had offered took no prisoners.

Mmmm....i wonder if the yanks were responsible for any atrocities during the war....

	13-03-2004 11:14									#170
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quote: Originally posted by Palaiologos Mmmm....i wonder if the yanks were responsible for any atrocities during the war....

Of course they were. US Marines didn't take Japanese prisoners for the same reasons that the Australians didn't take them, and there were various incidents in Europe.

However, when it comes to prisoner-killing, nothing has ever been more horrific then the Eastern Front of WW2. The Germans deliberatly killed over 3 million Soviet POWs and the Soviets returned the favour by killing about 2 million German POWs.

	13-03-2004 22:28									#171
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When it comes to atrocities in war, no nation can say their hands are clean.

	14-03-2004 00:13									#172
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Case i think that 2.000.000 German POWS executed sound awfully a lot for a front that cost the Germans 1.800.000 killed.

I suppose you count in the ones that perished in Siberia later, but still the numbers just don't add up.

Can you provide more info please?

And as for the atrocities in war i suppose they are simply "part of the game".

	14-03-2004 01:17									#173
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Umm, I'm a neophyte with the term, but does this last comment fall under the definition of 'troll'?

How's it going, Curt?

	14-03-2004 02:42									#174
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quote: Originally posted by GePap Any F17's or Whippets in your inventory Fairline?

Here you go GePap:

EDIT: see below

	14-03-2004 03:50									#175
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quote: Originally posted by Palaiologos I suppose you count in the ones that perished in Siberia later, but still the numbers just don't add up. Can you provide more info please?

From memory, I got the figure from Christopher Duffy's Red Storm on the Reich. It strikes me as being rather high as well, but it's certainly not completly unbelievable - a very large chunk of the German Army wasn't released until the late 1940s/early 1950s.

	14-03-2004 06:44									#176
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Just how fast was this speedster?

	14-03-2004 13:18									#177
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quote: Originally posted by Boco Just how fast was this speedster?

Which speedster?

Pixel Obsession Syndrome (copyright BOCO) has taken hold. I had to change 6 of them on the Whippet:

	14-03-2004 16:09									#178
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Fairline!
Nice Whippet!

OK, been working on that 3D stuff, but I am about to make the rules and apply some changes to the map...

The Fokker DVII looks the business and fits the unit look perfectly!

More to come!

Here's the units at the moment!

Attachment: units.gif
This has been downloaded 86 time(s).

	14-03-2004 17:29									#179
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Why two ANZAC troopers?

	14-03-2004 21:46									#180
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Only one Oz-trooper, the other is a Canadian!