 |
|
Tingkai
|
|
To find the Northwest Passage
Aug 2001
time: 13:19
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Provost Harrison
It is amazing how mature some 14 year olds are. You have to judge each situation on it's merits. |
But if we believe that a law is necessary to protect the young from older sexual predators then that law cannot be based on individual situations. It must be based on the general situation.
In general, the vast majority of 14-year-olds are not mature. They lack the ability to think about certain concepts.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Zevico
|
|
Melbourne
Apr 2002
time: 15:19
|
|
Wow. 14 years old and having sex. Nothing going that far in my school (although apparently about one third of my year takes marijuana).
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Gibsie
|
 |
all over the proverbial shop
Jan 1970
time: 05:19
|
|
Whew, interesting thread to read during my lunch hour 
Anyway, just to clear some stuff up...
quote:
And why is that? Some religios believe? |
No, not at all. There's just something inside me that says 14 year old girls having sex isn't right. But, it is somewhat irrational, as I think I said; the reason I don't think 14 year-olds should have sex is because they're not as mature, ready or able to deal with the consequences of sex as older people. HOWEVER, not every 14 year-old is like this.
As the guy commented to me, he didn't know her age when he started dating her, and although I did, I do think she seems well above herage, physically and mentally. But not so muchas to excuse a sexual relationship.
About the guy, he's not an increidble loser or a paedophile, as far as I know. I was quite taken aback at his words, because they didn't seem like him. I never thought that he would actually be having sex with a 14 year-old, it doesn't seem like him. He seems quite confused, as as well as saying that he prefers "getting in there and sorting things out himself" over BJ's from the girl, he said he wouldn't have hot monkey sex with a girl younger than 16 years. But then he added that if he got along well enough with her - and they claim to be in love with each other - then he'd go for it.
But does this call for interference? I doubt I could do anything without alienating everyone, him, her, our friends, anyway...
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Tom201
|
|
Amsterdam
Dec 2001
time: 05:19
|
|
Do you mean with "consequences of sex" pregnancy or something else?
|
|
| |
|
|
|
devilmunchkin
|
|
first circle of the inferno
Jul 2001
time: 05:19
|
|
here's a new quandry:
teenage pregnancy.
if the girl is living at her parent's house and get's pregnant, should she move out? to what extent to her parents have repsonsibility for her child? and what if her parents have other children living in the home? isn't that unfair to do to them just because some girl can't take her birth control normally? SHould she be made to give it up for adoption? abortion?
specific situation: the girl hasn't graduated from high school; in fact, she's dropped out. her abusive boyfriend that she refuses to break up with also is a drop out and never works..no job. he mooches of her, who in turn steals from her dad...who just takes it despite the fact that he has 6 other children! what about them? They're pro-life, and after moving out for awhile, the girl returns home and announces to the household that she's pregnant, and takes on the front that everyone will just have to deal with it. Her father is angry, but he never puts his foot down with her. THis girl will be 18 in july. Does anyone have the right to step in? If so, in what way.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Tingkai
|
|
To find the Northwest Passage
Aug 2001
time: 13:19
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Gibsie
But does this call for interference? I doubt I could do anything without alienating everyone, him, her, our friends, anyway... |
The real question is what is the right thing to do?
I think you need to tell him:
a) what he is doing is illegal and could get him thrown in jail (assuming this is true)
b) What he is doing is morally wrong (assuming you believe that)
If you don't tell him what you think then you are passively condoning it.
From my perspective, if you stand by and do nothing while a friend does something that you believe is wrong then you are a partner in the crime.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Dr Strangelove
|
|
What is a 21 year old doing running in the same social circles as a 14 year old? The 21 year old is the one who should be mature enough to make the decisions. As an older, more mature person he has an obligation to protect her, i.e., by staying ther heck out of her honey pot!
I don't forsee a good conclusion to this union. He may get tired of her, in which case she will feel abused more so than if her boyfriend were closer to her age and she could at least rationalise the failure as being due to his immaturity. She may get tired or leery of him, in which case, given the disparity between them, she may have more trouble pulling away without getting physically hurt. She may get pregnant. Pregnancies at her age are likely to be difficult. He may leave her if she gets pregnant. Worse would be if he decided to not leave her, because it is extremely unlikely that a guy his age who dates junior high school girls is emotionally stable enough to make a stable life partner.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Dr Strangelove
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Tingkai
But if we believe that a law is necessary to protect the young from older sexual predators then that law cannot be based on individual situations. It must be based on the general situation.
In general, the vast majority of 14-year-olds are not mature. They lack the ability to think about certain concepts. |
And in general the majority of adults who would pursue a 14-year-old are not mature. This case seems a perfect opportunity for law enforcement intervention.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Dr Strangelove
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Tom201
The Law is rather based on when or when not a teenager is able to make his/her own decisions.
