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Timexwatch
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Columbia Heights, Washington D.C.
Jul 1999
time: 00:34
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Comments from an American in Barcelona:
The politics of ETA depends on what you read. They may have been leftist at one time, but nowadays, at least from the academic analysis that Iīve been reading, theyīve skewed more towards a rightist slant with ethnic undertones to their claims.
Spanish nationalism, since the La Pepa constitution, has been liberal, but Catalan nationalism and, IIRC, Basque nationalism has been conservative.
Nowadays Catalan nationalism is more leftist (ERC) than anything. Iīm not aware of any rightist Catalan Nationalists. The PNV in Pais Vasco is conservative, IIRC.
As for ETAīs support, itīs far weaker than itīs heydey in the 70s and 80s. The number of Herri Batasuana seats in the Cortes reached a high of 8 (in the mid-80s and over 60% of the Pais Vasco and Navarre seats) but has dropped to nothing. Right now, at least from unbiased interpretations of Euskal Barometer, 20% of Pais Vasco residents are hardcore ETA/Independence supporters. There is a vocal minority that terrorizes the majority, including the Castillian speaking people who live there. There is daily low intensity violence from polarized youth that stalls any political resolution.
Iīd love to post more, but my Internet cafe time is up...
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OliverFA
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Leeds, UK
Sep 2002
time: 06:34
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quote:
Originally posted by M'sieur Baise
But because the train had a few minutes delay, it exploded at a reasonable distance from the station. Now imagine the number of deaths if the bombs had exploded 2 minutes later. |
That will give you an idea about the moral quality of those terrorists.
quote:
Remember that Al-Quaeda is able to recruit people willing to die for their cause. |
Is good that you remind this. Because the bombs have been left in bags and not carried by kamikaze terrorists. So, we are able to believe that Al-Qaeda changes its way of acting and not ETA? How convenient!
quote:
Even with a tight security, anything can happen. |
Which explains why the solution itīs to destroy the centers of terror themselves.
quote:
OK, Oliver. I didn't answer the question. |
Right. You didnīt ask my question. Iīm still waiting for an answer.
I accept that Bushīs strategy has its flaws, like every strategy in the world. But your post explains exactly why itīs better to chase down terrorists. For me itīs the best possible way of acting. I donīt know if he will solve the problem, but at least is trying to.
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OliverFA
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Leeds, UK
Sep 2002
time: 06:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Sava
I don't want to jump to any conclusions, but I suspect it is Alfred Qaeda. 3/11, 9/11, 911 days separating (except for dumbasses forgot about leap year). |
Of course. What is more important? A number, which results to be wrong, or all the clues that point to ETA?
If the police finds a Bible will we say that they were Cristian terrorists?
Was not that the group who has claimed the terrorist attack the same who said that was guilty of New York power fall?
What about the threee previous trains that ETA tried to boicot before?
What about the papers pointing to RENFE (the Spanish train company) that appeared in Bilbao the day before the attack?
And about this thing of the 911 days... Can you believe that a group pays so much attention to the calendar, counting the days and then they mistake one day at the end? Did you know that 3+11=13? I wonder if Jason has something to do with this... Or maybe the guilty channel 5, because 3+1+1=5.
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OliverFA
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Leeds, UK
Sep 2002
time: 06:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Sava
yeah... I feel sorry for the Basque people. They want to be autanomous, |
Sure, like Catalan people also want to be autonomous.
Please, donīt mistake the voice of the independentist parties as the voice of the Basque people. Next you will be saying that Chechenian people want to be autonomous from Russia...
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Oncle Boris
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Once in a brown moon
Aug 2001
time: 00:34
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quote:
Originally posted by BeBro
If that's all pure causality why do we debate about certain actions at all? See, Japan had it coming (the bomb) when it declared war on the US. Or those who resisted Hitler had it coming (to be thrown into concentration camps) as well....or....or....etc. So why should we care about it?
Yes, there may be guys who say that about the girl you mentioned, but it is still a stupid statement. It implies that she is responsible for the rape, at least partially. |
Free will, or at least acting with the illusion of free will, requires that you are responsible for everything you do, if you can know the consequences in advance (i.e., putting yourself at a risk).
Again, responsibility in a causality relation is not necessarily moral- though more often than not it's impossible to say that of two people involved in a row, one is blameless and the other is fine.
Say you create a morality scale, that goes from -100 (utterly despicable) to 100 (angelic). 0 is neutral.
Now, say that X and Y start a brawl in a bar. X is at -50, and so is Y. Does that mean that both can substract the other's morality rating to theirs, so that they are in fact at 0? Nope. They are both a -50.
Now, say the terrorists are at -100, and the innocent people at -2. Am I implying that in fact the terrorists should be considered at -98? Not at all.
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