29-10-2004 16:22									#391
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quote: Originally posted by Havak As to your opening question - are you a Kiwi journalist?

No. He's literate.

	29-10-2004 16:42									#392
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More Thoughts Of ZinZan:

England may have lost a lot of players but that means the youngsters coming in have a great chance to make a name for themselves.

Yes, Zinzan, and the sun rises in the east and sets in the west. D*ckhead!

	29-10-2004 18:53									#393
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quote: J****'s the only one of real use.

Probably true (shocked?). Backy is still a great lad but by then either Lipman or Moody should have made the England 7 shirt their own - and both are very good players, Moody the better of course. Dayglo belongs where he is now – the calm and serene Martin Corry is my 8 of choice (and will probably face three different Kiwi 8’s in the three tests?).

quote: Well, if she's a looker, and she's not satisfied at home ...

…an entire nation ends up cuckolded.

Same old situation – unelected officials from minor powers (Italy, France, Germany) trying to force through a Constitution that cripples national parliaments and gives all power to the unelected commission. Until the EU becomes democratic the UK will never engage in such nonsense.

Ah Dr Zinzan. Phd in stating the bleeding obvious.

	30-10-2004 05:25									#394
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Probably true (shocked?). Backy is still a great lad but by then either Lipman or Moody should have made the England 7 shirt their own - and both are very good players, Moody the better of course. Dayglo belongs where he is now – the calm and serene Martin Corry is my 8 of choice (and will probably face three different Kiwi 8’s in the three tests?).

No, not shocked. Back was starting to show his age in the World Cup, so, regardless of his courage and commitment, he'd be well off the pace two years later. The Nose? Had his day about three years ago. There's also no guarantee that J**** would return at the same heights. By the time of the tour, he will have had two years out of the top-level game. His brain and nouse won't have diminished in the slightest, but the limbs and joints are two years older. Let him rest on his international laurels. He deserves it.

And the Kiwis would do well to bring back Zinzan at #8. His outpourings of idiocy would have the oppo in stitches, clearing the way for countless AB tries.

quote: Same old situation – unelected officials from minor powers (Italy, France, Germany) trying to force through a Constitution that cripples national parliaments and gives all power to the unelected commission. Until the EU becomes democratic the UK will never engage in such nonsense.

I haven't come to grips with the whole EU set up. Isn't there an elected Euro Parliament? Where does that figure in the scheme of things? What's the Commission? How is it formed? I should probably come to grips with some of these things before I spend a couple of years in Italy. Not that it will impact greatly on me.

As I've said before, while I think there's obvious practical benefit to the Euro countries working together, I fear the homogenisation factor. I also suspect that, scratch the surface, and self-interest will always prevail. Same as it does here with the States -v- the Commonwealth.

quote: Ah Dr Zinzan. Phd in stating the bleeding obvious.

I'm surprised there's no quality control at the site. Presumably they think - well, he was a great player, anything he has to say will be insightful.

WRONG!

	30-10-2004 12:45									#395
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quote: I'm surprised there's no quality control at the site. Presumably they think - well, he was a great player, anything he has to say will be insightful

Isnt' his column in the humour/comics section?

	30-10-2004 16:18									#396
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That's where it belongs!

	30-10-2004 20:50									#397
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Biarritz 23 - 8 Leicester.
Nice first half for Biarritz with 2 tries. Utterly pitiful performance by Goode. The English forwards were superior to the French in the scrums and mauls, but the Tigers halves were unable to use the ball. Goode made a lot of knocks on, and some other backs too. Goode also missed almost all his kicks. This let Biarritz make fouls while defending and not taking any point for that.
Havak, don't you have a better fly half out there?

	31-10-2004 03:27									#398
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Mmmm. And from reading the report of the match, Leicester's only decent player on the day was a North Aucklander.

	01-11-2004 13:38									#399
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Yes we do have a better Fly Half - but he is just recovering from a groin injury.