When you look at other laws, concerning responsibility limits, its very reasonable. A child of 10 for example cant be charged for shoplifting. While there is a law, that from the age of 14 you are able to sign minor (privat) business contracts. Additionally you get in trouble for criminal activity.
I think this limits also should apply for other issues. Why isnt a teenager able to make decissions on sex, when he can on business stuff? |
In the US a 14 year old would need a court order in order to be allowed to sign contracts without his parent's permission. Oh, Oh, I know, perhaps this girl and guy can make an appearence at court before they ****. They're welcome to come over here.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Dr Strangelove
|
|
In my almost 20 years of practice I have encountered quite a few mothers under the age of 15. In every case the girl wound up unmarried and living with her mother. I can not recall a case in which the girl came from a family with two parents at home. Among those cases where I had some contact with the family for several years in all cases the girl eventually abandoned her child, usually leaving it in the care of the mother's mother. I might add that this situation is not only almost the rule for girls who give birth when younger than 16, but also applies to the majority of girls who get pregnant when younger than 18. I would also like to point out that the younger the girl is, the less likely the couple are to have used contraception.
In practice then, sexual involvement with a young teen girl is blatantly unfair to everyone involved, with the possible exception of the guy who gets his ya-ya's off. The girl gets her entire life disrupted and will have to live her entire life with the memory of the baby she abandoned. This minor girl, who so very much needs the assistance of her mother, will lose this assistance when she escapes her situation. The baby will of course be severely disadvantaged. Even if the grandmother keeps him/her at first he/she is likely to eventually be placed in foster care at some point or to be bounced around from family member to family member. It's unfair to the girl's mother, who having almost reached the end of her child caring responsibility, winds up being forced to take on the care of a child she didn't want. It's unfair to you and me, who in all likelihood will wind up contributing more to the kid's care than the stud ever will.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Tom201
|
|
Amsterdam
Dec 2001
time: 05:19
|
|
Interesting you bring up teenage pregnacy. I wrote already something about it in this thread, here the quote:
The rate on teenage pregnacies in the UK (which has restrictive laws on sex) is far higher, compared to the Netherlands.
Countrys with resitrictive laws on sexual themes have also a restrictive society. From my (admited very short) experience in the UK (was there in a exchange family about 6 years ago), its a big tabu to speak with his parents about sex. It is an issue to buy condoms as a minor. And if you do the shopowner is very unfriendly and looks at you, like you did a big sin or whatever. That happend both 2 times I went there on diffrent places for condoms. The info about sex comes from hearsay.
So I think its save to say that its easier in the netherlands for teens to get: a) the info and knowledge and b) the possibilties for pregnancy prevention.
And that links to the general, sex laws and atitude in these countrys.
You see restrictive laws are counterproductive to prevent teenage pregnacies.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Dr Strangelove
|
|
SO what if they looked at you! Maybe you're paranoid!
You're argument is quite flawed. Is it possible that the UK has more restrictive laws because the rate of teen pregnancy is higher? Maybe there are other reasons why teen prgnancy is more common. Could it be that UK teens are simply more sexually active? Perhaps this is a result of an underlying differnece in the cultures. Maybe there is still enough old German morality left in the Netherlands that Dutch teens just aren't doing it as often as UK teens. The Netherlands is a smaller, more compact country. This could have an effect on teen activities. In order to validate your conclusion that sexual repression leads to higher rates of teen pregnancy you're going to do a lot more research. You will at least need to compare rates of sexual activity in the two countries, then find some data on sexual attitudes in the two. Are UK teens more interested in having intercourse than Dutch teens? If so, why? Your conclusion only applies if you can show that the higher rate of prgnancy in the UK is attributable to the lack of access to contraception or that UK teens engage in sex largely to flaunt the laws and /or common morals of the country.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Tom201
|
|
Amsterdam
Dec 2001
time: 05:19
|
|
I think its quite logic, that it is not as easy for a teenager to go buy condoms in a country where it is illegal to have sex his age, than in a country where it is legal.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Dr Strangelove
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Gibsie
And I think we get the point Strangeloev, teenage pregnancies = not good. But, altohugh teenage pregnancy happens more often than we'd like, I don't think we should be taking it as a given that it will happen to the girl... |
Actually there is a one-in-five chance that it will happen with each instance of intercourse. You'd think that the ratio would be closer to one-in-thirty, but most people abstain during the menestrual period and it is also established that girls are more likely to be interested in having sex near the time of ovulation.
Even if it isn't a given you should acknowledge the possibility and be willing to accept the consequences.
|
|
| |
All times are GMT. The time now is 05:19.
Apolyton Time is 00:19. |
top of page
|
| archivepost |
|
Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
|
HTML code is ON
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON
|
|
|
|
|
|
27-04-2002 16:53
And if someone with a relationship with a younger girl comes to your neighborhood, what you gonna do? Beat him up? If thats the way you try to enforce you personal Morals, I feel sorry for you.
|