08-05-2004 00:04									#211
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Funny, I thought Havaking had to do with pubs and bitter and totally ignoring any argument that didn't go in the right direction...

Tamerlin, you'd better make sure the right Stade wins in the play offs. And make sure Biarritz wins against the other side, too, while you're at it.

	08-05-2004 00:17									#212
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quote: Originally posted by Havak I'm also hoping Tamerlin gets the antonym reference - we are overdue a flood of smilies.

Don't worry, add a e at the end of antonym and you have the French word.

	08-05-2004 00:19									#213
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To Havak: to put ducks in a barrel.





revenge

	08-05-2004 00:45									#214
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quote: Originally posted by LDiCesare Funny, I thought Havaking had to do with pubs and bitter and totally ignoring any argument that didn't go in the right direction...

That's also a possibility...

quote: Tamerlin, you'd better make sure the right Stade wins in the play offs. And make sure Biarritz wins against the other side, too, while you're at it.

I hope the Stade from Paris will get smashed as they don't really deserve to be there... and they would not be there without the leniency of some unscrupulous referees (if you have seen the game Stade Français - Castres Olympique you certainly know what I mean). I really don't like this team, even more than the Sporting Union Agenais...

	08-05-2004 00:47									#215
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To LDiCesare: to pop up at the least expected moment and make a judicious on-topic comment.

	08-05-2004 01:52									#216
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quote: Originally posted by finbar Hurricanes 37 -d- Crusaders 20 When the Hurricanes are hot ... Big upset as far as most are concerned. With a consolation try after the hooter, the scoreboard flattered the Crusaders. Umaga, getting back to fitness, had a blinder. The Crusaders' defence, as I've observed before, is nowhere near the wall it once was. The Hurricanes out-muscled, out-ran and out-thought their oppo. Being a Hurricanes supporter must be almost as frustrating as being a Waratahs supporter. The Crusaders had to win tonight to guarantee a home semi next week. Now, if the Chiefs can beat the Brumbies tomorrow, they can take second spot and the home semi next week. Methinks the Crusaders might be safe. Now to go back and deal with some of the drivel posted above!

The Chiefs can still finish top if they get 5 pts versus ACT. Who knows...

	08-05-2004 05:53									#217
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia I'll be watching Chiefs v Brumbies a bit later. I'm not sure if it's live or not so I'll refrain from going to any rugby sites at this point.

It's 3.30pm kick off today - Saturday - our time, so, if you're on daylight savings time, that's 1.30am Saturday your time.

quote: If the Sharks beat the Stormers, wouldn't that knock the Chiefs off the 2nd place spot(assming they beat the Brumbies of course)?

No, the Sharks are currently on 26 points. A win and a bonus point would take them to 31 points, which couldn't put them any higher than fourth providing the Waratahs and Blues both lose. The Sharks' points differential is inferior to both the Waratahs' and the Blues'.

	08-05-2004 05:55									#218
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quote: Originally posted by Frozzy The Chiefs can still finish top if they get 5 pts versus ACT. Who knows...

Yep. Very interesting match in store.

	08-05-2004 05:59									#219
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quote: Originally posted by LDiCesare Funny, I thought Havaking had to do with pubs and bitter and totally ignoring any argument that didn't go in the right direction...

Actually, "to Havak" is an incredibly versatile verb. I've found a reference to it in an old dictionary - "to have an unnatural obsession with jaws shaped like lanterns".

	08-05-2004 06:01									#220
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quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin To LDiCesare: to pop up at the least expected moment and make a judicious on-topic comment.

Yet another versatile verb. I found a reference in yet another old dictionary - "to lift the standard of grenouille posting in internet forums".

	08-05-2004 13:53									#221
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quote: Originally posted by finbar Yet another versatile verb. I found a reference in yet another old dictionary - "to lift the standard of grenouille posting in internet forums".

One day you will be the only one posting in this thread, replying and getting angry at your own posts or congratulating yourself for your own "bons mots".

	08-05-2004 21:01									#222
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Well done Chiefs! First time ever making the playoffs!

If not for that ridiculous penalty that Tapa Henning gave the Brumbies it would have been a draw.

I'll be watching the Sharks/Stormers game tomorrow with great interest. The Stormers have to beat the Sharks by 10 or win with a bonus point to overtake the Blues, so GO SHARKS!!!