It's a little unfair to the forwards to say only Rabeni played well Finbar. But the game was lost by half time.

I wouldn't exactly blame the Irish officials but I do wonder if they were up to that standard of game. The French side were very, um, Professional (Australian?) in a lot of phases and they missed it entirely.

There is no denying that Biarritz have some very talented players - although the big Catalan farm boy doesn't seem the player he was two years ago? I think what worries me with them is that like all French sides they are formidable at home - but they hardly turn up away. They were dire against Wasps last weekend - and this week a totally different outfit.

	01-11-2004 17:37									#400
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quote: Originally posted by Havak It's a little unfair to the forwards to say only Rabeni played well Finbar.

I was quoting the BBC. An impeccable source. Though I didn't check whether the byline was Andrew Gilligan's.

quote: I wouldn't exactly blame the Irish officials but I do wonder if they were up to that standard of game. The French side were very, um, Professional (Australian?) in a lot of phases and they missed it entirely.

You're incorrigible!

	01-11-2004 18:36									#401
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Now now Finbar - that report said he was the only back to make an impression. And sadly that is fair comment.

And you say I am incorrigible.

We were very poor - and it's hardly good preperation for the visit of Glaws on Saturday. But all we need to do to make the European QFs now is beat Wasps twice then stuff Biarritz in the return leg and wallop Calvisano at their place. Am I confident? What do you think?

For the EU question Finbar the Guardian is a handy place to start - I found a brief QandA on the current crisis here

Last edited by Havak on 01-11-2004 at 18:42

	02-11-2004 02:54									#402
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Now now Finbar - that report said he was the only back to make an impression.

Oh. Hmmm. You mean I might, accidentally, with no malice aforethought, somehow managed to have misread it?

quote: And you say I am incorrigible.

You and Tamerlin - the Incorrigible Glimmer Twins! The incorrigible Mick and Keef of the rugby world.

quote: We were very poor - and it's hardly good preperation for the visit of Glaws on Saturday. But all we need to do to make the European QFs now is beat Wasps twice then stuff Biarritz in the return leg and wallop Calvisano at their place. Am I confident? What do you think?

The team bus and its occupants could be demolished on a railway level crossing, burnt to cinders, enveloped in an instant Ice Age, and you'd still be talking up their chances!

quote: For the EU question Finbar the Guardian is a handy place to start - I found a brief QandA on the current crisis here

Thanks for that. It explains the current mess, bits and pieces of which I've read in the paper here. Good old Silvio. But what I can't grasp is where the Commission fits into the equation - does it sit above the Euro Parliament? Does it answer to the EP?

	02-11-2004 05:02									#403
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quote: Originally posted by finbar No. He's literate.

Probably the nicest thing anybody's ever said about me.

quote: Originally posted by Havak As to your opening question - are you a Kiwi journalist?

Probably the worst thing Havak's ever said about anybody.


Poor old Zinny. In the hot seat again. First he makes a small blunder and gets things a wee bit, well, not quite right shall we say, and gets bashed for it.
Then, taking advice from this thread no doubt, he proceeds to get his next remarks spot on the dollar (that'd be a unit of currency for any of those big forward types who don't use them and mightn't know what they are ) and gets bashed for that too.


One match report I read on the Leicester-Biarritz game indicated that his nibs Lord Jonno had just got back from some dinner function in Singapore?
Apparently he didn't play to badly in spite of it but you'd have to wonder whether taking the captain out of the picture for the days leading up to such an important match was a good idea ...

*Currently studying for a Masters in stating the bleeding obvious*


The whole EU thing has me puzzled too - how on earth can they get into such strife over what would seem to me to be nothing more than the equivalent of US congressional confirmation hearings?
If they're having such unchartered (no pun intended) problems now what is it going to be like when they actually have to do something tough - going up against the interests of one or more of the stronger member nations?

	02-11-2004 05:39									#404
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quote: Originally posted by ravagon Probably the nicest thing anybody's ever said about me.

