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Proteus_MST
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuciwalker
quote:
Originally posted by Oncle Boris
Again, no debate about universals here. From a common sense perspective, just like 99.9% of people can know what is a dog, a cat, a tree. |
"Common sense"?
Common sense used to say blacks weren't people, they were just fit to be slaves - I mean, they're so primitive and everything.
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An Embryo is no Person on the reasoning that it doesn´t possess a developed CNS and therefore ist doesn´t perceive the world around it, or react to external stimulations, as well as it very probably doesn´t possess own thoughts/feeling.
For a fetus it is much more complicated as this stage includes the development of the Nervous System, but I think at the early stages lso a fetus could be considered as a non person.
For blacks (after birth of course  ) those things are different as they don´t differ from whites, except for their black skin colour.
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Oncle Boris
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Once in a brown moon
Aug 2001
time: 00:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuciwalker
quote:
Originally posted by Oncle Boris
Again, no debate about universals here. From a common sense perspective, just like 99.9% of people can know what is a dog, a cat, a tree. |
"Common sense"?
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And this was a very irrational stance to have, as clearly the functioning of a black individual are in all regards identical to that of a white one.
I still maintain my point, that someone who in the 19th century who thought himself as being able to make the distinction between dog breeds, trees, etc, would have, using the same intellectual patterns, easily been able to assert the belonging of black and white men to the same specy.
So your attack was based on a misunderstanding - unconsciously voluntary, I suppose - of the term 'common sense'. I was not referring to the content prescribed by common sense at X given time, but rather was pointing out some (commonly shared) cognitive processes.
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How can you show them to be "rational" if they're unproven and dogmatic? |
Even mathematical statements are dogmatic, everything is. It's just that some things, like the theory of relativity, linguistic theories, or philosophically complex moral theories appear to use the tools given to reason in a more plausible and acceptable way than other things such as creationism or ethos of strict religious obedience.
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Heresson
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of frogs
Jun 2000
time: 06:20
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quote:
Originally posted by MikeH
It's not anti-Catholic, it's just that European governments are moving with the times and the Catholic leaders aren't - although many Catholics are. |
Moral values are not being changed by time
Your point is one of the less intelligent points anti-clerical people make
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Why? Poland can chose not to join the EU if they care that much. The EU should priorotize equal human rights to all its members-screw the religious opinions of other individuals.
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So, killing unborned children is a "human right"?
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The argument that Europe at large is anti-catholic reminds me of Heresson's argument that France enforces a State-atheism, because their is no public religious education
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Not because of that. Because it teaches about religion kind of like You teach about the insides of a frog, and because it forbids religious symbols at schools, and because it claims clergy should not have any political significance, and because it protested against mentioning the role of Christianity in forming the European identity...
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Assuming they are even moderately intelligent, it seems a reasonable supposition.
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So You can only be even moderately intelligent, if You are atheist or theist?
Bravo, what a show of religious tolerance.
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Actually, would they not be under the control of Islam? Or some sort of centralizing eastern potentate?
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No Christianity = no Islam
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Catholics are allowed to be against abortions, and therefore never procure an abortion.
But they just shouldn³Ó try to enforce their beliefs on others and try with force, to hinder other people from procuring abortions for themselves.
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In such matters like murder, they should enforce their beliefs on others I believe.
Because it's not a personal matter, the decision doesn't concern the women or her boyfriend (or the guy she met one night) only, but also the child, which has to be protected by the law.
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and heir of the defender of christian faith in the 30-years war King Gustav II Adolf
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You mean a defender of one version of this religion and a great pillager
I'd write more, but must be going now.
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Proteus_MST
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quote:
Originally posted by Heresson
quote:
Catholics are allowed to be against abortions, and therefore never procure an abortion.
But they just shouldn´t try to enforce their beliefs on others and try with force, to hinder other people from procuring abortions for themselves.
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In such matters like murder, they should enforce their beliefs on others I believe.
Because it's not a personal matter, the decision doesn't concern the women or her boyfriend (or the guy she met one night) only, but also the child, which has to be protected by the law.
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The Question is, if Embryos/Fetusses are to be considered Persons. I think, that´s the only thing where Opinions diverge.
If you consider an Embryo to be no Person, an abortion is not considered to be murder.
(Here are my thoughts about it:
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...984#post3376984 )
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22-10-2004 00:09
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