	09-05-2004 04:59									#223
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quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin One day you will be the only one posting in this thread, replying and getting angry at your own posts or congratulating yourself for your own "bons mots".

I would only ever reply to one of my own posts to heap upon it the disdain it deserves.

When the hell are you going to play Wasps!?

	09-05-2004 05:19									#224
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia Well done Chiefs! First time ever making the playoffs!

Yes, they did well. They deserve their spot in the finals.

quote: If not for that ridiculous penalty that Tapa Henning gave the Brumbies it would have been a draw.

Twaddle. The Chiefs simply lacked the firepower to capitalise on some of their other strengths.

quote: I'll be watching the Sharks/Stormers game tomorrow with great interest. The Stormers have to beat the Sharks by 10 or win with a bonus point to overtake the Blues, so GO SHARKS!!!

Sorry. Stormers 31 -d- Sharks 24. Taking them to third spot, relegating the Chiefs to fourth spot:

1. Brumbies
2. Crusaders
3. Stormers
4. Chiefs

It's actually, I think, a very fair end result. The most consistent teams during the season were rewarded. The Blues saved their very best till far too late, and the Waratahs have only themselves to blame for yet another outburst of rugby hari kari.

So next week it's Crusaders -v- Stormers in Christchurch, meaning the Stormers have to travel all the way back to New Zealand. A big ask. And I bet Corne Krige is regretting his stupidity. The Stormers are going to be fired up, and the Crusaders will want to lift their game from this week's effort.

The other semi is Brumbies -v- Chiefs in Canberra. The Brumbies at home are a frightening proposition.

Over the weekend:

Reds 23 -d- Waratahs 7

Thus the Waratahs' record of never having beaten the Reds since S12 started remains intact. The Reds performed 180% better than they did in any match all season - disciplined, magnificent defence, extraordinary commitment. The Waratahs produced yet another inept performance. Once more, serious questions will be asked - why is that the Reds can only produce efforts like this against the Waratahs? And what goes on inside the Waratahs' heads that can allow a team who can beat the top two teams - Brumbies and Crusaders - also to produce such lacklustre directionless rugby? And, once more, the serious questions will go unanswered. In all likelihood, it will all happen again next season.

Blues 50 -d- Highlanders 22

Yes, we know what the Blues can do. Pity they saved it till too late in the season. In truth, for all their skills, they didn't deserve to make the finals.

	09-05-2004 10:03									#225
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Inability to compete with just your own resources makes you open minded?

We seem to have a different definition of the word 'inability' as well.
Additionally you seem to be under the impression that NZ immigration/residency policies fell under the auspices of the NZRB as of a few years ago?
They're eligible, they're willing, they're capable and they're there - ergo they can play.


Regarding the 'Combined' team, or their individual national teams competing in the S12 - I would wholeheartedly support such a measure - better yet bring the Puma's in as well and make a day of it.
Unfortunately it probably isn't going to happen, mores the pity.

	09-05-2004 19:25									#226
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quote: Originally posted by finbar Sorry. Stormers 31 -d- Sharks 24. Taking them to third spot, relegating the Chiefs to fourth spot:

Just finished watching the game. The Sharks really let themselves down. Butch James being sent off didn't help things, but the Sharks squandered a lot of try-scoring opportunities.

quote: It's actually, I think, a very fair end result. The most consistent teams during the season were rewarded. The Blues saved their very best till far too late

Yes, I tend to agree. The Blues had plenty of chances earlier in the season to pick up a bonus point. I can't say I'm not disappointed though. In their current form they would have had a pretty decent shot at making the final.

quote: So next week it's Crusaders -v- Stormers in Christchurch, meaning the Stormers have to travel all the way back to New Zealand. A big ask. And I bet Corne Krige is regretting his stupidity. The Stormers are going to be fired up, and the Crusaders will want to lift their game from this week's effort. The other semi is Brumbies -v- Chiefs in Canberra. The Brumbies at home are a frightening proposition.

Well the Chiefs weren't daunted by that prospect last week, so I expect another close game. The Crusaders should cruise past the Stormers though.

	09-05-2004 21:06									#227
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It's scary how well you guys sum me up in a sentence.

It's almost like I lack substance or something.