The word "barely" didn't appear in the post? Let me go back and check ...

... hmmmm. It didn't appear. Damn software!

quote: Poor old Zinny. In the hot seat again. First he makes a small blunder and gets things a wee bit, well, not quite right shall we say, and gets bashed for it. Then, taking advice from this thread no doubt, he proceeds to get his next remarks spot on the dollar (that'd be a unit of currency for any of those big forward types who don't use them and mightn't know what they are ) and gets bashed for that too.

He was bashed for the stating the bleeding obvious as if it were some newfound theory he'd discovered. Which, in his case, it probably was. That's the point!

quote: *Currently studying for a Masters in stating the bleeding obvious*

Zinzan ravagon!

quote: The whole EU thing has me puzzled too - how on earth can they get into such strife over what would seem to me to be nothing more than the equivalent of US congressional confirmation hearings?

Because they're European! It wouldn't happen here. That's why Europe is such a fascinating place. That's why it's the Real World. Unlike this passionless sh*thole of a place!

	02-11-2004 15:03									#405
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quote: Oh. Hmmm. You mean I might, accidentally, with no malice aforethought, somehow managed to have misread it?

Perish the thought old boy.

quote: The incorrigible Mick and Keef of the rugby world.

And which of us is which of them? To strangle English Grammar.

quote: The team bus and its occupants could be demolished on a railway level crossing, burnt to cinders, enveloped in an instant Ice Age, and you'd still be talking up their chances!

And why not? We could still win the S12 even then.

quote: But what I can't grasp is where the Commission fits into the equation - does it sit above the Euro Parliament? Does it answer to the EP?

Yes it sits ‘above’ as such – and in theory it now answers to the Parliament only in that they have to approve it’s initial appointment. It’s one of the least democratic aspects of the EU and something even Tamerlin couldn’t sell in a month of Sundays. I believe each incoming President of the EU assembles a Commission based on names put forward by each member state – hence Tony putting his old mate Mandy on the gravy train. The big countries expect the prime portfolios – and that Italian homophobic chauvinist was due to be commissioner for Justice. You couldn’t write a better script were it a movie?

I think the article I linked pointed out that the parliament has only recently been given the power to ‘rubber stamp’ these crony posts – and used it to flex their muscles for the first time ever. They did this in the only way they were allowed to – rejecting the entire line up the incoming president put forward.

If I am wrong Tamerlin will no doubt correct me.

I do know it has sent shock waves through the EU hierarchy – the concept that elected MEPs dare defy the gravy train of lucrative appointed remits for inadequate politicians (none of whom could make it domestically as politicos) has shaken them to their foundations. It is almost like the MEPs think the EU should be democratic or something?

quote: Probably the worst thing Havak's ever said about anybody.

Not quite – I could have called you a Bath fan. Or Welsh.

quote: Apparently he didn't play to badly in spite of it but you'd have to wonder whether taking the captain out of the picture for the days leading up to such an important match was a good idea ...

It’s his testimonial season and he has been given special dispensation to attend the functions that will make him “comfortable” in later life. He still played well – and I don’t think his focus suffered much. The girlies had the mares – even the usually solid Murphy.

quote: how on earth can they get into such strife over what would seem to me to be nothing more than the equivalent of US congressional confirmation hearings?

US Congressmen are at least elected – EU Comissioners are not – and there’s the problem.

And they never really achieve anything against the powerful member states – Italy for example have a level of compliance that would seem to make their membership of the EU in name only (no wonder Finbar loves it). And the UK uses it’s opt-outs and veto freely. In fact the day the Franco-German axis eliminates the veto is the day we pull the parachute.

If you want an example – just look at the European Working time directive. You will see little proof of it being in effect in the UK. But technically it is law here even so.

	02-11-2004 15:43									#406
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quote: Not quite – I could have called you a Bath fan. Or Welsh.

Are there Welsh Bath fans?