Anyway as Finbar is letting us down on the English scores here are two:

Bath 41 Glaws 7
Wasps 17 Tigers 48

Bath finish top of the league and go straight into the play off final. Wasp play at home against Saints for the other place.

Wasps play Toulouse in three weeks I think. Tamerlin will have noticed that Tigers just posted a record home defeat on them in the premiership.

Having been one above Rotherham for five months we ended up finishing fifth in the league and now have a home semi in the wildcard.

Tigers are back!

	10-05-2004 03:12									#228
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quote: Originally posted by Havak It's scary how well you guys sum me up in a sentence.

You force me into it.

quote: Wasps 17 Tigers 48

Did they play with their full squad or did they put some of their players to rest in preparation of the final phases?

quote: Wasps play Toulouse in three weeks I think. Tamerlin will have noticed that Tigers just posted a record home defeat on them in the premiership.

The H-Cup final is played the 23rd of may.

Results of the French play-offs:

Pool A
Union Sportive des Arlequins de Perpignan 35 - Club Sportif de Bourgoin-Jailleu 21
Association Sportive de Béziers 15 - Castres Olympique 19

Pool B
Club Athlétique de Brives 9 - Stade Toulousain 29
Stade Français 13 - Biarritz Olympique 6

Though the results are logical the level of the games is very worrying. Though I can't tell anything about Béziers vs. Castres I have seen the games of the Stade Toulousain and Perpignan and they were very, very poor. My stepfather told me that the game won by the Stade Français the day before was even poorer. The terrible level of the French championship is very worrying as I have the feeling this is all the French rugby that is weakening itself. Though I still prefer our rugby to the game played in the SH (you all know what I think about it) this is very sad.

	10-05-2004 04:43									#229
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Tigers are back!

At least until they manage to Havak things up again anyway ...

	10-05-2004 05:36									#230
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quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin The terrible level of the French championship is very worrying as I have the feeling this is all the French rugby that is weakening itself. Though I still prefer our rugby to the game played in the SH (you all know what I think about it) this is very sad.

What are you saying? Poor skills? Too many imports? Decline in standards? If so, why? What's going on in French rugby?

	10-05-2004 12:21									#231
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quote: Originally posted by finbar What are you saying? Poor skills? Too many imports? Decline in standards? If so, why? What's going on in French rugby?

I don't have too much time this morning, this is a problem I have already talked about before. Some of the main problems IMO are lack of technical skill and tight game plans killing what remains of the famous "french flair" in order to reduce the chances of a loss. The stakes are so high the clubs are not playing with the intent to win but with the intent to not lose.

Since 1996 the French game is becoming poorer and poorer and more and more games are terrible to watch. Very sad, they are about to kill "la poule aux oeufs d'or".

	10-05-2004 12:37									#232
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Ah, I see. Negative defensive play? Fair enough. Shame.

	10-05-2004 12:52									#233
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quote: Did they play with their full squad or did they put some of their players to rest in preparation of the final phases?

Gatland played the best side he had fit – meaning that Dowd and Shaw were missing as both are Injured. The loss of Dowd has had a huge and immediate impact on their pack. They still fielded a star studded side captained by Dallymuppet. We had a very good day at the office – they didn’t.

VD scored a brace.

quote: The terrible level of the French championship is very worrying as I have the feeling this is all the French rugby that is weakening itself

I’ll have to wait for 23rd to be able to judge – we don’t get to see any domestic French rugger any more.

quote: At least until they manage to Havak things up again anyway ...

It’s the nature of rugby that they will do so. We are developing a knack of playing well at the wrong times.

I see Mitchell is off his medication again – saying England pose no threat in the summer because Clive got his selection wrong, claiming NZ have all the best players in the world (eh?) and then admitting Carlos was a mistake because he ‘pre-meditates’ his attacks. Huh? Carlos pre-meditates? Get Mitchell back on the drugs quickly!!

So…

Crusaders v Stormers
Brumbies v Chiefs

How exactly did two NZ franchises manage to sneak in?

	10-05-2004 14:00									#234
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quote: Originally posted by Havak I see Mitchell is off his medication again – saying England pose no threat in the summer because Clive got his selection wrong, claiming NZ have all the best players in the world (eh?) and then admitting Carlos was a mistake because he ‘pre-meditates’ his attacks. Huh? Carlos pre-meditates? Get Mitchell back on the drugs quickly!!

Give him a break. He got the first bit right. As to the second bit ...

quote: So… Crusaders v Stormers Brumbies v Chiefs How exactly did two NZ franchises manage to sneak in?

Simple, really. They played consistent rugby for the second half of the tourney. Unlike certain other teams - no names, no packdrill, you bastards in the light blue jerseys - who could beat the top team one week and toss away a 20+ lead to lose against an ordinary team another week.

	10-05-2004 14:20									#235
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How much of it is down to the loss of Rogers I wonder?

As for the Mitchell quotes I didn't see him get anything right - he even thinks the team is in good hands with Graham Henry.

	10-05-2004 16:07									#236
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quote: Originally posted by Havak How much of it is down to the loss of Rogers I wonder?

They obviously missed him terribly. He was igniting the whole team. But he remains one player. And they came out and beat the Brumbies three weeks ago without him. Harrison and Vickerman dominated line outs all season, the pack was one of the strongest in the comp. But the team, as a whole, can't cut it.

Every shrink - amateur and otherwise - in Sydney is trying to diagnose their problems. A complete change of coaching staff this season with no change in the bottom line - play like champions one week, schoolboys the next. And it's now twice in two seasons that they've thrown away 20+ leads beyond half time to lose. This season against a team with 14 players, a match they only had to win to secure a finals berth!

They're certainly lacking a class fly half, someone who can control a game. Apparently they had a chance to pick up Matt Giteau from the Brumbies prior to this season but blew it. And Chris Whitaker is a fine half back and a lovely chap, but he's not a strong enough personality to skipper. All these individual problems are easily identified but there's a much deeper problem, something cultural. They don't have - and have never had - the determination, discipline and killer instinct of, say, the Brumbies. Give the Brumbies an inch and they will slaughter you. The Waratahs don't even have the determination and discipline of the Reds, a team that only seems capable of lifting itself once a season - against the Waratahs. The problem has existed for generations of players and management. It's very, very bizarre.

quote: As for the Mitchell quotes I didn't see him get anything right - he even thinks the team is in good hands with Graham Henry.

I think you'll find he's waiting quietly in the wings for Henry to stuff up and the door to be re-opened.

	10-05-2004 19:50									#237
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quote: A complete change of coaching staff this season with no change in the bottom line - play like champions one week, schoolboys the next

As you say quite bizarre - It’s hugely worrying when considerable coaching changes like that fails to change previous systematic behaviour. Are there junior coaches or senior players affecting it I wonder?

quote: This season against a team with 14 players, a match they only had to win to secure a finals berth!

When a team loses against 14 it sends up a huge distress flare – Tigers did so at the start of their decline in the 02/03 season.

quote: I think you'll find he's waiting quietly in the wings for Henry to stuff up and the door to be re-opened.

Now that would be a novelty wouldn’t it – an AB coach being quickly and summarily dismissed from the post?

I bought one of our AB style shirts by the way – couldn’t resist.

So our home semi in the wildcard kicks off at 7:15pm BST on Saturday. I won’t be there – silly time for rugby as there is drinking to be done.

	10-05-2004 22:19									#238
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quote: Originally posted by Havak So our home semi in the wildcard kicks off at 7:15pm BST on Saturday. I won’t be there – silly time for rugby as there is drinking to be done.

Give him the choice between the Tigers and a good pint and he throws his favorite team through the window...

Havak, don't say I am not a real supporter because I am not following the Stade Toulousain away from home anymore before the final phases.

	10-05-2004 22:26									#239
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quote: Originally posted by finbar Ah, I see. Negative defensive play? Fair enough. Shame.

Exactly, add that the major teams are managing the season in order to preserve the players and you have the full picture. It is really a shame and also against the spirit of the game of Rugby as the major teams plan to win against the weaker teams away from home while they plan to lose the away games against the other major teams in the same time.

	11-05-2004 00:20									#240
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I see much is being made of Tuiali'i's claim that his headbutt was a reaction to a racist slur.

Now there are calls for rugby rules to include protection against racist taunts.

Are players now going to be excused from any subsequent bad behaviour as long as they claim it was a reaction to "racism"? What a load of bollocks.