	02-11-2004 16:48									#407
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quote: Originally posted by LDiCesare Are there Welsh Bath fans?

Now if that doesn't light Havak's fuse, nothing will.

	02-11-2004 16:59									#408
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quote: Originally posted by Havak And which of us is which of them? To strangle English Grammar.

Well, I wouldn't trust Tamerlin with lyrics, so I guess that makes you Mick and him Keef. Still, I can see you on Jerry Hall's arm, and I can see Tamerlin with an IV drip of vodka and a carton of Marlboro in his mouth.

quote: Yes it sits ‘above’ as such – and in theory it now answers to the Parliament only in that they have to approve it’s initial appointment. It’s one of the least democratic aspects of the EU and something even Tamerlin couldn’t sell in a month of Sundays. I believe each incoming President of the EU assembles a Commission based on names put forward by each member state – hence Tony putting his old mate Mandy on the gravy train. The big countries expect the prime portfolios – and that Italian homophobic chauvinist was due to be commissioner for Justice. You couldn’t write a better script were it a movie?

What a bizarre system. So what's the purpose of the Euro Parliament? Not to run the Union? The commission does? If so, what's the purpose of the Parliament?

quote: I think the article I linked pointed out that the parliament has only recently been given the power to ‘rubber stamp’ these crony posts – and used it to flex their muscles for the first time ever. They did this in the only way they were allowed to – rejecting the entire line up the incoming president put forward. If I am wrong Tamerlin will no doubt correct me.

I think you're right. That's pretty much what I read here.

quote: And they never really achieve anything against the powerful member states – Italy for example have a level of compliance that would seem to make their membership of the EU in name only (no wonder Finbar loves it).

But that's Italy! Italians, and I mean the everyday Italians, live their lives regardless of who governs them, regardless of the Pope, regardless of everything. That's what I love about the place. Life goes on, and bugger whomever happens to be in authority. Unlike this country. You can't escape the effects of the government in this country. Which is why I'm leaving.

	02-11-2004 22:59									#409
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quote: So what's the purpose of the Euro Parliament? Not to run the Union?

To not govern? They do pass some laws. I once saw on TV an example of how a law would be passed. It would take asround one year to get it ready, with lots of votes, amendments, work by people in Brussels and in the Parliament, and end up with either nothing or a text that member states wouldn't apply. I'm quite confident in the future for that reason. We can hardly make something more useless.

	03-11-2004 03:37									#410
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Mmmm. Looking at it from this distance, it seems to be a system that will always be tied in knots by self-interest. Understandable, in a way, with so many nations putting their own priorities first. Maybe the EU is one of those nice ideas that will struggle to work in practice.

	03-11-2004 04:03									#411
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Gloucester wing James Simpson-Daniel has been ruled out of England's clash with Canada with a hamstring injury.

Opening up an opportunity for someone who can tackle.

	03-11-2004 05:07									#412
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quote: Originally posted by Havak US Congressmen are at least elected – EU Comissioners are not – and there’s the problem.

Slight misunderstanding.
US confirmation hearings (if I have the correct term) are held by the US congress to confirm/reject the appointed officials of the executive branch - Presidential advisors/government heads, etc - in essence exactly the same way your elected EU MP's are confirming/rejecting the unelected candidates for the EU watchamacallit.
Importantly though, in the US case it isn't an all-or-none situation, and if a particular candidate is rejected it isn't the end of the entire group.
Seems like a pretty bizarre system to me.
I can partly understand why it came about - preventing the bureaucratic nightmare of confirming/rejecting every one individually but I would've thought member states had already resigned themselves to such a fate with the whole EU deal anyway.

quote: And they never really achieve anything against the powerful member states – Italy for example have a level of compliance that would seem to make their membership of the EU in name only (no wonder Finbar loves it). And the UK uses it’s opt-outs and veto freely. In fact the day the Franco-German axis eliminates the veto is the day we pull the parachute.

Well, quite. Wouldn't want those lesser nations to get the feeling that they actually have a serious say in self governance now would we?
Wouldn't have been much point in conquering them in the first place otherwise ..

	03-11-2004 05:08									#413
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quote: Originally posted by finbar Zinzan ravagon!

Catchy!

	03-11-2004 05:13									#414
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quote: Originally posted by LDiCesare To not govern? They do pass some laws. I once saw on TV an example of how a law would be passed. It would take asround one year to get it ready, with lots of votes, amendments, work by people in Brussels and in the Parliament, and end up with either nothing or a text that member states wouldn't apply. I'm quite confident in the future for that reason. We can hardly make something more useless.

So the EU parliament is, in essence, solely a legislative branch?
Now how on earth did the whole EU put their collective heads together and come up with the US government as a model for a new Europe?

	03-11-2004 17:27									#415
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quote: Are there Welsh Bath fans?

The serious answer is ‘yes’ – the West Country is pretty close to the border. But my own personal answer would be it’s too hard to tell the difference – both bleat about their woeful rugby sides.

quote: and I can see Tamerlin with an IV drip of vodka and a carton of Marlboro in his mouth.

He installed the web cam then?

quote: it seems to be a system that will always be tied in knots by self-interest.

In a way I would like to expand that to discuss the situation over is the US – but I’m off site this afternoon so will have to pick that up tomorrow.

quote: Opening up an opportunity for someone who can tackle.

Not at all – with Lewsey fit again he was never going to play ahead of Josh or Benny boy.

quote: Seems like a pretty bizarre system to me.

I did misunderstand your point on Congress.

And as for the EU system ‘Bizarre’ sums it up nicely. German order, Italian flare, French style all in the mix – but they should have run it past British common sense as well. After all out parliament is really sensible (security still wear tights and sword belts).

quote: but I would've thought member states had already resigned themselves to such a fate with the whole EU deal anyway.

Only the weak willed ones. The UK is still using the ‘make the world England’ edict of George I.

quote: Wouldn't have been much point in conquering them in the first place otherwise ..

Well quite – and when we do give you a choice just look at what you elect (and again the US issue niggles at me for comment – must resist!).

Still our Lizzie is the Aussie head of state in OZ isn’t she?

	03-11-2004 18:06									#416
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Still our Lizzie is the Aussie head of state in OZ isn’t she?

The software wouldn't let me use anymore!

	04-11-2004 00:06									#417
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quote: Originally posted by finbar ... and I can see Tamerlin with an IV drip of vodka and a carton of Marlboro in his mouth.

You are not so far from the truth, I am just recovering from a long (november the first is a holiday in France) and very tough week-end which did not let me any time for Apolyton. I must admit that I currently don't have the time (read "I am too lazy at this moment") to answer the Euro-babble you have produced this week. The questions are rather complex and needs some thought...

And George "Witless" Bush for four more years does not improve the lot...

	04-11-2004 01:03									#418
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Yes but consider this Finbar - Lizzie as head of state or Howard as President?



*Finbar searches for ways to increase smiley limits*

	04-11-2004 02:10									#419
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quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin You are not so far from the truth, I am just recovering from a long (november the first is a holiday in France) and very tough week-end which did not let me any time for Apolyton. I must admit that I currently don't have the time (read "I am too lazy at this moment") to answer the Euro-babble you have produced this week. The questions are rather complex and needs some thought...

Bullsh*t! The whole EU thing is a typically European cocktail of ideas and intentions doomed to failure because self-interest will forever be paramount.

quote: And George "Witless" Bush for four more years does not improve the lot...

I'm fleeing Australia for Italy to avoid John Howard - to where do I flee to avoid Witless!?

	04-11-2004 02:12									#420
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Yes but consider this Finbar - Lizzie as head of state or Howard as President?

I'm all for installing Howard as President. The words President and assassination have an historical link.

quote: *Finbar searches for ways to increase smiley limits*

Stupid Greek/Canadian site software!